Montana Marv Posted January 30, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 19 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 3,135 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 1,091 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 30, 2016 1 minute ago, thereselittleflower said: Jesus didn't say this is something that will happen, but something that did happen, and in the context of what the 70 came back and reported, how they had power over demons. I don't see anything prophetic in his words here. This was something Jesus saw had happened. Then Satan is not in heaven accusing the saints day and night and Jesus is not needed as an advocate to the Father. In Christ Montana Marv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thereselittleflower Posted January 30, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 58 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 5,457 Content Per Day: 1.69 Reputation: 4,220 Days Won: 37 Joined: 07/01/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted January 30, 2016 20 minutes ago, Montana Marv said: Then Satan is not in heaven accusing the saints day and night and Jesus is not needed as an advocate to the Father. In Christ Montana Marv I don't see the necessity of one for the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sister Posted January 30, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 17 Topic Count: 50 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,727 Content Per Day: 1.04 Reputation: 2,305 Days Won: 5 Joined: 06/29/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted January 30, 2016 Ok here's another one to throw into the mix! When Jesus just rose from the dead, he had one witness (Mary Magdalene). John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. Jesus had not yet ascended to our Father, which is why Mary couldn't touch him, but told Mary to tell the others he ascends to his Father. Then later that evening Jesus met with the 11 apostles. Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. So Jesus rose from the dead, Mary witnessed, then he ascended to the Father (IN HEAVEN) and by evening time he was back with the apostles and they were allowed to touch him, so obviously he had returned from his Father. 1st Witness: Mary. Jesus tells her not to touch him for he has to ascend to the Father first. Next Witness: The 11 apostles. Said Jesus allowed them to handle him that same evening. Jesus' alibi that day: In the tomb talking to Mary, then telling her to tell the others that he had to go away for a while and to tell the others he ascends to his Father, and will meet them later that day. Conclusion according to these facts: It's highly possible Jesus was the one who ordered Satan and his angels be cast out of heaven between the hours of leaving the earth and returning in that same day. Authority was given to him that day of his glory in heaven and there was no reason why he couldn't use it straight away. Clarification; Revelation 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. Revelation 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, Revelation 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezra Posted January 30, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.34 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted January 30, 2016 49 minutes ago, Sister said: It's highly possible Jesus was the one who ordered Satan and his angels be cast out of heaven between the hours of leaving the earth and returning in that same day. Where did you come up with this? Satan was cast out of God's Heaven at the time he led a rebellion in Heaven. That was when he was Lucifer. Revelation 12 is describing a future event, when the "prince of the power of the air" and his evil angels are cast out of the atmosphere and stratosphere and CAST DOWN TO EARTH. Ever since the Fall, the evil angels have been influencing world events and evil deeds on earth, but their abode is in the air, since they are spirit beings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sister Posted January 31, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 17 Topic Count: 50 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,727 Content Per Day: 1.04 Reputation: 2,305 Days Won: 5 Joined: 06/29/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted January 31, 2016 Ezra Quote Where did you come up with this? Umm, I got this from the scriptures, where else? I just quoted those scriptures showing the scenario that day he rose. Can you prove the scenario is in error or it doesn't matter? I have never heard in all my years anyone ever declaring this same fact I just brought to the table, but the opposite, avoidance, and I am wondering why this is so? To me it's such a big deal what Jesus possibly accomplished in a matter of hours. Can you address this fact first please? Fact or fiction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted January 31, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.10 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted January 31, 2016 8 hours ago, Sister said: Ok here's another one to throw into the mix! 1st Witness: Mary. Jesus tells her not to touch him for he has to ascend to the Father first. Next Witness: The 11 apostles. Said Jesus allowed them to handle him that same evening. Jesus' alibi that day: In the tomb talking to Mary, then telling her to tell the others that he had to go away for a while and to tell the others he ascends to his Father, and will meet them later that day. Conclusion according to these facts: It's highly possible Jesus was the one who ordered Satan and his angels be cast out of heaven between the hours of leaving the earth and returning in that same day. Authority was given to him that day of his glory in heaven and there was no reason why he couldn't use it straight away. Are we going to wild speculation now or what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningGlory Posted January 31, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.10 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted January 31, 2016 14 hours ago, Watching for Jesus said: You said that Satan will be cast out of heaven after the seventh trumpet. Do you believe this because the sounding of the seventh trumpet is shown in Chapter 11, and Satan being cast out is shown in Chapter 12? Probably yes; it would seem to be logical. I would see no reason to have something occur, then the seventh trumpet sounds, and THEN write it in reverse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezra Posted January 31, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.34 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted January 31, 2016 59 minutes ago, Sister said: Ezra Umm, I got this from the scriptures, where else? I just quoted those scriptures showing the scenario that day he rose. Can you prove the scenario is in error or it doesn't matter? I have never heard in all my years anyone ever declaring this same fact I just brought to the table, but the opposite, avoidance, and I am wondering why this is so? To me it's such a big deal what Jesus possibly accomplished in a matter of hours. Can you address this fact first please? Fact or fiction? Since the Scriptures you quoted have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with Satan and his evil angels, you have given us a fictitious explanation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted January 31, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,135 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,560 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted January 31, 2016 20 hours ago, Sister said: So Jesus rose from the dead, Mary witnessed, then he ascended to the Father (IN HEAVEN) and by evening time he was back with the apostles and they were allowed to touch him, so obviously he had returned from his Father. 1st Witness: Mary. Jesus tells her not to touch him for he has to ascend to the Father first. Next Witness: The 11 apostles. Said Jesus allowed them to handle him that same evening. Jesus' alibi that day: In the tomb talking to Mary, then telling her to tell the others that he had to go away for a while and to tell the others he ascends to his Father, and will meet them later that day. Conclusion according to these facts: It's highly possible Jesus was the one who ordered Satan and his angels be cast out of heaven between the hours of leaving the earth and returning in that same day. Authority was given to him that day of his glory in heaven and there was no reason why he couldn't use it straight away Agree wholly with your recount of events and your logic, but not your final conclusion. The reason Jesus was not to be touched before he ascended this first time was because he was still unclean. He still carried the sins of mankind upon himself. So he had to first have his atoning blood be accepted upon the heavenly altar for himself, to be made clean: Heb. 9:12 ...and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, He entered the holy place once, having [himself] obtained eternal redemption. The Greek verb for "having obtained" is in the middle voice: "The middle voice indicates the subject performing an action upon himself (reflexive action) or for his own benefit." BLB This fit the pattern on the Day of Atonement for when the High Priest offered the first blood of atonement in the Holy of Holies for himself and his priestly family. Only secondly did he offer blood for the sins of the people. We are still awaiting his second return from that second offering, as Heb. 9:28 tells us: "he will appear a second time..." 20 hours ago, Sister said: Clarification; Revelation 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne. Revelation 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, Revelation 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. Rev. 12:10 ...for the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night, has been cast down. 11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death." The manchild of Rev. 12 is not Christ, the manchild is Christ's End Time apostles. They participate in the casting down of Satan and his angels from heaven. So Satan is yet to be cast down; Jesus did not do it when he ascended after his resurrection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sister Posted January 31, 2016 Group: Royal Member Followers: 17 Topic Count: 50 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,727 Content Per Day: 1.04 Reputation: 2,305 Days Won: 5 Joined: 06/29/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted January 31, 2016 Hi William Thanks for that. I see it as Jesus wanted the Father to be the first one he united with, but let Mary see him only for a witness to go and tell the others. I don't believe he was unclean, because he just conquered death. He was raised perfect. 1 Corinthians 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: It says "man child". Singular. Satan went after Jesus using Herod before he was born and just after. That man child grew. We know Jesus was caught up to the Father just after he rose from the dead. Jesus said just before he was crucified; John 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. He didn't mean, right now, but very soon in a few days. Do you really think that God would let Satan still have access to heaven after killing the Son of Man? That means heaven in which we trust in has corruption still existing in there. Doesn't sound right. Makes more sense that it's been cleaned up and everything there remains holy. Hebrews 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, Hebrews 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, Hebrews 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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