Who said , Grace covers all of the law of Moses ?

[Ezra]

1 hour ago, SINNERSAVED said:

Hello Ezra, are you stating facts or opinions or scripture here ,

Those are Bible facts SS, but before you make any further comments, please go back and study the New Testament very diligently. I have summed up in a few words that you are treading on thin ice because you have no clue about the finished work of Christ.  No offence, but that is evident from your posts.

[SINNERSAVED]

1 minute ago, Ezra said:

Those are Bible facts SS, but before you make any further comments, please go back and study the New Testament very diligently. I have summed up in a few words that you are treading on thin ice because you have no clue about the finished work of Christ.  No offence, but that is evident from your posts.

thank you Ezra, okay lets try to clear this  up for you say I do not know the bible, and I think you are thinking that I am wrong in my statement, . so lets try to work this out and be able to reason, and see where the proof is of, what you are saying, scripture God instructs His people swine is unclean, animal, and so that would probably means,that, it is not considered a animal or meat or a source of food, to be eaten,

 second most jewish people do not eat pork or swine, and it would be for this reason, it is in the torah or Gods Law !!

not even most muslims eat swine, and I believe it is also , what they consider un clean, not to be eaten, not a source of food !!

 in the Vision of the sheet with all of the animals in acts 10-peter says I have not let any unclean animal touch his lips.

 so I would also say that in the new testament, after Christ, that His apostles up held the dietary law as valid, yes ?

for that scripture was a example to bring in the gentiles into the fold and really had nothing to do with food, period !!!

 what defiles a man is not what goes in but what comes out of his mouth from his thoughts and his heart , for what goes in comes out, ?

 but we are talking what is establish as meat source given for food as clean and not unclean, ?

so we still hold on to the law of the dietary system, it has not changed, ,

we are told that all is allowed if it is blessed prior to eating, it does not say about unclean meat , or swine ,forbidden by God in his instruction to arron and moses,

 and Jesus says I come not to abolish the law, and the prophets, but to fulfill it, and not one tittle or jot, will be touched, nor anything added or taken away  of the word,

 in Isaiah 66, tells about the abomination of the one behind the tree eating swines flesh ?

 so from the start to the finish from genesis, to the end it is Gods instruction, and so who or how has made this okay, for only God,

is able to give us the law,, now grace, covers what the law was not able, and that is the LAW OF SIN AND DEATH ,

and the CEREMONY LAW for jeshua has paid it all and there is no need for anymore sacrifices, it was finished and nailed to the cross, and so we are saved by grace from death and our sins, so Jesus stated in His own words I did not come to abolish the law,!!!

this is truth, and it is scriptural, now am I wrong, , I made it clear and showed the evidence of what supports this,

blessings brother, ,,,let me know what you think...

 

 

 

[Your closest friendnt]

12 hours ago, SINNERSAVED said:

Grace is Given and Grace always was, the law, is not gone, and it is not removed and covered by grace, for where the law could not complete , Grace was fulfilled, but this does not excuse us from the law, and I do not see , why people say that the grace is taken over in place of the law, for we have the laws or commandments now written in our hearts and minds, so if we follow the word of God and the bible, How do we take away any of it ?

 this is not what the truth is, and many are saying which I don't understand, if we are under the law, then we go to Hell, for grace, is over shadowed the law, and we curse our selves, if some one could help explain this, to me, for it makes no sense, at all, we were given the law and the commandments, and then new testament came, and so we throw out the old and bring in the new, this is not what the bible or the scriptures tell us,

any ideas and comments to back this up , I would like to learn , and see what and how anyone came up with this?

 for all is valid, the law the commandments,  gods instruction, and His grace, where there is Sin, Gods grace abounds even more, so we cannot be cursed by following the law of old, for it is the base and foundation, that is set for the blessing and the grace, to stand on, all scripture is for instruction, and for our understanding, and none to be removed, or done away with,

 Jesus tells us He did not come to abolish the law, or the prophets, and nothing is to be change ,added or removed, of the word of God, given to us, by God, and Jesus came to fulfill, not take away

He really made it more intense, by saying if you think it, it needs to be dealt with , in stead of just actions,

 so it is a mind, and thought process, that we need to deal with

 for we usually will think out a problem or situation prior to anything on it, and if God knows my thoughts and my heart, then I believe , everyword of God that we say is truth is truth ?, and so if our minds are focused, then our hearts will be focused also , and the bible is true, all of it, and not just some of it, I don't think we would throw away the old testament and just, live the new, ? for the old, tells us future and about the new,

blessings and peace,,

I am surprise at your belief that there are two  judges for us in heaven, one is Jesus Christ, and the other one is Moses.

Moses judges according to the things of the Law, " the Lord Moses", and Jesus judges us according to his Grace, (what ever that is at the moment)

The Lord of Lords Jesus,

minus one Lordship that belongs to Moses, 

I need some time to digest this one. 

Jesus is Love, and I understand why you going in that path, it is not easy to understand the love of God.

The dept, the width and the high

But if you need to be in that mind set,?that you will have a special blessing of God, you are not the only one, and I don't blame you.

Many of us have the light from above that we can have a special blessing from God, without waiting to built those works of the flesh to receive this special blessing.

So please do not judge those who have acknowledge this special blessing that comes at the very beginning, just like the first letter of the alphabet.

But if you believe that you need to reach the letter omega for this blessing and live through the agony and uncertainty of that trip, 

I have something to tell you, which will remind you of Paul,

Why go through the labour and pain of earning what you already have by GRACE. 

I am not judging you either ways,

Only I am concern that you are judging the children of your Lord. 

From your own words, let us save them from going to Hell, all those church goers, believers of Jesus Christ, who thing they are saved by grace, and are still walking in some works of the flesh, like eating Halal or not kosher products. 

And the vegaterians, who can not be part of the priesthood, caused to be a priest you must eat every day  a lot of meat.

And do not forget the women, and the special place they have in the law of Moses. Why do you involve them in conversation, don't you know what the Law has to say about that. 

[SINNERSAVED]

Genesis 7:2 Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.

Leviticus 11:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,

Leviticus 11:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.

Leviticus 11:3 Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat.

Leviticus 11:4 Nevertheless these shall ye not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the hoof: as the camel, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.

Leviticus 11:5 And the coney, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.

Leviticus 11:6 And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he is unclean unto you.

Leviticus 11:7 And the swine, though he divide the hoof, and be clovenfooted, yet he cheweth not the cud; he is unclean to you.

Leviticus 11:8 Of their flesh shall ye not eat, and their carcase shall ye not touch; they are unclean to you.

Leviticus 11:9 These shall ye eat of all that are in the waters: whatsoever hath fins and scales in the waters, in the seas, and in the rivers, them shall ye eat.

Leviticus 11:10 And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, and in the rivers, of all that move in the waters, and of any living thing which is in the waters, they shall be an abomination unto you:

Leviticus 11:11 They shall be even an abomination unto you; ye shall not eat of their flesh, but ye shall have their carcases in abomination.

Leviticus 11:12 Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.

Leviticus 11:13 And these are they which ye shall have in abomination among the fowls; they shall not be eaten, they are an abomination: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,

Leviticus 11:14 And the vulture, and the kite after his kind;

Leviticus 11:15 Every raven after his kind;

Leviticus 11:16 And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,

Leviticus 11:17 And the little owl, and the cormorant, and the great owl,

Leviticus 11:18 And the swan, and the pelican, and the gier eagle,

Leviticus 11:19 And the stork, the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.

Leviticus 11:20 All fowls that creep, going upon all four, shall be an abomination unto you.

Leviticus 11:21 Yet these may ye eat of every flying creeping thing that goeth upon all four, which have legs above their feet, to leap withal upon the earth;

Leviticus 11:22 Even these of them ye may eat; the locust after his kind, and the bald locust after his kind, and the beetle after his kind, and the grasshopper after his kind.

Leviticus 11:23 But all other flying creeping things, which have four feet, shall be an abomination unto you.

Leviticus 11:24 And for these ye shall be unclean: whosoever toucheth the carcase of them shall be unclean until the even.

Leviticus 11:25 And whosoever beareth ought of the carcase of them shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even.

Leviticus 11:26 The carcases of every beast which divideth the hoof, and is not clovenfooted, nor cheweth the cud, are unclean unto you: every one that toucheth them shall be unclean.

Leviticus 11:27 And whatsoever goeth upon his paws, among all manner of beasts that go on all four, those are unclean unto you: whoso toucheth their carcase shall be unclean until the even.

Leviticus 11:28 And he that beareth the carcase of them shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even: they are unclean unto you.

Leviticus 11:29 These also shall be unclean unto you among the creeping things that creep upon the earth; the weasel, and the mouse, and the tortoise after his kind,

Leviticus 11:30 And the ferret, and the chameleon, and the lizard, and the snail, and the mole.

Leviticus 11:31 These are unclean to you among all that creep: whosoever doth touch them, when they be dead, shall be unclean until the even.

Leviticus 11:32 And upon whatsoever any of them, when they are dead, doth fall, it shall be unclean; whether it be any vessel of wood, or raiment, or skin, or sack, whatsoever vessel it be, wherein any work is done, it must be put into water, and it shall be unclean until the even; so it shall be cleansed.

Leviticus 11:33 And every earthen vessel, whereinto any of them falleth, whatsoever is in it shall be unclean; and ye shall break it.

Leviticus 11:34 Of all meat which may be eaten, that on which such water cometh shall be unclean: and all drink that may be drunk in every such vessel shall be unclean.

Leviticus 11:35 And every thing whereupon any part of their carcase falleth shall be unclean; whether it be oven, or ranges for pots, they shall be broken down: for they are unclean, and shall be unclean unto you.

Leviticus 11:36 Nevertheless a fountain or pit, wherein there is plenty of water, shall be clean: but that which toucheth their carcase shall be unclean.

Leviticus 11:37 And if any part of their carcase fall upon any sowing seed which is to be sown, it shall be clean.

Leviticus 11:38 But if any water be put upon the seed, and any part of their carcase fall thereon, it shall be unclean unto you.

Leviticus 11:39 And if any beast, of which ye may eat, die; he that toucheth the carcase thereof shall be unclean until the even.

Leviticus 11:40 And he that eateth of the carcase of it shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even: he also that beareth the carcase of it shall wash his clothes, and be unclean until the even.

Leviticus 11:41 And every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth shall be an abomination; it shall not be eaten.

Leviticus 11:42 Whatsoever goeth upon the belly, and whatsoever goeth upon all four, or whatsoever hath more feet among all creeping things that creep upon the earth, them ye shall not eat; for they are an abomination.

Leviticus 11:43 Ye shall not make yourselves abominable with any creeping thing that creepeth, neither shall ye make yourselves unclean with them, that ye should be defiled thereby.

Leviticus 11:44 For I am the LORD your God: ye shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and ye shall be holy; for I am holy: neither shall ye defile yourselves with any manner of creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Leviticus 11:45 For I am the LORD that bringeth you up out of the land of Egypt, to be your God: ye shall therefore be holy, for I am holy.

Leviticus 11:46 This is the law of the beasts, and of the fowl, and of every living creature that moveth in the waters, and of every creature that creepeth upon the earth:

Leviticus 11:47 To make a difference between the unclean and the clean, and between the beast that may be eaten and the beast that may not be eaten.

Acts 10:10 And he became very hungry, and would have eaten: but while they made ready, he fell into a trance,

Acts 10:11 And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth:

Acts 10:12 Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air.

Acts 10:13 And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat.

Acts 10:14 But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.

Acts 10:15 And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.

Isaiah 66:15 For, behold, the LORD will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Isaiah 66:16 For by fire and by his sword will the LORD plead with all flesh: and the slain of the LORD shall be many.

Isaiah 66:17 They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD.

here is scripture to validate my view, and to show that it is not done away with, scripture is from the KJV, blessings I hope this helps to understand what I see in scripture .

 so God commands us not to touch or eat what is not clean, where does it ever say it is okay and we can eat all the bacon, and pork chops today, ?? Grace did not come to make God go back on His word, this is truth , and scripture in context, no assumptions, and no guessing, it is given to us by God,

[SINNERSAVED]

18 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

I am surprise at your belief that there are two  judges for us in heaven, one is Jesus Christ, and the other one is Moses.

Moses judges according to the things of the Law, " the Lord Moses", and Jesus judges us according to his Grace, (what ever that is at the moment)

The Lord of Lords Jesus,

minus one Lordship that belongs to Moses, 

I need some time to digest this one. 

Jesus is Love, and I understand why you going in that path, it is not easy to understand the love of God.

The dept, the width and the high

But if you need to be in that mind set,?that you will have a special blessing of God, you are not the only one, and I don't blame you.

Many of us have the light from above that we can have a special blessing from God, without waiting to built those works of the flesh to receive this special blessing.

So please do not judge those who have acknowledge this special blessing that comes at the very beginning, just like the first letter of the alphabet.

But if you believe that you need to reach the letter omega for this blessing and live through the agony and uncertainty of that trip, 

I have something to tell you, which will remind you of Paul,

Why go through the labour and pain of earning what you already have by GRACE. 

I am not judging you either ways,

Only I am concern that you are judging the children of your Lord. 

From your own words, let us save them from going to Hell, all those church goers, believers of Jesus Christ, who thing they are saved by grace, and are still walking in some works of the flesh, like eating Halal or not kosher products. 

And the vegaterians, who can not be part of the priesthood, caused to be a priest you must eat every day  a lot of meat.

And do not forget the women, and the special place they have in the law of Moses. Why do you involve them in conversation, don't you know what the Law has to say about that. 

you have misunderstood my intentions, and so let me give you a couple of things to show you what is on my heart and mind,

 I am not trying to get any special treatment or work my way into heaven , for I know we have grace and grace covers my sins, and has brought me from death , to life, in Christ Jesus that is our savior,

 so , also I am a sinner saved by grave, I am sinner saved, so I am no special person , I am just a humble person, that has a great passion for God, and I try my best to live the way God wants us to live, and to treat others and to reflect Gods love out to other people, for we are living examples of gods workmanship, with the holy spirit , and our lights to shine in a dark and evil world,  we are told we are to be the salt and the light in the world,

 we are told to follow Jesus we are to deny our selves surrender to Him and repent , and be forgiven, of our sins ,

 we are told to go out and preach the word to everyone and let them, know that God loves us, and He loves you, we are to humble our selves to the lord , and delight in the meditation of His words and spirit and to be one with Him, to be righteous and not of the world , to know that God provides and we are unable to go to heaven by our own works,

 I believe as the next person, the beast I can with the scriptures and the word of God as my guide, and with the knowledge and devotion to the word and study, I want to share with others to show , what I believe and why I believe, and to produce good fruit , and to dwell in the fruits of the spirits,

 but what I am doing here with the following of the dietary laws, is not something new, ??

 it is making my self to obey what God has instructed to us, and nothing more, we are the temple of God and the holy spirit dwells with in us, and we are to keep our temples holy , and that is to watch what we say to be nice, to lend a hand to the needed , and to eat what we are allowed and not eat what is forbidden or unclean, and by doing this ,

 it is being obedient to the word of God, for even fasting is a great thing to do , and I will start to do that for it is good for the body and for the spiritual mind, and to train the body of no food, and not live to eat, but to eat to live, so there is many things as believers we are to be doing , its not about sitting around talking scripture and not doing anything to be like Christ and to follow what we have learned in His teachings, we are to be following Gods laws and commandments and instructions, , and know we are saved by grace, so it is complete, and to get the self into the place of righteousness and holy as God is holy, it is not about who is better then who , or who is smarter,

 but with all respect, it is about being obedient to God !!!

 and so a topic like this makes people angry and hateful , and say things like I think I am better then others, when its only the truth and many do not want to hear the truth , I am not judging anyone, I am standing up for the what the scripture literally says, that is Gods word, so please if you see that I have spoken out of line, and not brought you the truth in this thread , please show me, for it is truth , and scripture and its Gods word , not mind, I have shown the scriptures and I have proven my case, this is what we are to bel;ieve,

 every word of God and to follow the bible? and to follow what we are told, this is not sinnersaved doctrine, its Gods doctrine,

blessings to you , and peace, thank you brother

[Your closest friendnt]

I have something to tell, I keep for later on, 

Sharing information: some of those clean animals you are referring to are fed with proteins from unclean animals. Do you think they are clean.

I want to wander, when Jesus comes back, will he try some of our  international cuisines. Or he will judge his Chinese children, or some of native children who thank him daylly for the abundance of meat of some of those animals you call unclean.

When they invite him to dinner, will he honor them and eat with them, if the only meat they have is camel meat, and the milk is also the most nutritious milk in the world, and they grew up with that. 

Did he drink goat's milk, when he was here on earth.

Get ready to bring the Leviticus and  let him read the title. 

Will you be happy in heaven without the book of Leviticus. 

[saved34]

SS, you cannot pick and choose what to follow from God's law. If the dietary laws are to be followed, then all the law must be followed. Scripture does not distinguish what parts of the law to follow:

"Galatians 3:10 NIV
For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.”

Further more it is considered a doctrine of demons to forbid certain meats from being eaten.

"1 Timothy 4:3 NIV
They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth."

Under the new covenant, we are under no such dietary regulations. If a brother wants to abstain from swine in the name of the Lord he can freely do so, but he should not judge his brothers or sisters who do eat pork or any other meat. 

"Colossians 2:16 NIV
Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day."

"14 Accept the one whose faith is weak, without quarreling over disputable matters. [2] One person's faith allows them to eat anything, but another, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. [3] The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them. [4] 4 Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand."

 

[saved34]

Also a good rule of thumb when studying the Old Testament or even the Gospels is to look at them in light of Christ's finished work. Only then will the true unfolding of truth occur. 

"12 Therefore, since we have such a hope, we are very bold. [13] We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to prevent the Israelites from seeing the end of what was passing away. [14] But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away. [15] Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. [16] 16 But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away"

[SINNERSAVED]

2 minutes ago, saved34 said:

SS, you cannot pick and choose what to follow from God's law. If the dietary laws are to be followed, then all the law must be followed. Scripture does not distinguish what parts of the law to follow:

"Galatians 3:10 NIV
For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.”

Further more it is considered a doctrine of demons to forbid certain meats from being eaten.

"1 Timothy 4:3 NIV
They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth."

Under the new covenant, we are under no such dietary regulations. If a brother wants to abstain from swine in the name of the Lord he can freely do so, but he should not judge his brothers or sisters who do eat pork or any other meat. 

"Colossians 2:16 NIV
Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day."

"14 Accept the one whose faith is weak, without quarreling over disputable matters. [2] One person's faith allows them to eat anything, but another, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. [3] The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt the one who does not, and the one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them. [4] 4 Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand."

 

I totally understand what you are saying , but you are out of context, and you are saying that the law is no more, how can you say that, and you say I cannot say what is ?

 this is about scripture and truth , you cannot place me in the doctrines of demons on this, have you read what I wrote,

 gods law. and grace. what it is and what it is not, you have to be clear on it, and I know where it is, you are saying that the torah and the old testament is voided and out, and grace covers everything, this is not what scripture is saying ,

 I am not judging , and I never did judge any one, it is about what God instruction is to His people ?

 so if I am wrong prove to me and show me scripture for what you just gave is not about what I have shown in scripture ?

 

[SINNERSAVED]

3 minutes ago, saved34 said:

Also a good rule of thumb when studying the Old Testament or even the Gospels is to look at them in light of Christ's finished work. Only then will the true unfolding of truth occur. 

"12 Therefore, since we have such a hope, we are very bold. [13] We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to prevent the Israelites from seeing the end of what was passing away. [14] But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away. [15] Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. [16] 16 But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away"

read the scriptures that I posted  and it is God talking to the people, now if I continue to follow as he instructed the people I am not held guilty at all, for it is what God has told us, and if we toss it , then we are picking and choosing what we are going to have and not have from the bible,

 or so how do you suggest to be a better servant to God, other then trying to follow Him, if we do nothing and say grace covers and we have no need to lift a finger, is this following God ?