Jesus abolished principle "Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth."?

[Ogner]

28 minutes ago, Joline said:

Better to be wronged than to judge by the law. Because ,With what measure you judge you will be judged and those that live by the law will be judged by the same. Issues between members of the Church should keep it within the Church...That is how I see it.

Do you think If you choose not to judge righteous judgment others you will not be judged by God's law?

For example, if burglar not to judge righteous judgment others he will not be accused of thievery? 

You really believe that?

[Guest shiloh357]

On ‎5‎/‎30‎/‎2016 at 8:23 PM, Ogner said:

Should Christians Sue?

That should be decided on a case by case basis.  Christians should not sue frivolously.  But Christians are no less deserving of justice than anyone else.  I see no problem with Christians filing civil suits where there are large damages and the other part refuses to pay what they legally owe.  Otherwise, we become a doormat and people simply take advantage of us at every turn. 

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Ogner said:

Do you think If you choose not to judge righteous judgment others you will not be judged by God's law?

For example, if burglar not to judge righteous judgment others he will not be accused of thievery? 

You really believe that?

Ogner, did you actually read my post?

I said, these issues concern issues among the body of Christ. How we are to deal with those of our own members which sin against us.........Let those which are unbelievers be judged by civil law. what do we have to do with that? But how we deal with a fellow member is an attempt to reconcile them. If the offender OF OUR OWN MEMBER repents, we are to forgive..........

You can see this same in the law IMO. Moses several times had to have a sinful member be exposed, in order to have victory, because there was sin in the camp.

[Guest shiloh357]

I think that it should be pointed out that when Paul says we are not to take other Christians to court, he was talking about not airing our in house disputes and letting them be decided by unrighteous magistrates, that was particularly true in Corinth where every judge was corrupt. We need to settle our affairs in house when it comes to disputes in a church.  

That does not mean that if you suffer damage from someone you don't know, such as in a car accident and you are not the one at fault, that you cannot take that person  to court simply because they are a Christian.   Otherwise, you can see how that could be used as a manipulative loophole to get out of paying what one legally owes.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

That should be decided on a case by case basis.  Christians should not sue frivolously.  But Christians are no less deserving of justice than anyone else.  I see no problem with Christians filing civil suits where there are large damages and the other part refuses to pay what they legally owe.  Otherwise, we become a doormat and people simply take advantage of us at every turn. 

Some of the passages concern how we deal with our own members, not those outside.

The analogy above addresses no such particulars.

Jas 5:20  Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Dealing with sin among ourselves is an attempt to do just that.
 

[Guest shiloh357]

3 minutes ago, Joline said:

Some of the passages concern how we deal with our own members, not those outside.

The analogy above addresses no such particulars.

Jas 5:20  Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Dealing with sin among ourselves is an attempt to do just that.
 

I agree.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, shiloh357 said:

I agree.

Ok, thanks.

Here is what I am thinking. Either the member repents and  makes restitution, or the member refuses to repent and is severed from the body and placed outside the body. then a believer can take them to civil court.

[Ogner]

1 hour ago, Joline said:

Ogner, did you actually read my post?

I said, these issues concern issues among the body of Christ. How we are to deal with those of our own members which sin against us.........Let those which are unbelievers be judged by civil law. what do we have to do with that? But how we deal with a fellow member is an attempt to reconcile them. If the offender OF OUR OWN MEMBER repents, we are to forgive..........

You can see this same in the law IMO. Moses several times had to have a sinful member be exposed, in order to have victory, because there was sin in the camp.

OK, so let me get this right. You don't believe that if burglar not to judge others he will not be accused of thievery. He will be accused of thievery.

And you agree with me what more generally Jesus say, "Judge not according to appearance, but judge righteous judgment. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.  If you do not judge others, your heavenly Father will not be judge between you and your abuser. When people take a neutral stand between you and your abuser, they are in effect abandoning you. If you do not judge others, and you will not be judged. And that's bad. "

Is that right? 

 

Edited June 3, 2016 by Ogner

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, Ogner said:

OK, so let me get this right. You don't believe that if burglar not to judge others he will not be accused of thievery. You believe than You believe be accused of thievery.

And you agree with me what more generally Jesus say, "Judge not according to appearance, but judge righteous judgment. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.  If you do not judge others, your heavenly Father will not be judge between you and your abuser. When people take a neutral stand between you and your abuser, they are in effect abandoning you. If you do not judge others, and you will not be judged. And that's bad. "

Is that right? 

 

Ogner I honestly tried to be a clear as I know how. A burgler yes can be taken to a civil court.

The one sinning against his fellow believer will also be judged, but not outside the body of believers FIRST.

If he repents he can be restored and make restitution in repentance. If not, sever that one from the body and let him deal his sin through civil judgement if need be.

We are commanded to obey civil law. Can we harbor a criminal according to civil law? No we cannot.

An example of that would be the Catholic Church harboring illegal aliens. that ought not be done.

[Guest shiloh357]

1 hour ago, Joline said:

Ok, thanks.

Here is what I am thinking. Either the member repents and  makes restitution, or the member refuses to repent and is severed from the body and placed outside the body. then a believer can take them to civil court.

By using the phase "severed from the body"  I assume you mean disfellowshipped from a particular congregation?   What if the offending party is not a member of your congregation?