What can we learn from the virtuous woman Proverbs 31

[OLAJIDE JOHNSON]

Hard working woman that love God,kind  support the family. her family

[Serving]

13 hours ago, Sister said:

 Psalms 48:1   Great is the LORD, and greatly to be praised in the city of our God, in the mountain of his holiness.

  Psalms 48:2   Beautiful for situation, the joy of the whole earth, is mount Zion, on the sides of the north, the city of the great King.

  Psalms 48:3   God is known in her palaces for a refuge.

 Psalms 48:8   As we have heard, so have we seen in the city of the LORD of hosts, in the city of our God: God will establish it for ever. Selah.

  Psalms 48:9   We have thought of thy lovingkindness, O God, in the midst of thy temple.

  Psalms 48:10   According to thy name, O God, so is thy praise unto the ends of the earth: thy right hand is full of righteousness.

  Psalms 48:11   Let mount Zion rejoice, let the daughters of Judah be glad, because of thy judgments.

  Psalms 48:12   Walk about Zion, and go round about her: tell the towers thereof.

  Psalms 48:13   Mark ye well her bulwarks, consider her palaces; that ye may tell it to the generation following.

  Psalms 48:14   For this God is our God for ever and ever: he will be our guide

Hi Sister,

I think what you have interpreted is just fine.

We know God's written word quite often has a literal and spiritual meaning, and in this case it could be so .. you might be on to something here.

What spoke to me when I looked over the chapter, besides the whole theme of the virtuous wife,  were a few interesting verses that just didn't seem right for the times it was written .. nor would have been normal practice in those times at all .. that is, the wife having charge over all house affairs, chiefly, her work practises, which were extremely out of the norm for women of those times and in that culture & above all else, her command over purchasing of property .. this is just unheard of in that culture unless she were of the elite class and a widow .. otherwise, it was the man's domain .. and if the husband were letting his wife do those things in his place, he would surely be mocked and derided for letting a woman usurp his CULTURAL role .. very interesting indeed.

Here is that verse in particular (just one example out of several that spoke to me too) ..  16 She considereth a field, and buyeth it: with the fruit of her hands she planteth a vineyard.

This so called "woman", I have noticed,  within this chapters theme, well .. "she" is doing ALL of the work .. ALL of her husbands CULTURAL EXPECTATIONS are usurped by this "wife" .. this husband would be a mockery IF it were literal without a doubt, he certainly would NOT be accepted amongst the elders of the land (v23) IF all that was written about "her" were literal .. no, not at all.

And what you have discerned is NOT without precedent either .. just one small example is WISDOM .. how God likens "her" to a woman and how "she"is described with very literal sounding overtones UNTIL one realises God is NOT speaking about a woman at all, but is instead speaking about WISDOM and describes "her" as though He were describing a real woman, just like the discernment of chapt 31 you have discerned.

And of course Zion .. God likens "her" to a woman too .. but how many "learned" discern these things are unfortunately FEW .. 

So yes .. you have discerned well in my opinion, and, as i said, could be onto something here for sure .. It certainly has caught my attention too.

God bless. 

Edited September 12, 2016 by Serving

[Ezra]

1 hour ago, Davida said:

I think you guys must belong to the same group there in Australia.

Living Down Under does seem to have an adverse effect!

[Sister]

7 hours ago, Davida said:

You two share a  very strange convoluted view of this Proverb ---which when read as I do seems to be literally  very straightforward.  I think you guys must belong to the same group there in Australia. No offence guys , but I cannot make heads or tails out that post or your interpretation.

Davida

God speaks of his woman throughout all the  scriptures.  His woman is Zion.  She's spiritual, not real, but resembles God's city where there is truth and salvtion.  God has also shown us Satan's woman, the harlot in Rev, she's spiritual also and often mentioned throughout the scriptures. She's in charge of her city.  Men dwell in either city.  We are called to come out of Babylon, and spiritually dwell in Zion.  When I read this proverb, I connected to the deeper side of what he is showing us, and connected the dots.  God is showing us his city, his woman.  Many don't know about Zion, and who she is.  They are totally confused.  In God's city is wisdom.  His woman is loyal to him and her household.  Satan's woman on the other hand is not, and she cares not for her children, nor has she a husband.

All you have to do is seek the scriptures, and you will find out who Zion is, and then the parable will really speak to you.  I'm not here to fight.  Just to share.  Wisdom is with God's woman and the glory is his.

Psalms 9:11   Sing praises to the LORD, which dwelleth in Zion: declare among the people his doings.

Psalms 20:2   Send thee help from the sanctuary, and strengthen thee out of Zion;

Psalms 50:2   Out of Zion, the perfection of beauty, God hath shined.

 Psalms 87:1   His foundation is in the holy mountains.
 
 Psalms 87:3   Glorious things are spoken of thee, O city of God. Selah.
 Psalms 87:4   I will make mention of Rahab and Babylon to them that know me: behold Philistia, and Tyre, with Ethiopia; this man was born there.
 Psalms 87:5   And of Zion it shall be said, This and that man was born in her: and the highest himself shall establish her.
 Psalms 87:6   The LORD shall count, when he writeth up the people, that this man was born there. Selah.

  Revelation 12:5   And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

That same woman who (spiritually) brought forth Christ, will also bring forth other children at the resurrection, those that have been dwelling spiritually with her and have learn't from her, will be in that resurrection.  They will be dressed for the wedding, adorned as a bride with the clothing this woman makes, which is their covering, truth, and righteousness.

[Sister]

2 hours ago, Davida said:

Hi Sister,

When the LORD is speaking of Zion it is Zion.  This Proverb imo, does not have to do with Zion.

Davida

How would you describe Zion?

[Sister]

Thank you Serving.

Quote

What spoke to me when I looked over the chapter, besides the whole theme of the virtuous wife,  were a few interesting verses that just didn't seem right for the times it was written .. nor would have been normal practice in those times at all .. that is, the wife having charge over all house affairs, chiefly, her work practises, which were extremely out of the norm for women of those times and in that culture & above all else, her command over purchasing of property .. this is just unheard of in that culture unless she were of the elite class and a widow .. otherwise, it was the man's domain .. and if the husband were letting his wife do those things in his place, he would surely be mocked and derided for letting a woman usurp his CULTURAL role .. very interesting indeed.

That's right, this is one hard working woman with a huge responsibility!  What's her husband doing? watching the football?  No because her husband is God, and he's describing truth as a loyal bond between him and his Word, the truth. 

One thing no one realises is that there is NO RECORD of King Lemuel.  He doesn't exist, there is no lineage, so he's not a real KING of this world, but a heavenly KING, and we know him by another name....Emmanuel, Jesus, ...or the Word of God, and nobody picks this up or even blinks an eye.  This proverb is a parable.  His mother in this parable is Zion, which he was "born" out of - that City of truth.

 Proverbs 31:1   The words of king Lemuel, the prophecy that his mother taught him.

His mother said to him?

Proverbs 31:2   What, my son? and what, the son of my womb? and what, the son of my vows?

Zion in Rev 12 brought forth a man child.  This is him, Christ, ...King Lemuel.  It's a proverb many forget, we won't understand this proverb if we don't know who Zion is or the man child.

Proverbs 31:3   Give not thy strength unto women, nor thy ways to that which destroyeth kings.

Proverbs 31:4   It is not for kings, O Lemuel, it is not for kings to drink wine; nor for princes strong drink:

Straight away, I knew what "she" was speaking about, for I already read and understood what strong drink mean's in God's lingo;

 Isaiah 5:22   Woe unto them that are mighty to drink wine, and men of strength to mingle strong drink:

 Isaiah 24:9   They shall not drink wine with a song; strong drink shall be bitter to them that drink it.

 Isaiah 28:7   But they also have erred through wine, and through strong drink are out of the way; the priest and the prophet have erred through strong drink, they are swallowed up of wine, they are out of the way through strong drink; they err in vision, they stumble in judgment.

 Isaiah 28:8   For all tables are full of vomit and filthiness, so that there is no place clean.
 

Men of strength = men in power....leaders.....Kings and princes

Strong drink = false teachings

Our King Christ has not mingled strong drink, because he was sent to give pure TRUTH, true teachings out of Zion which his "mother" taught him (metaphorically). These teachings are not corrupted.

Proverbs 31:5   Lest they drink, and forget the law, and pervert the judgment of any of the afflicted.

Proverbs 31:6   Give strong drink unto him that is ready to perish, and wine unto those that be of heavy hearts.

Proverbs 31:7   Let him drink, and forget his poverty, and remember his misery no more.

Strong drink (polluted teachings) are ONLY given to those who are ready to PERISH, ....for God sees inside the heart.  If the heart is not right, he WILL NOT FEED us with THE TRUE DOCTRINE, but let us be as drunkards and forget our shame.

  Revelation 3:17   Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

 

Proverbs 31:8   Open thy mouth for the dumb in the cause of all such as are appointed to destruction.

 Isaiah 28:11   For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.

  Isaiah 28:13   But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.

The Word of God will speak, but to "them", his Word they will not understand.  They are blocked from truth, those ready to perish.

But to us who dwellin Zion;
Proverbs 31:9   Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.

Luke 4:18   The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,

 

Isaiah 28:9   Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.

Isaiah 28:10   For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

For them dwelling in Zion and obeying all the commandments knowledge shall be given.  Deep knowledge.  God will show us "his" Woman and what it means to be dwelling in Zion where we will be fed and clothed spiritually. It all depends on our state of heart, if we are true and actually take heed to everything commanded and expected of us.  Knowledge is not given to hypocrites, nor do they have a place in Zion.  I am sure you know all this, but I explain it for them.

 

 

Edited September 13, 2016 by Sister

[Sister]

33 minutes ago, Davida said:

For starters , Zion is not a virtuous woman. It depends what scripture you are referring and what context it is.

I know you like to teach Sister but do you realize that the Bible says teachers are held to tougher judgment? It is serious business , so if your motive and aim is to teach you might want to rethink it . Discussing and asking sincere questions is different.

“Not many of you should become teachers, my brothers, for you know that we who teach will be judged with greater strictness” (James 3:1).

Davida

We are having a discussion.  We can only speak truth or error.  You are all confused with what I am talking about and have no idea what I am saying. I am trying to explain it better so you can understand and I can defend my point of view by backing it up with scripture.  Not only am I giving scripture, but explaining what I get out of it, for anyone can quote scripture.

Yes I am well aware of the harsher punishments for those who teach lies.  I am God fearing Davida, I HATE lies which is why I love the truth.  There are so many things that many here don't mention or are unaware of.  They are BIG things to me, things I have rejoiced about when discovering, but to others they have no interest, and because they never heard of it explained this way before, they feel the need to mock or scare me off, or call it false.  So far not one person has told me WHY this could not be speaking about Zion with a reason why.  I dont want to be the only one discussing, I like a little bit of a feed back also with why I could be wrong and hear your point of views.  I get that you don't agree with me and think I'm mad, but at least when you read through the scriptures, next time you see God referring to a woman in a good way, or a bad way, you may recall this conversation, and take more note that he uses symbolism alot, where there is a real meaning behind it.  You are teaching also that this proverb is literal, but you havn't given a reason why.  What's the difference between me and you?  One of us is explaining our view with back-up and one of us is just making a statement with nothing to back it up.  I would like you to back it up that's all and tell me why I am wrong.

 

[Sister]

23 minutes ago, Davida said:

Sounds like a Cult Sister.

Davida

This is what I mean.  Did you not read the scriptures I posted?  God gives knowledge, and God can hold back.  It's up to him.  I didn't write that, God said that himself.  Wisdom is rarer than rubies, and God doesn't just hand out wisdom willy nilly.  We have to work for it, to find it, by seeking out of a pure heart, and he will give.  It's for our own benefit.  If I am going to be punished here for trying to encourage all of you to seek these treasures by dwelling in Zion spiritually, then where is equity?  Is it not God's kingdom I am encouraging all to go to where there is truth where wisdom can be found?, and that this City really exists spiritually?  I am not boasting of myself, for all wisdom comes from God, but I am boasting of his City that he speaks about so much in the scriptures, and how much we should want it.

Proverbs 8:11   For wisdom is better than rubies; and all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it.

 

[Sister]

4 hours ago, Davida said:

It sounds to me that you think you possess a deeper knowledge that God has given you. And  that people have to go through spiritual hoops before God reveals His Truth. You said, "we have to work for it"  THis is Not what the Bible teaches. What type of a Church do you belong to?

Davida, it's not about me ok, but God is the one who we should be glorifying for he is the one who gives truth.  Wisdom is found in his Word and the truth is offered to all of us.  By working for it I mean seeking the scriptures.  Reading, learning, and applying what he taught us.  The truth doesn't come out of the air, but comes from his Word delivered to us.  That's where the jewels are hidden.  Seek and ye shall find.

I don't belong to any church, nor have I ever.  My only qualifications were being a sinner and looking for this mercy that Jesus spoke of.  When I started reading, I couldn't stop, I still can't.  I am blown away by everything written in the scriptures.  I love the Word of God with all my heart, and am so grateful that he showed me his path.  I intend on following it the best I can until the day I day, for he is my life now, and my life means nothing without him.  He has taught me so much, how much I didn't know previously, and i've pondered on things I heard him speak through the scriptures, and some of it took years to understand, and I am still learning, and discovering things all the time.  But it's not about me, but about what God can give us.  I see it like this in his warnings -  We have been sitting on our eggs and our eggs have been stolen from under us without us even knowing.  We have been robbed of our treasures and no one even blinks an eye.

 

[angels4u]

1 hour ago, Sister said:

Davida, it's not about me ok, but God is the one who we should be glorifying for he is the one who gives truth.  Wisdom is found in his Word and the truth is offered to all of us.  By working for it I mean seeking the scriptures.  Reading, learning, and applying what he taught us.  The truth doesn't come out of the air, but comes from his Word delivered to us.  That's where the jewels are hidden.  Seek and ye shall find.

I don't belong to any church, nor have I ever.  My only qualifications were being a sinner and looking for this mercy that Jesus spoke of.  When I started reading, I couldn't stop, I still can't.  I am blown away by everything written in the scriptures.  I love the Word of God with all my heart, and am so grateful that he showed me his path.  I intend on following it the best I can until the day I day, for he is my life now, and my life means nothing without him.  He has taught me so much, how much I didn't know previously, and i've pondered on things I heard him speak through the scriptures, and some of it took years to understand, and I am still learning, and discovering things all the time.  But it's not about me, but about what God can give us.  I see it like this in his warnings -  We have been sitting on our eggs and our eggs have been stolen from under us without us even knowing.  We have been robbed of our treasures and no one even blinks an eye.

 

5

 

Sister, I'm so glad that you love the Lord with your heart ,soul and mind and that you search the scripture, but the most important thing is that we realize that God is Holy and that He did give His Son to die for us and that he did give us the Holy Spirit to help us ,guide us and teach us on out travel,did you found Jesus as your God?

We can study read and all other things but if we don't realize that Jesus and the Holy Spirit are God , our faith will be count loss .

What is more, I consider everything a loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them garbage, that I may gain Christ

Phillipians 3:8

Is Jesus your Lord your God?