Zach Posted January 1, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 227 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 150 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/18/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 1, 2017 6 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: Well the Jews are not our plumline for determining truth. Most Messianic Jews view the New Testament as Torah. I agree with them. If the NT is not Scripture, then it is not inspired and as such it's accuracy cannot be guaranteed and neither can any of it claims. It cannot be relied upon, we would have no guarantee that the words of Jesus are truthfully recorded. We would have no guarantee that any of the events purported in the Gospels and Acts are historical or actually happened. And the ultimate end result of that is that we have no assurance of salvation, and no hope for the future. There is no hope for a future return of Jesus or a millennial Kingdom or a New Heaven or New Earth. If we take your approach, the NT is just a bunch of letters or writings and not much else. There is nothing in it we could anchor our hearts to and nothing authoritative. If I take your approach, I have nothing to hope for, and nothing to really believe in because the New Testament would have no more value than an Alfred Hitchcock novel or a cookbook or fictional novel. Why would I want what you have, or rather what you don't have? I reject your unchristian, unbiblical approach and I believe an affirm the New Testament as Scripture. It has all of the same earmarks of Scripture that the OT has. I choose to believe God. That's what real believers do. Wow, That sure turned to dodo quick! Hey you don't want to comprehend what I've repeatedly said, that's fine, it doesn't bother me. But it would be unwise for me to continue on this subject only to be further ridiculed when you won't address the issue. I leave you with this; Study for yourself how Jews (who gave you your Old Testament btw) viewed the Torah, Nevilem, Ketivium also the Talmud- Mishnah, Germara. After you have really come to an understanding on this, then perhaps you'll comprehend my position on the New Testament. Shalom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 15 minutes ago, Zach said: Wow, That sure turned to dodo quick! Hey you don't want to comprehend what I've repeatedly said, that's fine, it doesn't bother me. But it would be unwise for me to continue on this subject only to be further ridiculed when you won't address the issue. I leave you with this; Study for yourself how Jews (who gave you your Old Testament btw) viewed the Torah, Nevilem, Ketivium also the Talmud- Mishnah, Germara. After you have really come to an understanding on this, then perhaps you'll comprehend my position on the New Testament. Shalom I don't need to do any such thing. I don't need to comprehend your position on the New Testament. I have a complete Bible and it is Scripture from cover to cover and I can read it clearly for myself. I reject your approach, as I have said. You haven't been ridiculed. You have been refuted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zach Posted January 1, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 227 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 150 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/18/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 1, 2017 16 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: I don't need to do any such thing. I don't need to comprehend your position on the New Testament. I have a complete Bible and it is Scripture from cover to cover and I can read it clearly for myself. I reject your approach, as I have said. You haven't been ridiculed. You have been refuted. Don't forget to board up your doors and widows, put your fingers in your ears and hum as loud as you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 11 minutes ago, Zach said: Don't forget to board up your doors and widows, put your fingers in your ears and hum as loud as you can. I am open to the Holy Spirit and I hear Him just fine. I will listen to him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_S Posted January 1, 2017 Group: Servant Followers: 25 Topic Count: 275 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 5,208 Content Per Day: 1.00 Reputation: 1,893 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/02/2010 Status: Offline Share Posted January 1, 2017 Hi Zach, A quick question... 9 minutes ago, Zach said: Don't forget to board up your doors and widows, put your fingers in your ears and hum as loud as you can. What purpose does this post serve? I realize you're a new member, but our terms of service is pretty explicit on this point: Quote Debate the subject, not the person. It is possible to disagree about a doctrine or subject under discussion without insulting the person with whom you are debating. Also remember that the fact that a person disagrees with you does not mean they are attacking you as a person. Respect each other in the love of God! This is the main reason that threads get stopped, shut down, and even deleted! Users that cannot respect others will be banned. (Lev. 19:18) Your post has basically nothing to do with the subject, it has to do with another member. Please be mindful of this when posting in the future, as it's the sort of thing that gets people removed from threads. If you feel someone is attacking you, please feel free to use the report feature. God bless, Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zach Posted January 1, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 227 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 150 Days Won: 1 Joined: 12/18/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 1, 2017 16 minutes ago, shiloh357 said: I am open to the Holy Spirit and I hear Him just fine. I will listen to him I can't argue with that, there's 33 to 33,000 (depending on who you talk to) denominations doing just that. But if you really are, you'll be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Patriot21 Posted January 1, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 28 Topic Count: 338 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 15,710 Content Per Day: 2.46 Reputation: 8,526 Days Won: 39 Joined: 10/25/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/27/1985 Share Posted January 1, 2017 10 minutes ago, eileenhat said: You have to realize first that the real issue here is our indoctrination into the Beast system quagmire. If you do not realize that we have been lied to at every level, then hearing someone state, with certainly, the Earth is flat, sounds like nonsense. Does it make any difference in your feelings about God?, should be your first reason to explore this more thoroughly. It only took a minute to sink in the ramifications for a firmament existing here. Suddenly, the entire Bible makes sense. The abyss references, make sense. God sitting in heaven, with Earth as his foot stool make sense. Visions I have received of an actual Heaven (and not some crazed person's fantasies of it) made sense. It seemed right on top of us and very real. Not like anything I've ever heard. And the stars really close by (just thousands of miles, not millions). It was endless all the dominoes that fell in place once I realize God our father was real and living right above us. You make some good points, however you destroy them by saying the earth is flat. It is, without a doubt a globe. That is a 110% verifiable fact. The flat earth theory is bad science that is not only disproven by science but by the Bible itself. See unlike evolution, the earth being a globe is a verifiable and irrefutable fact, and Christians only discredit themselves by pushing such nonsense. How are you going to get people to believe modern science is wrong about evolution-something that is not verifiable or repeatable, and believe you about creation, which again, since you were not there is not repeatable or verifiable, when you can't even get the one fact which is verifiable right. I mean all you got to do is get in a commercial airliner and look out the window and see that your wrong. Now, I have side tracked enough. If you want to debate this insane theory then I am open to a soapbox debate with you. Otherwise, back to the matter at hand. I will not respond anymore on this matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Patriot21 Posted January 3, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 28 Topic Count: 338 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 15,710 Content Per Day: 2.46 Reputation: 8,526 Days Won: 39 Joined: 10/25/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/27/1985 Share Posted January 3, 2017 1 hour ago, eileenhat said: I took down my post because as you rightly stated it was not the thread's topic. I was just stating how I feel from years of in depth research and of course, if you are not interested, I understand. Other's however might be, but you labeled it 'an insane' theory, which is another way to keep people from checking it out for themselves. Is there any reason to keep people from their own interests? It is a fools task to any try. I did put out an offer to an soapbox debate, the offer is still there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opportunitykenny Posted January 3, 2017 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 149 Content Per Day: 0.04 Reputation: 40 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/27/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/16/1980 Share Posted January 3, 2017 On Thursday, December 29, 2016 at 3:23 PM, ruck1b said: First let me begin by saying I know this is a touchy subject but it is my hope that this brings thoughtful and thought provoking discussion. If you feel that this topic is too touchy for you I ask that you do not participate in it. Now to the questions. For those that believe the Bible to be the Word of God, what do you mean by that? Bible is truly and reliably God's Word. The men used by God to write it were inspired by God and filled with God's Spirit. These people were messengers with God's messages to people created by God. For you to understand and comprehend God's words, you only need one important THING: Holy Spirit. God's words are not science or human logic but God's words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruck1b Posted January 3, 2017 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 0 Topic Count: 24 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 352 Content Per Day: 0.11 Reputation: 128 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/18/2015 Status: Offline Author Share Posted January 3, 2017 (edited) On 12/30/2016 at 2:45 PM, shiloh357 said: You're penciling something into the text that isn't there. Nothing in that text says that a slave is allowed to be beaten within an inch of its life. You are adding to Scriptures. Nothing in the text says that a slave is allowed to be beaten within an inch of his/her life eh? The text plainly states that if a slave is beaten and survives a couple days its okay because the slave is property. I'm not adding a thing, that's what "scripture" says. No way around that. This issue displays a problem that you attempted to dance around with some fluff explanation, now its outright denial. Edited January 3, 2017 by ruck1b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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