simplejeff Posted June 5, 2017 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 12 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,689 Content Per Day: 2.38 Reputation: 2 Days Won: 20 Joined: 06/30/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted June 5, 2017 On 4/24/2017 at 9:27 PM, warrior12 said: Revelation 17 gives a description of Mystery Babylon the great with her goldern cup and who the kings of the earth committed fornication and the inhabitants of the earth got drunk of the wine of her fornication. When did she appear in history and is she doing the above today. Well, i think it is obvious she is in the world today as she would be destroyed in the end time scenario. But how are the kings committing fornication and how are the inhabitants getting drunk with the wine of her fornication. Is is spiritual seduction, lust for worldly goods and treasures or others. what are your thoughts and some examples. Certainliy it has been going on for centuries already, many centuries. The revelation of truth was published long ago, and has not changed. (only there is much , much, much more deception today - multitudes of fairytales accepted as if truth, and lies taking the place of truth while truth is rejected.) Who has had the ear of the kings, the presidents, the prime ministers, the warlords, the kremlin(or whatever is over there now), the rulers of Germany, Britain, African countries, Asian countries , and so on ? (for generations) With so much power in their pocket, that is how , as God said it would be, they have deceived the whole world, all the leaders (with almost no exceptions), and almost all of the religious leaders, socialist/socialites/ scientists, financiers (all the 'big' money), educators, and so forth ..... And they have actively squished God's people, and suppressed truth, every chance , everywhere it is possible to do, in every country..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior12 Posted June 5, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 54 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,429 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,516 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 5, 2017 (edited) OK guys. I'll tell you what. I asked the original question and i got a lot of replies and others who conversed with one another. I have to catch up with the thread and get a full picture of everyone as each seem to have a different spin. I have some insights in the spiritual aspects that cannot be changed and that is my own witness. Now the historical and Biblical revelation i am not studied as i should and is therefore going to finish reading this thread and spend a bit of time doing some research which i have always wanted to, but hindered in many ways. That can be a long process and so to form my very own conclusion or leaning, i would start another thread. You guys can continue the thread, but i would mostly be passive at it. Cheers and thanks again. Wingnut, my apologies to you and i will still try to get to your threads in this post. Edited June 5, 2017 by warrior12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamlamad Posted June 5, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.08 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 5, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Revelation Man said: That's all you are inspired to do, be argumentative and tell people where they are wrong. That is why I will do something I have never done, place you on ignore. I do not see Jesus in your posts brother man. I see a lot of self. I don't need the hassle of someone vexing my spirit on a Christian Message board. Besides, nothing you post is logical. Now, think about it, do you really read, or do you just post? Consider how Paul responded to people who were preaching false doctrine in his day. Yes, I read. Sorry, but everything I post is logical. The problem is preconceived glasses. Case in point? Mystery Babylon, in scripture plainly laid out as the woman riding the beast, and clearly stated as a city. When someone has preconceptions, they are blind to other points of view - even TRUTH. Our problem: you know what you write is truth, and I know what I write is truth. But obviously, but cannot be truth. I have absolutely nothing against you personally; I don't know you personally. But you are on a public forum where anyone can read. That is why I challenge what you write: I don't see it fitting scripture. Edited June 5, 2017 by iamlamad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamlamad Posted June 5, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.08 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 5, 2017 1 hour ago, simplejeff said: Certainliy it has been going on for centuries already, many centuries. The revelation of truth was published long ago, and has not changed. (only there is much , much, much more deception today - multitudes of fairytales accepted as if truth, and lies taking the place of truth while truth is rejected.) Who has had the ear of the kings, the presidents, the prime ministers, the warlords, the kremlin(or whatever is over there now), the rulers of Germany, Britain, African countries, Asian countries , and so on ? (for generations) With so much power in their pocket, that is how , as God said it would be, they have deceived the whole world, all the leaders (with almost no exceptions), and almost all of the religious leaders, socialist/socialites/ scientists, financiers (all the 'big' money), educators, and so forth ..... And they have actively squished God's people, and suppressed truth, every chance , everywhere it is possible to do, in every country..... Does the entire context of Revelation just get ignored here? What IS the context? It is the 70th week of Daniel and then the short period of time that follows before Jesus returns. And what is happened in the last half of the 70th week? Rev. 12 shows us that the DRAGON will be making war with the woman first (the Jews and Hebrews) and then with those that love Jesus. Rev. 13 shows us HOW Satan the Dragon will accomplish this. The Beast and False prophet will deceive all the nations of the world, and they will do it from Jerusalem! They will cause the whole world to be led after the man of sin turned Beast, and all will worship him. This is why the woman riding the beast is called the whore and harlot, and why she has a nickname as Babylon. It will be the worst false religion ever foisted on human beings - and it will be headquartered in Jerusalem. Therefore Jerusalem, the city, is the harlot, is the "Mystery Babylon...mother of harlots." No false religion ever in the world has or will come close to deceiving the entire world. No, Jerusalem, for those 3 1/2 years, will become the mother of harlots. This is what Mystery Babylon means, IN CONTEXT. Of course, anyone can make her be anything, if they are willing to pull her out of the context John placed her in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wingnut- Posted June 6, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 39 Topic Count: 101 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,673 Content Per Day: 1.31 Reputation: 7,358 Days Won: 67 Joined: 04/22/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted June 6, 2017 17 hours ago, iamlamad said: No, It is not the only place John does this: we find it in chapter 10, where John writes of the 7th trumpet, and we find it in chapter 14 where we see a very symbolic picture of two different harvests: first of the righteous and then of the unrighteous. Oh, how many times did John write that "Babylon is fallen, is fallen" before chapter 18 where it really happens? See... I Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. A mystery... Revelation 10:7 but in the days of the sounding of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, the mystery of God would be finished, as He declared to His servants the prophets. Accomplished... Revelation 11:15 Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!” 16 And the twenty-four elders who sat before God on their thrones fell on their faces and worshiped God, 17 saying: “We give You thanks, O Lord God Almighty, The One who is and who was and who is to come, Because You have taken Your great power and reigned. 18 The nations were angry, and Your wrath has come, And the time of the dead, that they should be judged, And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints, And those who fear Your name, small and great, And should destroy those who destroy the earth.” 19 Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n2thelight Posted June 6, 2017 Group: Non-Conformist Theology Followers: 2 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,139 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 796 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/20/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted June 6, 2017 On 6/3/2017 at 6:40 PM, other one said: Who or what is the antichrist in the book of revelation. Only satan can be the antichrist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Thallasa Posted June 6, 2017 Share Posted June 6, 2017 (edited) On 26/04/2017 at 5:27 PM, Daniel 11:36 said: "for there is a great King waiting for us at the other end." This is scriptural and true .... only He is not waiting He will "snatch" when not expected .... then He will bring unprecedented tribulation to the earth against all who have ignored Him "He will snatch ". I don't believe God snatches in this manner ,as this implies 'hatred ', and God does not hate .This is a human interpretation by a people still relatively simple . God's Creation , all of it , and particularly humanity ,have laws bult into it ,which can never be changed , for anything to grow to fullness . All plants, trees animals , the eco system ,the cosmos (with stars and planets ) all obey laws which are intrinsic to their creation , by our Creator . When Jesus speaks of the Law He is talking about these natural laws which are also spiritual , as they are kept in place by God's love and creative energy . These natural laws are behind everything in creation ,are automatic in their reactionand have consequencs for humanity ,when we break God's inherent regulation of His creation . When we suffer ,we do so because we break these laws ,which God has simplified for us ,by giving us the 10 commandments,which are entirely based around love (and recogntion of Him ,and our fellow men ). So what we see as God's wrath, is in fact an automatic reponse to these Laws . We are Under these laws until we recognise and follow Christ ,and gain protection and insight, through the 'Holy Spirit' . I know this seems off the point of the thread, but this idea that God spends His time in Wrath is in my experiecne not true ,and the expression 'Under the law' is badly understood . As for the point of the thread ,it has to be the Banking System ,which is in the hands of the latter day pharisees ,who do not follow God's law, (the Torah ), but that which they make up themselves ,and is called the talmud . Edited June 8, 2017 by Thallasa spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n2thelight Posted June 6, 2017 Group: Non-Conformist Theology Followers: 2 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,139 Content Per Day: 0.69 Reputation: 796 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/20/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted June 6, 2017 On 4/24/2017 at 10:27 PM, warrior12 said: Revelation 17 gives a description of Mystery Babylon the great with her goldern cup and who the kings of the earth committed fornication and the inhabitants of the earth got drunk of the wine of her fornication. When did she appear in history and is she doing the above today. Well, i think it is obvious she is in the world today as she would be destroyed in the end time scenario. But how are the kings committing fornication and how are the inhabitants getting drunk with the wine of her fornication. Is is spiritual seduction, lust for worldly goods and treasures or others. what are your thoughts and some examples. https://www.theseason.org/revelation/revelation17.htm Chapter 17, like all the others, was written in symbology. We are taught here by the use of idioms, and symbols. Though these terms are covered over in symbols; each of these terms are explained as to their identity. There simply is no mystery to these symbols when we have the explanation. As we unravel the mysteries in this chapter, many other mysteries of God's Word will also be revealed at this time. Revelation 17:1 "And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials [bowls], and talked with me [John], saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore [harlot] that sitteth upon many waters: Remember, the seven seals, vials, plagues, trumpets, and thunders are all the same acts. Only a different vision of John's, giving a different profile of the same occurrence, or event. This angel is one of the seven angels that "he" [John] has seen before, and the discussion John and this angel are having is about this "one world religion" that sits, or rules over the peoples of the earth. The "great whore" is a religion, while the "waters" represents the people that follow after the whore, or religion. This "whore" is identified as "Mystery, Babylon", as we look ahead to the 15th verse. We will also establish in our minds exactly what the "waters", or "seas", or "rivers" truly represents. These bodies of water are peoples, and nations, tongues and languages right here on earth. This harlot is not the Catholic church, or any other church now in operation, but it is a deception created by these Kenite scribes that will so change your church, or any church, to accept the one world political and religious beasts. In the end, it will be the Antichrist's religious system. The approach the Kenites will use to draw you and your church into their system, will be through your own doctrines like the "rapture theory", or another false doctrine spun out to draw certain churches in to their deceptions. To the Roman Catholics, they will use idols, miracles, or even a statement from the pope, to make the Catholics accept. To Buddhist and the Hindus it will be something different, but all religions will be open and willing to allow themselves to enter into the Antichrist's system. Why then is the Christian world the focus of Satan's attacks over all other religions of the world? Christianity is the only religion where it's Messiah and founder claims to be the "Son of the Living God". All other forms of religious practice are created by man for man. Any supernatural action then would automatically draw the other forms to that supernatural entity. Christianity is the only religion that is exact and absolute, Jesus said, you either come to the Father by Me, or you are not saved and have eternal life. Jesus said in John 14:6; "I am the way, the truth and the life, no man cometh to the Father but by Me." So this angel is about to tell John exactly what these terms and idioms mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior12 Posted June 6, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 54 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,429 Content Per Day: 0.88 Reputation: 1,516 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/05/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted June 6, 2017 (edited) 44 minutes ago, n2thelight said: In the end, it will be the Antichrist's religious system. My issue with the harlot being a religious system of any kind is that the harlot seduces and affects the whole world, not only those who are religious. Meaning all, will participate or seduced or tempted [in the case for belivers] to drink or taste her cup to be enticed to participate in her orgies, debauchery ect. Porn or sexual sins is an enslaving product of her wickedness, because she is very wicked and vile and it is an explosive product today the world has come to accept as normal. But nevertheless, but the stats are many christians watch porn on saturday and are in church on sunday. seventy percent [in the USA] is the figure, it is indeed alarming and worrying. Just a little rant about porn there. 2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication The INHABITANTS of the earth [ every man] are forced or persuaded to be made drunk with the wine of her fornication. It is a spiritual treasure that she captivates the world with and men will kill for it. More to be said about that. Anyway, you are in the camp of a religious system being the harlot. I am saying camp, because others have different views. thanks for your insights. Edited June 6, 2017 by warrior12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamlamad Posted June 6, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.08 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted June 6, 2017 (edited) 6 hours ago, wingnut- said: See... I Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. A mystery... Revelation 10:7 but in the days of the sounding of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, the mystery of God would be finished, as He declared to His servants the prophets. Accomplished... Revelation 11:15 Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!” 16 And the twenty-four elders who sat before God on their thrones fell on their faces and worshiped God, 17 saying: “We give You thanks, O Lord God Almighty, The One who is and who was and who is to come, Because You have taken Your great power and reigned. 18 The nations were angry, and Your wrath has come, And the time of the dead, that they should be judged, And that You should reward Your servants the prophets and the saints, And those who fear Your name, small and great, And should destroy those who destroy the earth.” 19 Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail. Anyone can put scriptures together AS IF they were meant to be together: Matthew 27:5 And he [Judas Iscariot] ..., went and hanged himself. Luke 10:37 ... Then said Jesus unto him, Go, and do thou likewise. 1 Thes 5 18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you. Then seem to tell a good story when put together like this, but it is certainly NOT the intent of the Author. Paul's "last trump" in indeed a trumpet, but his "last trump" is certainly not John's 7th trumpet. Neither is Paul's mystery the same mystery as John's in Rev. 10. However, I will agree, John's mystery will be solved when the 7th trumpet sounds. Why does the Kingdoms get taken from Satan and given to Jesus at that point in time? Why not at the 7th seal? Why not at the 7th vial? Why not way back when Jesus conquered death and rose from the dead? There is a reason it will happen at the 7th trumpet, but that reason is a mystery. By the way, where was Jesus great power before this? Why did He have to take it back? And was Jesus not "reigning: before this event? Will there actually be and earthquake and hail inside the temple of God in heaven? Can you show us a verse where the dead are judged here in this chapter? It is mentioned, but when or where is it accomplished? Where is it accomplished in this chapter that God destroys those that destroy the earth? That would be almost all left alive at that time, except for those whose names are written in the book of life. Edited June 6, 2017 by iamlamad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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