When the blessings don't come

[PlanetChee]

21 minutes ago, OneLight said:

Perhaps it was how your post was worded that I had the idea you were indicating that only those who had/do belong to either group could reply.  A simple read of the thread would indicate if a person claimed to be, or had been, of the Word of Faith movement, which is why I am puzzled by even having to ask.  Even if they are not, we do not restrict participation as long as there is not violations being made.

I never said anything that would imply such and therefore such can never be inferred by those that read my post .

[OneLight]

18 hours ago, PlanetChee said:

On 5/30/2017 at 11:31 AM, ricky said:

I have a question for those who espouse the "word of faith" movement aka the "Prosperty gospel". What happens when the financial blessings don't come, or the healing you have been believing in isn't there? How does that affect your faith in the sufficiency of Christ? Do you ever question your faith as a whole?

How many that are responding here meet the criteria described in the OP? Members of the Word of Faith movement. Or Prosperity Gospel? 

1 hour ago, PlanetChee said:

18 hours ago, OneLight said:

Some were, some were not.  Since you replied, which are you?  I was for a very short time.

I have never been WoF. I was asking because the OP was specific as to whom it appeared they were asking this question of. And with all the replies I was wondering if all those members are WoF.

1 hour ago, PlanetChee said:

1 hour ago, OneLight said:

Perhaps it was how your post was worded that I had the idea you were indicating that only those who had/do belong to either group could reply.  A simple read of the thread would indicate if a person claimed to be, or had been, of the Word of Faith movement, which is why I am puzzled by even having to ask.  Even if they are not, we do not restrict participation as long as there is not violations being made.

I never said anything that would imply such and therefore such can never be inferred by those that read my post .

Sure you did, otherwise I would never of asked.  When you mentioned "meet criteria", and asked how many met the criteria, it looked like a check to me, which is why I asked if you were also as you were replying in the thread.  Simple as that. 

[PlanetChee]

8 minutes ago, OneLight said:

 

 

Sure you did, otherwise I would never of asked.  When you mentioned "meet criteria", and asked how many met the criteria, it looked like a check to me, which is why I asked if you were also as you were replying in the thread.  Simple as that. 

 

Actually , what is simple, is what I said in my post. My post and intention does not change in order to comport with your inference. You do not speak for my intentions. Your belief is not mine. 

The criteria for answering this thread was authored in the OP by the member that generated the OP. My remarks asked for clarification of the posts generated thereafter. Was everyone answering WoF. 

Simple as that. 

 

[OneLight]

3 hours ago, PlanetChee said:

Actually , what is simple, is what I said in my post. My post and intention does not change in order to comport with your inference. You do not speak for my intentions. Your belief is not mine. 

The criteria for answering this thread was authored in the OP by the member that generated the OP. My remarks asked for clarification of the posts generated thereafter. Was everyone answering WoF. 

Simple as that. 

 

So many ways to say you disagree with how I read your words, but it all means the same thing.  You see what you wrote and know what you meant because you wrote them.  I, on the other hand, had no preconceived idea of your intentions, so I took your words as I read them, at face value as it was presented.  I have often seen people write posts and then are dismayed that others read it take away something different then the writer wanted them to read it.  The problem very well could be that those who post do not step back before hitting submit to read their words they wrote as if they had no preconceived idea what the author had in mind, as if they are reading it for the first time. 

As for your reply above, as I stated, I can only go by what you post.  I am not trying to tell you what to believe and I never said it was.  As I carefully explained above, I am not replying to your intentions, but your words.  If they do not line up, then I suggest you be more careful with what you post, spending more time rereading before submitting, for clarity sake.  I surely do not want to misunderstand any posts I read.

[ricky]

While the question was primary directed to WoF proponents I think there has seen a lot of positive discussion on the issue from non WoF proponents. 

[OneLight]

On 5/30/2017 at 11:31 AM, ricky said:

I have a question for those who espouse the "word of faith" movement aka the "Prosperty gospel". What happens when the financial blessings don't come, or the healing you have been believing in isn't there? How does that affect your faith in the sufficiency of Christ? Do you ever question your faith as a whole?

Since I have spent time in your thread, I should at least give an answer from my experiences.

When the WoF preaches preach, we were told that what we receive all depends on how much faith one has.  If you don't receive all what scripture has to offer, it is because you lack the faith to receive it.  Over time, when people try to increase their faith in order to receive these blessings, and fail, discouragement begins until the person actually begins to question their own faith in God. 

Those preaching the message refuse to realize that not all people will receive all the blessing found in scripture; wealth, health, happiness, joy unspeakable, and on and on ...  Instead, it is not their message that is at fault, by you, the listener.  They don't build up, but tear down.  Their words are not edifying, but a trap for those weak in faith from the beginning fall into ... "only if I had more faith" they keep telling themselves, as if they are not worthy to be blessed by God. 

God will give what He wishes to whomever He wishes.  He is not some big person in the sky that if you just do A you will get B,C,D,E,F ... Z.   One thing these preachers ignore completely is what is written in Philippians 4:11-13

Not that I speak in regard to need, for I have learned in whatever state I am, to be content: I know how to be abased, and I know how to abound. Everywhere and in all things I have learned both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need. I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

My experience is what I speak of above.  I started in earnest to learn how to walk closer to God, being told that those who walk the closest, receive the more.  Their preaching is like Joel Osteen today, puffed up words full of how to's while lacking in reality.  Sure, they pump you up and send you on your way, but when what they promised does not come, then you look inside, as they told you it is only by the lack of faith that you will not receive, that you have the wrong mindset and you doubt is dragging you down.  In the end, I was more doubtful of my salvation then ever before, mainly because if I cannot have enough faith to please God, how can He give me salvation for  it was by grace I had been saved through faith ... what faith???  I have so little faith and I had proven it to myself for I had received nothing I asked for in faith.

[PlanetChee]

33 minutes ago, ricky said:

While the question was primary directed to WoF proponents I think there has seen a lot of positive discussion on the issue from non WoF proponents. 

Agreed.  

54 minutes ago, OneLight said:

So many ways to say you disagree with how I read your words, but it all means the same thing.  You see what you wrote and know what you meant because you wrote them.  I, on the other hand, had no preconceived idea of your intentions, so I took your words as I read them, at face value as it was presented.  I have often seen people write posts and then are dismayed that others read it take away something different then the writer wanted them to read it.  The problem very well could be that those who post do not step back before hitting submit to read their words they wrote as if they had no preconceived idea what the author had in mind, as if they are reading it for the first time. 

As for your reply above, as I stated, I can only go by what you post.  I am not trying to tell you what to believe and I never said it was.  As I carefully explained above, I am not replying to your intentions, but your words.  If they do not line up, then I suggest you be more careful with what you post, spending more time rereading before submitting, for clarity sake.  I surely do not want to misunderstand any posts I read.

I don't need a detailed explanation for how you read:

Quote

 How many that are responding here meet the criteria described in the OP? Members of the Word of Faith movement. Or Prosperity Gospel?

To make that question simpler for you , I asked, how many members here answering are Word of Faith or members believing in the Prosperity Gospel? 

Very simple. I don't think you need to focus on my words and look for ulterior motives in order to take issue from what you imagine is an issue. Just to make an issue of my posts. This is the last that I'll make myself clear to you. I hope you understand. 

 

[OneLight]

2 minutes ago, PlanetChee said:

59 minutes ago, OneLight said:

So many ways to say you disagree with how I read your words, but it all means the same thing.  You see what you wrote and know what you meant because you wrote them.  I, on the other hand, had no preconceived idea of your intentions, so I took your words as I read them, at face value as it was presented.  I have often seen people write posts and then are dismayed that others read it take away something different then the writer wanted them to read it.  The problem very well could be that those who post do not step back before hitting submit to read their words they wrote as if they had no preconceived idea what the author had in mind, as if they are reading it for the first time. 

As for your reply above, as I stated, I can only go by what you post.  I am not trying to tell you what to believe and I never said it was.  As I carefully explained above, I am not replying to your intentions, but your words.  If they do not line up, then I suggest you be more careful with what you post, spending more time rereading before submitting, for clarity sake.  I surely do not want to misunderstand any posts I read.

I don't need a detailed explanation for how you read:

This was not about how I read, but how you write.  Guess it is too much to ask that you look at yourself once in a while.

[OneLight]

4 minutes ago, PlanetChee said:

Quote

 How many that are responding here meet the criteria described in the OP? Members of the Word of Faith movement. Or Prosperity Gospel?

To make that question simpler for you , I asked, how many members here answering are Word of Faith or members believing in the Prosperity Gospel? 

Very simple. I don't think you need to focus on my words and look for ulterior motives in order to take issue from what you imagine is an issue. Just to make an issue of my posts. This is the last that I'll make myself clear to you. I hope you understand. 

Seems like every time I question what you say, or have a misunderstanding from what you write, you turn it around on me in false accusations of my reasons why I reply.  Ulterior Motives?  Seriously?  If you cannot explain yourself better, that is not my fault.  As for me questioning what you post, when I see anyone post something I have a question about, I will reply.  You are no different.  I hope you realize this is what everyone does on a discussion forum.

[Marilyn C]

14 hours ago, Behold said:

mmmmmmm, what?

I've  prayed for the lost in the middle east where i live at times..... Ive personally dealt with sinners in Russia, Germany, Taiwan, France, and other foreign countries.

I've been to seminary and have been personally trained for years by one of the most renown bible scholars who ever existed.My church supports 200 worldwide missionaries , full time, so that they can do the job full time, without having to worry about a paycheck, and wasting time this way.

My church has hatched more then 1500 pastors, and currently there are 500 churches that are thriving that have pastors that came from my church.

I've witnessed on the streets, ive worked in the ministry, behind the scenes and in

front.., ive written 7 CDs worth of Music for the Lord and my music has been all over the world,  as well as worked as a Minister of Music, Ive discipled many, i've helped thousands and thousands of people online, both on Christian forums and on secular forums.

I've given away countless New Testaments where i personally went into each one and wrote notes and connected the dots for "newbies" so that they could use these bibles to find their way closer to God and to get grounded in sound doctrine.

I can list much more of my personal christian resume` for  you, but, i'll stop there.

My walk with the Lord speaks for itself, Marilyn.

regards,

B

Hi Behold,

Thank you for sharing some of your journey so far in the Lord. If it or some was done by the Holy Spirit, then you can be assured of "Well done thou good and faithful servant." Now also we know that the mother who brings up her children in the Lord, and the hardworking farmer who is esteemed in his community for his testimony of the Lord, we know that they also will have, "Well done..."

Man`s organisations seem to put what God would have us do in to meetings, paying for those and raising up those to run those meetings.

We note that the Apostle Paul worked with his hands as a tent maker, and discipled others. (Acts 18: 1 & 2)

The Apostle Paul goes on to say -

`...you should also aspire to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business, and TO WORK WITH YOUR HANDS, as we commended you, that you may walk properly towards those who are outside, and that you may lack nothing.`(Eph. 4: 11 & 12)

It doesn`t seem that Paul thought working for a living was `having to worry about a paycheck, and wasting time this way,` as you said.

Believers working in everyday life show forth the life of Christ to others, this is the work of the Lord, not just meetings, or paying for others to run meetings.

Mmmmmm means, something to think upon.

Marilyn.