Anti-Sha'ria rallies planned across the U.S. worry muslim leaders

[SavedByGrace1980]

13 minutes ago, other one said:

The problem is that you can't separate the religion out of islam. When you try and do that,you no longer have Islam.

 

As has been argued on this board, only actual practicing Muslims can determine what true Islam is.  So to the extent they want to live side-by-side, peacefully with non-Muslims, it is up to them to determine that.  They will need to address the problems in their congregations that prevent them from doing so.

They will need to understand they cannot impose sharia.  If they cannot understand that, then it will be up to the rest of us as to how to respond.

And we had better do so sooner rather than later - while non-Muslims are still in the majority.

Blessings,

-Ed

[Guest shiloh357]

31 minutes ago, SavedByGrace1981 said:

If I may, I think that what you do not understand is that Islam is as much a political movement as it is a religion.  You have to see it as both to understand.  If you do not see it as both, you will not understand.

The First Amendment to the Constitution guarantees freedom of religion to all citizens.  Individual Muslims can and should be able to observe and practice their religion without interference from the Government.  No more nor  less than individual Jews, Christians, Sikhs or Hindus.

So that hopefully addresses one aspect of your concern.

The USA however has a history of taking a dim view of POLITICAL MOVEMENTS (of which Islam has a component called sharia) which seek to undermine or usurp the laws as written by our legislatures and under the Constitution.  We fought a Civil War over it in the 1860s.

More recently, Nazis and Communists came under government scrutiny.  These groups were seen as a threat to our way of life and more importantly to our stability.  You simply cannot have two sets of laws in a SECULAR society.

You may not agree - but Islam IS a political movement.  It (as a political movement) simply is NOT compatible with a Constitutional Republic.  So these 'rallies' (as long as they remain peaceful) ARE perfectly justified and to be expected.

No one of good will thinks that Muslims should not be allowed to practice their religion.

But no one who is sane thinks that they should be able to impose 'sharia' and not encounter resistance.  And if 'Muslim leaders' are offended by this, well that's too bad.  Perhaps then they should focus their attention and ire to their own house.

Clean it up - root out the individuals causing problems - then we can all live in peace.

Blessings,

-Ed

If the Muslim religion were more like Judaism, where the religion is simply defined by internal customs unique to itself, there would be no problem.   But Islam is a government and a religion.  

Islam doesn't recognize a separation between religion and government.  In Islam everything is religious.   Sharia law is a religious law it is the law of Islam.  Devout Muslims do not assimilate into American culture or any other western culture.

[simplejeff]

8 minutes ago, SavedByGrace1981 said:

As has been argued on this board, only actual practicing Muslims can determine what true Islam is.

Ha!?  "as argued on this board?!".... Scripture says they cannot determine what true Islam is - they are completely deceived, led by and serving willingly the devil/ demons/ accursed motives, same as most of the world population in every country with few exceptions (on the narrow road to life in Jesus) .

8 minutes ago, SavedByGrace1981 said:

And we had better do so sooner rather than later - while non-Muslims are still in the majority.

?  "we" ...... "better do" ?  ......   "non-Muslims" in the majority?   Don't you realize that pro-devil have been in the majority for all the generations since Christ ? ! Muslim or not,   anti- Christ, anti-truth,  opposed to God,   being and becoming more the world system of the beast ....  all as written in Scripture,  and much exposed since the Reformation,  although known by God's people all along, in every nation.

[simplejeff]

7 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

No one of good will thinks that Muslims should not be allowed to practice their religion.

) embedded quote of another quote/  quoted by shiloh, posted originally by another < not clear from quote function >

YHWH and Jesus are both "of good will" , right ?

No unrepentant Muslim enters heaven, nor will be found in heaven, right ?

So they are "allowed" to practice their religion,  of death, destruction, anti-Bible every day......

to what end ?

[Guest shiloh357]

4 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

) embedded quote of another quote/  quoted by shiloh, posted originally by another < not clear from quote function >

YHWH and Jesus are both "of good will" , right ?

No unrepentant Muslim enters heaven, nor will be found in heaven, right ?

So they are "allowed" to practice their religion,  of death, destruction, anti-Bible every day......

to what end ?

I think was savedbygrace means is that they are free to practice the benign aspects of their religion.  He is referencing things like prayers and internal rituals.   And if that was how Islam is defined, that would be fine.  But that is not how Islam works. 

[simplejeff]

3 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

I think was savedbygrace means is that they are free to practice the benign aspects of their religion.  He is referencing things like prayers and internal rituals.   And if that was how Islam is defined, that would be fine.  But that is not how Islam works. 

"fine" !?  fine for who ?  "Fine" if they were just outwardly harmless to others ? 

No.  The society,  everywhere, is pernicious - Islam,  Hindu,  Republican, Democratic,  Autocratic,  Liberal, Conservative, doesn't matter - in the world,  society, mankind, is pernicious - deadly/ death dealing/ apart from Christ eternally judged.....

Many people sent their children,  young, naive children (old, naive parents) to 'religious' schools (all around the world) they thought were "best" for their children....  practically ensuring the destuction of their lives.....  for eternity....  apart from Christ.

One Way,  - Jesus Is the Way,  there is no other way, anywhere, to the Father; to enter the kingdom of heaven.

[SavedByGrace1980]

20 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

Ha!?  "as argued on this board?!".... Scripture says they cannot determine what true Islam is - they are completely deceived, let by and serving willingly the devil/ demons/ accursed motives.

?  "we" ...... "better do" ?  ......   "non-Muslims" in the majority?   Don't you realize that pro-devil have been in the majority for all the generations since Christ ? ! Muslim or not,   anti- Christ, anti-truth,  opposed to God,   being and becoming more the world system of the beast ....  all as written in Scripture,  and much exposed since the Reformation,  although known by God's people all along, in every nation.

Jesus Christ said "My Kingdom is not of this world . . ."  Though I live expectantly for His Return, I know it will only be ushered in with His appearance. No secular government past, present or future - with anyone else BUT Christ as the Head - will suffice.

In the meantime we live (and should appreciate living) under a secular government.  The Founders - purposely - set it up that way.  And I happen to wholeheartedly agree with it.

When you cite Scripture, I (as a Christian) concur.  Scripture supersedes everything in a Christian's life (or it should).  

We do not however live under a Christian government, but a secular one.  One that (at least for the time being) has a secular Constitution. We cannot then expect a secular government to carry out Christian 'demands'.  Yes, sometimes our issues will dovetail; more often they will not.

You are correct in saying Muslims are deceived - but that deception is an issue our government cannot (nor should not) address.  Only we Christians - through prayer - can.   And miracles ARE happening daily in the Muslim world.  Missionaries have many accounts of Muslims coming to Christ.  We tend - in our day to day sometimes gloom-and-doom - to forget this.

Ultimately Islam (and all other world and/or satanic systems) will be defeated.  But it won't be by wars, riots, or nuclear weapons.

It will be by solely by the Power and Justice of Jesus Christ - Our coming King Himself!  Praise His Name!

Blessings,

-Ed

 

 

Edited June 10, 2017 by SavedByGrace1981

[simplejeff]

1 minute ago, SavedByGrace1981 said:

 We tend - in our day to day sometimes gloom-and-doom - to forget this.

Clarify this - do you live in a day to day , sometimes ?,  gloom-and-doom ?

Or daily in union with Yeshua,   in His Rule,  His Reign,  as the apostles and disciples did in the NT,  YHWH's Kingdom .... with JOY, PEACE and RIGHTEOUSNESS (all gifts, freely granted by the Father with Salvation in Jesus) ....

[simplejeff]

4 minutes ago, SavedByGrace1981 said:

Ultimately Islam (and all other world and/or satanic systems) will be defeated.  But it won't be by wars, riots, or nuclear weapons.

It will be by solely by the Power and Justice of Jesus Christ - Our coming King Himself!  Praise His Name!

Amein !    Come quickly KING! SAVIOR ! MESSIAH ! JESUS !

 

Revelation 19: 11 Then I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse! The one sitting on it is called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he judges and makes war. 12 His eyes are like a flame of fire, and on his head are many diadems, and he has a name written that no one knows but himself. 13 He is clothed in a robe dipped in blood, and the name by which he is called is The Word of God.

[SavedByGrace1980]

11 minutes ago, simplejeff said:

Clarify this - do you live in a day to day , sometimes ?,  gloom-and-doom ?

Or daily in union with Yeshua,   in His Rule,  His Reign,  as the apostles and disciples did in the NT,  YHWH's Kingdom .... with JOY, PEACE and RIGHTEOUSNESS (all gifts, freely granted by the Father with Salvation in Jesus) ....

One cannot see the news and say there is not an overabundance of gloom and doom.  So yes, I will admit at times I find myself getting caught up in it. But the times never last for long, as I push that aside and reflect on The Word.

The daily devotions and Bible readings my wife and I have together certainly help.  We try to start most every day with those - and most importantly prayer.

We love our country - we consider ourselves patriotic (she and I both are veterans).  We are saddened at times to see what is becoming of our nation.

But save for the Constitutional powers given to us to vote and petition the government, our power to effect change is limited.  And we have NO power to change hearts - which is where real, lasting change needs to happen.

Only God can do that.

Blessings,

-Ed

 

Edited June 10, 2017 by SavedByGrace1981