Daniel 11:36 Posted December 21, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,957 Content Per Day: 0.56 Reputation: 295 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/17/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted December 21, 2017 Amen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diaste Posted December 21, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 14 Topic Count: 67 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 6,629 Content Per Day: 1.99 Reputation: 2,368 Days Won: 2 Joined: 03/17/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted December 21, 2017 3 hours ago, missmuffet said: Some of the unbelievers who go into the seven year tribulation will come to Christ and be saved. They will be the tribulation saints. Yes. I get that. Not the problem. The problem is the tribulation is the wrath of God. Believers are not appointed to wrath. There can be no believers in the tribulation if it is the wrath of God as, believers are not appointed to wrath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted December 21, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,991 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,689 Content Per Day: 11.80 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted December 21, 2017 21 minutes ago, Diaste said: Yes. I get that. Not the problem. The problem is the tribulation is the wrath of God. Believers are not appointed to wrath. There can be no believers in the tribulation if it is the wrath of God as, believers are not appointed to wrath. But some of those unbelievers who enter the tribulation will come to God and will be saved. The Holy Spirit will still be in the seven year tribulation. Not all the unbelievers who enter the seven year tribulation will be thrown into the fire of hell. Some of them who come to a belief in Jesus Christ will be the tribulation saints and will be martyred and killed for their belief. There will be a handful of believers that will make it to the end of the tribulation and not be killed. They will apparently have to go underground which will be very, very dangerous. I don't know how they will make it to the 1000 year millennium but they will. But there will not be very many of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted December 21, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,468 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,379 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted December 21, 2017 22 hours ago, Diaste said: The above arguments would be valid if tribulation was the wrath of God. It's not. Tribulation is cut short by the return of Jesus who then metes out the wrath of God. Tribulation only begins at the midpoint of the week, it's not the entire last week. I agree the OP is not exactly precise but I'm pretty sure we can all understand the context is the end of the age. Noah was protected from Gods wrath, but not 100 years of ridicule while building the ark. You did say persecution and wrath are different, yes? On the day Noah entered the ark, wrath fell on the earth. On the day Lot was removed from Sodom, wrath fell, while Lot suffered persecution and general degenerate goings on before that. Israel in Egypt is a very good example. The plagues did not harm them, even though the Egyptian suffered greatly. Now the plagues were never likened to wrath but it is a great example of God protecting His people during a divine judgement; just like what will happen during a 3 year great tribulation in the future. Now, since Noah and Lot were taken on the same day wrath fell, and Jesus said the coming wrath would be just like in the day of Noah, then we will be taken out on the day wrath falls.I know you agree. But, the wrath of God and the Lamb does not occur until the 6th seal, well into the last week, as you pointed out above. We will be taken on that day, just as in the days of Noah, and Lot. Just before wrath and well into the last week. It's not a matter of believers wanting to suffer, or needing to, or some escape from temptations of the world, it's just truth. The moment of temptation that comes to try the world, referenced imprecisely in the OP, is the choice we will face, should we live that long, between the Lord Jesus and the beast; not the many worldly temptations we live with daily. Even Jesus dealt with those. So you're saying the tribulation starts mid point, at he "Abomination of Desolation", and not the signing of the seven year covenant with Israel and the many? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis1209 Posted December 22, 2017 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 18 Topic Count: 347 Topics Per Day: 0.13 Content Count: 7,468 Content Per Day: 2.70 Reputation: 5,379 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/27/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted December 22, 2017 12 hours ago, Justin Adams said: However the time periods work out, the tribulation from the evils of this world will be so bad, that nobody will have the time or the convenience of being on forums like this. No comm. Nada - Zilch. In the 70's I drove from England across to Nepal. Many countries were unfriendly. There was no phone, no comm, just one's wits, passport and some gasoline. Nobody would have known if I just disappeared - as did many in those days. This does not bother me in the least. I got used to it. The wrath of God is simply that. We believers are not appointed to that. So either we get protected just before the WRATH, or we come out thru it as it happens. There is no time frame to tell us exactly what and for how long the Lord's Wrath is to be expected. We are just given an idea of why, and what He will accomplish. Good points Justin. The sequence and timing in Revelation and Daniel is difficult to determine by this Bible student. Agreed we are not appointed to God's wrath, but we seem to be not exempt from God's judgments. Something I've noticed and am considering and pondering. The seven seal judgments, when do they occur? Many expositors claim the seal judgments of Revelation Chapter 5: occur just after the start of the tribulation. I can't make that connection myself. Suppose the seal judgments are pre-tribulational? Personally, I see three distinct divisions; the wrath of man (wars), the wrath of Satan, when he is cast out and is furious and knows his time is short, and the wrath of God, which I personally believe begins when 'the man of Perdition' commits the abomination of desolation at the 3 1/2 year mark of the tribulation. So in my view, the wrath of God lasts 3 1/2 years. There's more opinions on the end-times than Carter had liver pills. As time unfolds, I'm sure we're going to get a clearer picture of the events and timing depending how long before our Father tells our Savior to go and get us. At my age, the race is on between my last heartbeat and the resurrection or Rapture. I have little doubt the generation behind me will witness these things if we don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 23 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said: http://biblehub.com/revelation/3-10.htm No.He didn't promise to keep me from tribulation.He said if I keep the word of his patience,he will keep me from,the hour of trial.Your not going to deceive me by changing his word. Jesus prayed that I would not be taken,out of the world but that I would be kept from the evil which is temptation. What you are preaching is a deception. You have to stop doing what you are doing. It is a misinterpretation of what Scripture teaches. You are putting your own human interpretation of the Bible by trying to take what is literal and making it allegorical. I have brought this to your attention before and you need to stop with this false teaching. Even if I get into trouble for confronting you about this so be it. Everyone should be aware of what is happening here when you post this deception. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shilohsfoal Posted December 22, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 153 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 5,881 Content Per Day: 2.47 Reputation: 330 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/22/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 22, 2017 2 hours ago, Rick_Parker said: What you are preaching is a deception. You have to stop doing what you are doing. It is a misinterpretation of what Scripture teaches. You are putting your own human interpretation of the Bible by trying to take what is literal and making it allegorical. I have brought this to your attention before and you need to stop with this false teaching. Even if I get into trouble for confronting you about this so be it. Everyone should be aware of what is happening here when you post this deception. http://biblehub.com/revelation/3-10.htm It's as if you can't hear Jesus.Do you ever read the bible at all or do you spend all you time stalking me? Try reading the verse . Jesus said nothing about tribulation in the verse.He said trail The way you follow me around accusing me reminds me of the Pharisees accusing Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frienduff thaylorde Posted December 22, 2017 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 17 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 13,256 Content Per Day: 5.33 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 62 Joined: 07/07/2017 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/25/1972 Share Posted December 22, 2017 5 hours ago, Diaste said: Yes. I get that. Not the problem. The problem is the tribulation is the wrath of God. Believers are not appointed to wrath. There can be no believers in the tribulation if it is the wrath of God as, believers are not appointed to wrath. The problem with pretrib , is that once its engrained in people, tis impossible to get it out of them . This is why the entire church should be fair and honest. and start over and read all the scrips. ON OUR OWN , not under anyone who teaches pre , mid or post. I dare people to do this , to just read it for what IT says and not what some man has said it does who teaches any of the tribs, pre , mid or post . IF we would all just start over , it would become so clear what the truth is and what it aint. I sat under none, by grace I just read the bible and its real clear which is right and which is wrong . IT aint even hard to see it. But we have to start over again. My challenge is for all to do this. A hint if what you have believed contradicts any plainly written scrip, you have been misled. DONT listen to teachers who try and say JESUS spoke this or that to the jews only, HE SPOKE IT TO THE CHURCH and it was recorded FOR US ALL to learn. if any leaders have had to say things like well this meant for jews only or etc, FLEE IT. they had to say this to make their VIEW POINT RIGHT. happy reading . I mean they have to twist the heck out of stuff , invent things that the early church NEVER taught as in TWO COMINGS that never existed. that was invented to make their point SEEM RIGHT . you take it back to HIS COMING , ONE TIME EVENT . yeah. SEE, I never had to twist squat to come to this belief. I JUST READ and LOVED what JESUS said. Most sit under men who don't like any idea of having to suffer mindset . THAT too is a big problem. I mean if people want to believe GODS best is for the easy non persecution life but rather sensual ideals of the easy one , NO WONDER pre trib is loved so much. I have heard Some but not all, but some say crazy things like that kind of persecution was for the early church only, that GOD don't want us to have to suffer like that . YEAH its got that bad. I think many have forgotten what PAUL said...............the persecutions , tribulations we suffer. ARE GODS RIGHTEOUS JUDGMENT that we be counted worthy of the kingdom for which we suffer. YEAH let that soak in . OH, I know where you stand already. Be blessed and praise the LORD. I mean HOW are we going to know if what we were taught in church is really true. IF WE don't examine all said by just simple reading ourselves . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frienduff thaylorde Posted December 22, 2017 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 17 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 13,256 Content Per Day: 5.33 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 62 Joined: 07/07/2017 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/25/1972 Share Posted December 22, 2017 16 hours ago, Justin Adams said: Oh my goodness - the straw horse of pre-trib escaped the corral again. Catch it quick. Saddle it with all kinds of scriptural accouterments then ride off into the rapture sunset. Y'all been watching too much TBN methinks. Justin we got to help them. I know a man who once never really went to church , never really lived for JESUS, that actually heard pre trib and seen nothing wrong with it Then years later that man got saved and really loved reading the bible. SO by grace he reads and read it every day just loving it. IN time he came to the solid fact that pretrib was incorrect . But the man did say he read only the bible and before all that never followed Christ . Now to be fair none of this that man can take any credit for , due to it was all by grace and by grace he was put in ONLY reading the bible. hours daily every day from may of two thousand and six, even till now, just loving it , reading the bible everyday . Please don't think the man I speak of is some big anything . HE AINT he is just a sinner saved and changed by grace. ITS ME , be blessed. THIS IS WHY I CONTINOUSLY SAY READ ONLY ONLY the bible , in time it just comes together . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frienduff thaylorde Posted December 22, 2017 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 17 Topic Count: 18 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 13,256 Content Per Day: 5.33 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 62 Joined: 07/07/2017 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/25/1972 Share Posted December 22, 2017 So on that note my advice still stands. Be prepared to die and suffer for the LORD cause one heckof a massive world wide persecution against the saints is on the way. I aint going to hound on pretribbers. But I am goning to keep reminding .........WHEN , not if , WHEN , WHEN you see people start taking the chip or rfid tattoing DONT TAKE IT . YOU WILL SEE THIS , YOU WONT have been raptured. I GUARANTEE you will SEE THIS , we wont have been raptured. IT IS the wicked mark of the beast IT IS evil to take such device. WE will see it , we wont be raptured till many saints have died, and I mean a number so high can no man count it. We will see interfaith increase , WE WILL see its all inclusive mindset become law, we will SEE people in churches and all seeing us more and more as monsters as dangerous and enemies of world peace and love. We will see it all, lest any dies a natural death before. JUST MARK those words . and keep reminding all TO be faithful to the end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts