Doctrinal: Tattoos & Body Piercings

[apothanein kerdos]

Why people want to take chances with silly things like getting a tattoo when it may cost them their soul one day

How can getting a tattoo cost you your soul?

By sinning against God's Word. Leviticus 19:28 "Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor PRINT ANY MARKES UPON YOU: I am the LORD." 1 John 3:4 "Whosoever committeth sin, transgresseth also the law: FOR SIN IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF THE LAW." To print a mark on one's body is to commit sin. 1 John 3:9 "Whosoever is born of God, doth not commit sin."

How can getting a tattoo cost you your soul? In the same way transgressing any of God's laws can send you to hell.

My point is that nobody that refrains from putting marks on their body is transgressing God's laws in this area. On the other hand, those that do put marks on their bodies may be transgressing God's laws. Why take chances?

Do you cut your hair or shave? Do you eat pork? Do you eat dairy and meat products (i.e. cheeseburgers)? Do you wear different fabrics?

The law was created to show the impossibility of following it. Likewise, the levitical law no longer applies to today. Certain concepts of it, such as sexual immorality, have passed down. You say beastiality is only covered in Levitcus. Not so. Any time the word porneia is used in the New Testament, it is banning beatiality. This is a word in Greek that covers a broad spectrum of sexual acts, such as fornication, adultry, homosexuality, beastiality, and much more. Thus, Levitical law does not apply but certain concepts do.

Even so, the passage you keep refering to is in response to worshiping the dead, not to tattoos.

[Avodah]

Why people want to take chances with silly things like getting a tattoo when it may cost them their soul one day

How can getting a tattoo cost you your soul?

By sinning against God's Word. Leviticus 19:28 "Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor PRINT ANY MARKES UPON YOU: I am the LORD." 1 John 3:4 "Whosoever committeth sin, transgresseth also the law: FOR SIN IS THE TRANSGRESSION OF THE LAW." To print a mark on one's body is to commit sin. 1 John 3:9 "Whosoever is born of God, doth not commit sin."

How can getting a tattoo cost you your soul? In the same way transgressing any of God's laws can send you to hell.

My point is that nobody that refrains from putting marks on their body is transgressing God's laws in this area. On the other hand, those that do put marks on their bodies may be transgressing God's laws. Why take chances?

Just my opinion....but...I don't think so. God is not going to send me to hell because I may have a tattoo. The scripture you quote is talking about tattooing for the dead.

[Smalcald]

I was thinking about this topic and how it really relates to other issues and our behavior. Is the New Testament a complete guide to the details of our lives? In some ways yes and in some ways no, it was not meant to be. What does the NT say about the toothpaste brand we choose? What does it say about the color purple and is that okay to wear, how about mobile homes, can I live in a mobile home? How about computers and the Internet, we are here but there certainly is a whole bunch of evil on the Internet, the same goes for music.

The thing is that sometimes I think God wants us to use our wisdom, to think and struggle to make the right decisions without some sort of detailed description from God, that is why the NT is silent on so many issues. I think God knew that we would get all bound up in the rules of something like that and forget about the entire message.

On tattoo

[apothanein kerdos]

The scripture in Leviticus 19:27 simply says we are not to round the corner of our heads, nor mar the corners of our beard. Those were pagan practices. This does not forbid shaving or getting a hair cut.

Where does it say that in context? Why is it that I can do this because it was just a pagan practice, but tattooing, which was a pagan practice, is still forbidden? Wouldn't this fall under God's "holiness laws"?

I said the laws against incest were only in the Old Testament. The only exception is a case where adultery is involved in the Corinthian Church. Contrary to what you said, the word porneia would not cover incest if the couple was husband and wife. The only way we know such a relationship is wrong is from Old Testament scripture.

Of the two of us, who do you think is more qualified to state what a Greek word means?

You gave no justification, context, or even lexicon stating why it wouldn't apply to porneia. The fact is, it would. porneia is a generic term that refers to all forms of sexual immorality within the Greek.

While I have heard people teach the only reason the law was given was to show we can't keep it, I strongly disagree with that position. The law is God's standard. There is no reason why people must wilfully transgress it. To get a tattoo would be to wilfully disobey scripture, and no one can convince me that the devil made them get it.

Funny, Paul said that the works of the Law render grace useless (i.e. we aren't saved) and that it holds no bearing upon our salvation. Are you saying Paul is wrong?

As for this scripture meaning a tattoo for the dead, I already showed how that is not true. It says we are not to make cuttings for the dead (nor) PRINT ANY MARKS UPON YOU. This prohibition doesn't say, nor print any marks for the dead, just print any marks upon you.

I won't waste my own words on this one, I'll just use various commentaries:

Matthew Henry's:

The rites and ceremonies by which they expressed their sorrow at their funerals must not be imitated, v. 28. They must not make cuts or prints in their flesh for the dead; for the heathen did so to pacify the infernal deities they dreamt of, and to render them propitious to their deceased friends. Christ by his sufferings has altered the property of death, and made it a true friend to every true Israelite; and now, as there needs nothing to make death propitious to us (for, if God be so, death is so of course), so we sorrow not as those that have no hope. Those whom the God of Israel had set apart for himself must not receive the image and superscription of these dunghill deities.

Robert Jamieson:

Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead--The practice of making deep gashes on the face and arms and legs, in time of bereavement, was universal among the heathen, and it was deemed a becoming mark of respect for the dead, as well as a sort of propitiatory offering to the deities who presided over death and the grave. The Jews learned this custom in Egypt, and though weaned from it, relapsed in a later and degenerate age into this old superstition ( Isa 15:2 Jer 16:6 41:5 ).

nor print any marks upon you--by tattooing, imprinting figures of flowers, leaves, stars, and other fanciful devices on various parts of their person. The impression was made sometimes by means of a hot iron, sometimes by ink or paint, as is done by the Arab females of the present day and the different castes of the Hindus. It is probable that a strong propensity to adopt such marks in honor of some idol gave occasion to the prohibition in this verse; and they were wisely forbidden, for they were signs of apostasy; and, when once made, they were insuperable obstacles to a return

I'll post some more tonight.

[apothanein kerdos]

Wow Burt, I guess I wasted money in learning to speak Greek. Oh well, I'll stick to my old ways and just go to hell.

[Kabowd]

Butero, do you speak or read koine Greek?

[Guest shiloh357]

First, we cannot be saved by simply obeying it. We have all fallen short in one aspect or another, if only by accident, and we need a savior Christ Jesus. That does not mean we are free to break God's laws. Read all of the things Paul said in Corinthians that will exclude us from inheritance in the Kingdom of God. Secondly, Paul came against the need to follow all the laws that only showed Israel's separation from the unclean gentiles. That is because we have been made clean through Jesus, so to continue to follow these laws makes an outward show that the gentile nations are unclean.

You obviously don't understand Paul very well. Paul came against the following the Torah, specifically the act of circumcision as a means of procuring salvation.

As for the Torah. ALL of the Torah showed Israel's separation from the Gentiles. The Torah is not a smorgasbord from which you can pick and choose what you want to keep. If you are going to forbid Tatoos and ignore the practical reasons God gave for the tatoos, then you should also separate from your wife from the week following her menstrual period and sleep in separate rooms. You should make sure that you don't wear any clothing that was made from both linen and wool (sha'anetz).

In addition, you should also make sure that your meat has NO blood in it, and that it does not come from any of forbidden animals in Lev 11 or Deut. 14.

The prohibition on getting a tatoo applied to not imitating the pagan priests who would imprint themselves with images of their gods. It is not the act of getting a tatoo that was at issue, but what the tatoo would be. God did not want the children of Israel creating tatoos representing Him, and imprinting them upon the Levitical priests. To take it beyond that is just absurd. It is certainly absurd to make it a salvation issue.

Legalism has no place on Worthy Boards.

[hebrews_beauty]

I like tattoos and piercings...as long as they are not in excess (i.e. tattoos all over the body, piercings all over the face). I have my ears pierced twice, but I wouldn't mind a third hole. I've also thought about piercing my nose, but we'll see about that one.

Tattoos and piercings are more of a cultural deal than a religious one; they are more a matter of personal taste than anything else.

Edited December 16, 2005 by hebrews_beauty

[darkest_red]

I like tattoos and piercings...as long as they are not in excess (i.e. tattoos all over the body, piercings all over the face). I have my ears pierced twice, but I wouldn't mind a third hole. I've also thought about piercing my nose, but we'll see about that one.

Tattoos and piercings are more of a cultural deal than a religious one; they are more a matter of personal taste than anything else.

Earlier this year I saw a guy who had tattoos ALL over...on his arms, his legs, his neck, his face, his head....it was horrible!! Bleurgh!

[RustyAngeL]

I have pierced ears. I don't like to see earrings on men or tattoos on women, I think that is tacky. That's just my opinion.