Listen To Hillsong Founder Brian Houston Saying That Allah Is God

[angels4u]

10 minutes ago, Cletus said:

@angels4u

Ezekiel 34.

I don't know about you but I don't feel at home on this earth , Maranatha, please Lord Jesus come soon....

[GandalfTheWise]

FWIW, here's how I approach things like this to determine what I think about them.  The first thing I try to do is find more context and background.

It took me awhile, but I managed to find that this sermon is from 2013 or so and many people jumped on this line (at about 1:30 in the video) as proving Houston was teaching Christianity and Islam were somehow compatible.  Here's a clarification he issued about this.

Recently there have been false claims on social media that I believe Muslims and Christians worship the same God. This is incorrect. Those propagating these false statements have taken one sentence from an entire message out of context. I realize that some critics WANT to believe their interpretation, but my prayer is that reasonable people will take my comment in context, accept my acknowledgment that I did not explain this sentence as I intended, and judge me on 40 years of pointing people to Jesus - not one sentence.  For further clarification, here is the context of my message:King David said about His God in Psalm 119:68, "you ARE good and you DO good". Who David believed God IS, determined what He Believed God DOES. The spirit of the message was exactly the opposite of what some critics are claiming. If you listened to the message in its entirety, my point was that; who a Muslim extremist believes God is, determines what they believe God does, and what they believe God loves.  I was contrasting their harsh perspective of (their) god, with who I believe God is - (a Loving God, the Father of our Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ) and therefore what I believe God does and what I believe God loves. The ONE sentence that critics are drawing huge conclusions from was clearly a (clumsy) way of me explaining that though both Christians and Muslims believe they serve the God of Abraham, they are very DIFFERENT 'entities' or 'deities' in both nature and action.I have always believed and will always believe that there is only one Way to God and that is through His Son, Christ Jesus. I also believe that anyone – irrespective of their religious upbringing, culture or background – can find grace, peace, freedom and eternal life through Christ.  Brian Houston

 

Second, I looked at the people creating the headline, the insinuation, and the accusations for this excerpt.   Here is the blurb on this YouTube video.  "Do Christians serve and worship Allah? Hillsong heretic Brian Houston says we do, click to hear him say it! So you are a follower of Hillsong Church, are you? Like to purchase all their Grammy award-winning “christian” music to ‘support their ministry’, is it? Well, then you might want to know that the founder of Hillsong United, Brian Houston, believes and preaches that Christians and Muslims ‘serve the same God’. Oh heresy, thy name is Chrislam."   It is a group with a web presence of https://www.nowtheendbegins.com which has a number of articles on various topics.  I skimmed around to get a sense of what they were about.  As far as I can tell, the site is primarily the work of one individual.  From the doctrinal statement and testimony, he seems to be a Christian with beliefs mostly in the mainstream of evangelicals along with some distinctives.  He's OSAS, KJV-only, staunchly pre-trib, heavily anti-RCC (having been raised RCC and attending RCC schools), and as far as I can tell, anti-charismatic and anti-pentecostal.  I'm not sure if this headline reflects an actual belief that the current pope is the antichrist or is just clickbait: "CONFIRMING HIS ROLE AS ANTICHRIST, POPE FRANCIS SPITS IN JESUS’ FACE AND DEFIANTLY DECLARES THAT ‘THERE IS NO HELL” AND NO PUNISHMENT"   He also seems to be into some conspiracy type stuff and heavily political.  Indeed, most his Youtube videos are political topics.   His statement is that his site is meant to be for end times news and KJV teaching.   My impression is of an individual so focused on everything bad that is happening in the world and increasing corruption in the last days Laodicean church that he sees it everywhere and often assumes the worst about whomever he's writing about.   Here's his comment about Houston's clarification:  UPDATE MARCH 29/2014: THIS STORY CAUSED AN IMPACT HEARD ’ROUND THE WORLD, AND WITHIN 24 HOURS IT FORCED HILLSONG UNITED PASTOR BRIAN HOUSTON TO ISSUE THE STANDARD QUICKIE DENIAL OF THE THINGS HE SAID IN THE VIDEO CLIP BELOW. IN INTEREST OF FAIRNESS, CLICK HERE TO READ THE FULL CONTEXT HIS DENIAL OF CHRISLAM. YOU CAN MAKE UP YOUR OWN MIND IF HE IS SINCERE OR NOT, AND IF HE MEANT WHAT HE ORIGINALLY SAID OR NOT. WE TAKE IT AT HIS WORD AND BELIEVE HE MEANT WHAT HE SAID IN THE VIDEO SEGMENT BELOW. THE STORY STANDS.   In other words, this person chooses to assume that a single line in a long sermon is to be taken as Houston's definitive belief about Islam and Christianity being compatible and not Houston's more detailed clarification in which he denies that.

So, in this case, I'm willing to take Houston's clarification at face value.  Why?  Because in the 5 or 6 years since (and prior to that), he does not have a track record of constantly teaching Allah is God or that Jesus is not God and the only way to be saved.  The only proof given that I could find on the NTEB site that he is a heretic about Islam consists of a single sentence in a sermon from 5 years ago.  Why isn't there a video with dozens instances of him explicitly talking about Allah from the pulpit over a several year period?  If there were more clear instances, I'm sure that site and others would have a comprehensive list of them all.   To me, the evidence points more that this was a single poorly spoken line in a long sermon than a hidden agenda on his part to merge Christianity and Islam.   I listened to the entire video a few times myself.  I'm willing to chalk this one up to saying something ambiguously while speaking extemporaneously.

Now, to be clear.  I am not making a blanket statement about my support or lack thereof for Brian Houston or Hillsong on other matters.  I am looking at this single instance and considering a single question.  Does Houston teach that Islam and Christianity are compatible and that Jesus is not the only way to God?  As far as I can tell, he has standard Christian beliefs about Jesus Christ and does not believe that Islam is some alternate route to God.  A single sentence from one sermon out of hundreds or more over decades is not convincing to me.  A complete sermon or book talking about how Islam and Christianity are compatible and explicitly describing such things unambiguously would be clear evidence to me.  The single sentence I heard in the couple minute context seems to me more likely to be a momentary lapse in clarity.  If he was really teaching Islam, I think it would show up a lot more clearly and obviously than was presented.

[Jostler]

@GandalfTheWise

Brother you consistently do bring balance and wisdom to us and this is no exception.  I have a really bad taste  in my mouth about the source  of this  criticism and this isn't the  first time I've encountered  him.   I'm also concerned about  "heresy hunters", many  of whom I just don't think are motivated by the Spirit at all.

I have tasted the temptation...but He  seems to keep saying to me at least

Quote

Rev 22:11

“He who is unjust, let him be unjust still; he who is filthy, let him be filthy still; he who is righteous, let him be righteous still; he who is holy, let him be holy still.”

 

I feel He's urged me to just let Him worry about the  heretics and keep my focus on learning what the truth is and learning to speak it in love.  Many ARE being deceived in our day but I think the  main counter is being a light, not boasting against the darkness.

With that  said, due to the particular corner of His field I'm called to, I have had reason to inspect what comes out  of Hillsong, and not from sources like nowtheendbegins.com.

I'm concerned for what Hillsong has become, for many more issues of concern than this one.  I don't believe his explanation is sincere and I don't believe what he said was careless or accidental.  I guess I'll leave it at that, but i also think your approach is a Godly one....we SHOULD be very reluctant and very  sure if we begin to accuse.

 

[GandalfTheWise]

@Jostler   I appreciate your reply.  Many years ago (over a 1/3 of a century ago, time flies), I used to be a heretic hunter (as I've come to describe it).  It is a seductive feeling of importance finding secret hidden evil that no one else notices and protecting the flock.  It is addictive.  The excitement of one discovery leads to another and then another.  And then when just a few people ooh and ahh over your spiritual acuity and sensitivity, it feeds the ego and makes you feel special.  After  time, it sadly becomes less about being in the light seeing God than spending more time digging in the dirt looking for the devil.  I like the way you phrased it:  "I feel He's urged me to just let Him worry about the  heretics and keep my focus on learning what the truth is and learning to speak it in love.  Many ARE being deceived in our day but I think the  main counter is being a light, not boasting against the darkness."   I have a serious sense of relief that I went through this before the internet or I'd have likely had a huge internet site dedicated to such things and a huge embarrassing published set of articles still floating around in cyberspace rather than a huge set of embarrassing conversations that most people have now likely forgotten.

One of the things that has brought balance for me is the path God has had me walk.  I've spent years of time in evangelical churches and ministries of most flavors and many flavors of mainline churches (notable exceptions being RCC and Eastern orthodox though I've known individual Christians from those backgrounds).  It's given me a chance to get to know and observe evangelicals with a wide range of beliefs.  I've also gotten to know many in the body of Christ (meaning that in a born-again sense) who God has ministering in mainline churches.  This means when I hear accusations against various denominations or churches or ministries, it is often an accusation against people, ministries, and churches that I've gotten to see up close and personal for myself.  This often gives me a basis for evaluating the accusations.   Real fruit of the Spirit in people's everyday lives, actions, and words is pretty hard to counterfeit for any length of time.

As a brief comment FWIW, many years ago I learned some good lessons in the aftermath of the Jimmy Swaggart and PTL scandals.  A few years after the PTL scandal, I was teaching an adult Sunday School class and spent some time on a diatribe against PTL and other such ministries.  Afterwards, my pastor pulled me to one side and pointed out a man I didn't know very well (and who incidentally never attended one of my classes again).  It turns out he'd been a full-time prayer and ministry counselor at PTL for a number of years.  It was a real ministry where people were being saved and growing in Christ.  He and others ministering there were shocked and devastated as their opportunity to minister disappeared in a day, their fellowship and ministry connections with each other were abruptly terminated, and he then had to face the stigma of being labeled a dumb gullible fool who fell for the PTL scam.   Similarly, I made some disparaging comment about Jimmy Swaggart once and a friend from Panama filled me in on many things I didn't know.  Swaggart ministries included a  number of lifelong missionaries and leaders and ministers from a number of churches and they had a large Spanish speaking ministry in central and south America.  For years prior as it was related to me, in many places, their radio broadcasts and live events were the first time many people heard the gospel in that part of the world.  When Swaggart refused to step down and simply hand over leadership to one of the many capable leaders in the ministry , the ministry largely disintegrated as most of these ministers then left.   I came to see that there is often a big difference between the visible leaders and the often large amount of behind the scenes ministry that is going on not directly related to the leaders.

 

[angels4u]

1 hour ago, GandalfTheWise said:

@Jostler   I appreciate your reply.  Many years ago (over a 1/3 of a century ago, time flies), I used to be a heretic hunter (as I've come to describe it).  It is a seductive feeling of importance finding secret hidden evil that no one else notices and protecting the flock.  It is addictive.  The excitement of one discovery leads to another and then another.  And then when just a few people ooh and ahh over your spiritual acuity and sensitivity, it feeds the ego and makes you feel special.  After  time, it sadly becomes less about being in the light seeing God than spending more time digging in the dirt looking for the devil.  I like the way you phrased it:  "I feel He's urged me to just let Him worry about the  heretics and keep my focus on learning what the truth is and learning to speak it in love.  Many ARE being deceived in our day but I think the  main counter is being a light, not boasting against the darkness."   I have a serious sense of relief that I went through this before the internet or I'd have likely had a huge internet site dedicated to such things and a huge embarrassing published set of articles still floating around in cyberspace rather than a huge set of embarrassing conversations that most people have now likely forgotten.

One of the things that has brought balance for me is the path God has had me walk.  I've spent years of time in evangelical churches and ministries of most flavors and many flavors of mainline churches (notable exceptions being RCC and Eastern orthodox though I've known individual Christians from those backgrounds).  It's given me a chance to get to know and observe evangelicals with a wide range of beliefs.  I've also gotten to know many in the body of Christ (meaning that in a born-again sense) who God has ministering in mainline churches.  This means when I hear accusations against various denominations or churches or ministries, it is often an accusation against people, ministries, and churches that I've gotten to see up close and personal for myself.  This often gives me a basis for evaluating the accusations.   Real fruit of the Spirit in people's everyday lives, actions, and words is pretty hard to counterfeit for any length of time.

As a brief comment FWIW, many years ago I learned some good lessons in the aftermath of the Jimmy Swaggart and PTL scandals.  A few years after the PTL scandal, I was teaching an adult Sunday School class and spent some time on a diatribe against PTL and other such ministries.  Afterwards, my pastor pulled me to one side and pointed out a man I didn't know very well (and who incidentally never attended one of my classes again).  It turns out he'd been a full-time prayer and ministry counselor at PTL for a number of years.  It was a real ministry where people were being saved and growing in Christ.  He and others ministering there were shocked and devastated as their opportunity to minister disappeared in a day, their fellowship and ministry connections with each other were abruptly terminated, and he then had to face the stigma of being labeled a dumb gullible fool who fell for the PTL scam.   Similarly, I made some disparaging comment about Jimmy Swaggart once and a friend from Panama filled me in on many things I didn't know.  Swaggart ministries included a  number of lifelong missionaries and leaders and ministers from a number of churches and they had a large Spanish speaking ministry in central and south America.  For years prior as it was related to me, in many places, their radio broadcasts and live events were the first time many people heard the gospel in that part of the world.  When Swaggart refused to step down and simply hand over leadership to one of the many capable leaders in the ministry , the ministry largely disintegrated as most of these ministers then left.   I came to see that there is often a big difference between the visible leaders and the often large amount of behind the scenes ministry that is going on not directly related to the leaders.

 

We are to expose the darkness,it will be exposed anyway ,this whole Bethel Church is really an deceiving cult,sorry for my words, I saw enough exposed from what is going on there which is just plain demonic,the devil will expose himself as an angel of light,we have to be aware at all times and learn how to divide God's word.The Bible warns over and over to be aware of false prophets ,they are like wolves,trying to get you in the cult and brainwash you and the end will be death . ..

[Jostler]

2 hours ago, angels4u said:

We are to expose the darkness,it will be exposed anyway ,this whole Bethel Church is really an deceiving cult,sorry for my words, I saw enough exposed from what is going on there which is just plain demonic,the devil will expose himself as an angel of light,we have to be aware at all times and learn how to divide God's word.The Bible warns over and over to be aware of false prophets ,they are like wolves,trying to get you in the cult and brainwash you and the end will be death . ..

there is balance.  Knowing when to expose (and how) is a matter of obedience based on hearing.  If I  take the  task on myself out  of outrage, it is flesh.  If I do it according to His instruction, timing and method....it might have consequences for me, but it  will bear fruit.  Many ministers have  been accused by the  ACCUSER through  "saints" unwittingly walking  in the flesh and doing satan's work for  him.   Gandalf's take is full of  wisdom IMO. 

And not pointing  any fingers at you  or  this thread either....i know your heart.  And i  know  you hear.

[angels4u]

4 hours ago, Jostler said:

there is balance.  Knowing when to expose (and how) is a matter of obedience based on hearing.  If I  take the  task on myself out  of outrage, it is flesh.  If I do it according to His instruction, timing and method....it might have consequences for me, but it  will bear fruit.  Many ministers have  been accused by the  ACCUSER through  "saints" unwittingly walking  in the flesh and doing satan's work for  him.   Gandalf's take is full of  wisdom IMO. 

And not pointing  any fingers at you  or  this thread either....i know your heart.  And i  know  you hear.

I agree with you but in this case it's giving people awareness for what's from God and what isn't,I'm the last one judging people as I have no right to judge,God is the judge of all things but this case is pretty blatant.

I appreciate Gandalf and he knows that