1 JOHN ONLY ISRAEL CAN BE BORN AGAIN

[douge]

1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 John 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.

1 John 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

1 John 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

1 John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

In all of the above verses John is addressing those who are "born of God".

Whosoever is born of God, does not commit sin, loves his brother, overcomes the world, keeps himself and that wicked one does not touch him.

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Peter distinguishes being born again, as not being born of the corruptible seed of the flesh, the natural physical descent, but rather, the incorruptible word of God.

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

John 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Israel had to believe on the name of Jesus to be born of God, not just born physically an Israelite.

Matthew 3:9 And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Israel would not enter into the Davidic kingdom on earth, and reign with Christ, by being born children of Abraham in the flesh; Israel had to be born again by the Spirit of God (John 3:5-8).

John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

It is the nation of Israel that must be born again. It is not accurate to say members of the body of Christ, in this dispensation, are born again; in all of Paul's epistles being born again is never applied to members of the body of Christ.

[Justin Adams]

Sorry, your theology is not sound. There is NO such thing as dispensationalism.

The OP statement is misleading.

Edited February 13, 2020 by Justin Adams

[Resurrection Priest]

This seems like a repeat of threads like - New Covenant only for Israel,  Israel is not the Church,  Covenant of Law vs Covenant of Grace,  etc. etc. etc.

I see lots of OT stories of individuals with the Spirit of God, who lived righteous lives (not perfect).  Their sins were forgiven, same as ours.  They looked forward to the cross when they offered sacrifice, and we look back when we eat the bread and the wine.

Genesis 41:38 And Pharaoh said to his servants, "Can we find such a one as this, a man in whom is the Spirit of God?"

Numbers 27:18 And the LORD said to Moses: "Take Joshua the son of Nun with you, a man in whom is the Spirit, and lay your hand on him;"

2Kings Cpt 4  Elisha the prophet prayed, and the young son of his friends was raised from the dead.

Daniel 5:12 He did this because Daniel, whom the king called Belteshazzar, was found to have a keen mind and knowledge and understanding, and also the ability to interpret dreams, explain riddles and solve difficult problems. Call for Daniel, and he will tell you what the writing means."

And how 'bout all those in the "faith chapter" - Hebrews 11 ?  Faith is one of the "gifts" of the Spirit.  No one just "has faith" in and of themselves.  One must open his heart to the LORD, who then gives faith. 

1 Corinthians 12:9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healings by the same Spirit,

FAITH is a gift GOD gives to us.  Not a gift we give to HIM. 

 

Hebrews 11:4 "By faith Abel offered to God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, through which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts; and through it he being dead still speaks."

Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph, Moses, Caleb, Joshua, Rahab - all these acted in faith - believing they would receive. 

Habakkuk 2:4 "Behold the proud, His soul is not upright in him; But the just shall live by his faith."  If you're "just", you've been justified (declared righteous).

Matthew 15:28 Then Jesus answered and said to her, "O woman, great is your faith! Let it be to you as you desire." And her daughter was healed from that very hour."

Acts 15:9 "and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith."
 

Edited February 13, 2020 by Resurrection Priest

[Justin Adams]

Please read what James said in the Jerusalem meeting when the apostles were telling them of the works God had wrought among the gentiles. Peter also reiterates that the Spirit was given at Cornelius' house, and James re-purposes Amos to give the gentile mission full status and backing of the Jerusalem Council. 

The gentiles were now fully accepted and the mission of Yahweh to regather the nations was underway and fully recognized. The Nations were now in process of redemption just as were the Israeli peoples.

[douge]

15 hours ago, Walter Goraj jr said:

"It is the nation of Israel that must be born again. It is not accurate to say members of the body of Christ, in this dispensation, are born again; in all of Paul's epistles being born again is never applied to members of the body of Christ."

Not sure if I follow you here. There seems to be this error by many to separate. Jewish people from non-jewish people When it comes to the nature of salvation. We are saved by The same Spirit (Acts 4:12).

Being born again was told to a Jew under the law and directed to Israel by Christ during his earthly ministry. At that time there was a separation between Israel and Gentiles Ephesians 2:14

[douge]

On 2/15/2020 at 4:37 PM, Walter Goraj jr said:

Are you actually saying that Christians are not born again (from above)  but Jews are? 

You can use that term, but it is not scriptural. We are justified unto eternal life. Paul never says the church in this dispensation is born again.

[missmuffet]

On 2/13/2020 at 6:38 AM, douge said:

1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1 John 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.

1 John 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

1 John 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

1 John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.

In all of the above verses John is addressing those who are "born of God".

Whosoever is born of God, does not commit sin, loves his brother, overcomes the world, keeps himself and that wicked one does not touch him.

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Peter distinguishes being born again, as not being born of the corruptible seed of the flesh, the natural physical descent, but rather, the incorruptible word of God.

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

John 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Israel had to believe on the name of Jesus to be born of God, not just born physically an Israelite.

Matthew 3:9 And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Israel would not enter into the Davidic kingdom on earth, and reign with Christ, by being born children of Abraham in the flesh; Israel had to be born again by the Spirit of God (John 3:5-8).

John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

It is the nation of Israel that must be born again. It is not accurate to say members of the body of Christ, in this dispensation, are born again; in all of Paul's epistles being born again is never applied to members of the body of Christ.

I do not support your theology. All those who have genuinely asked Jesus Christ into their life and have a daily relationship with God are born again Christians. 

[douge]

18 hours ago, missmuffet said:

I do not support your theology. All those who have genuinely asked Jesus Christ into their life and have a daily relationship with God are born again Christians. 

You can say that we are born again, but there is no scriptural support for it.

Sorry, we do not become justified unto eternal life by asking Christ into or life or having a daily relationship...........

We believe the gospel and trust in the redemption of Christ:

This is the gospel by which we are saved.

1 Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
We are all sinners who can not save ourselves.
See Romans 3:23 Titus 3:5 Romans 5:6

Christ died for our sins; He was our substitute, He paid the full penalty and debt for our sin by his blood sacrifice.
See 2 Corinthians 5:21  Romans 3:24 Romans 3:25 Romans 3:26

He was buried.

He rose again for our justification ( to declare us righteous) and forgiveness of all our sin. He gives us His righteousness and eternal life.
See     Romans 4:25  Ephesians 1:7  Romans 4:22 Romans 4:23 Romans 4:24 1 Corinthians 1:30

All we have to do is believe the gospel.
See Romans 4:5 1 Corinthians 1:21 Ephesians 1:13

Believing is being persuaded that something is true.
See Romans 4:21

The moment you believe you have eternal life.
Titus 1:1 Titus 1:2 Titus 3:7 

Trust the gospel of your salvation. Believe in Jesus Christ to have provided payment for your sins and to give you eternal life. Place your faith in Jesus Christ, in his blood, his death and his resurrection.

[Retrobyter]

On 2/14/2020 at 9:48 PM, charisenexcelsis said:

In Christ, there is no Jew and Gentile.

Shalom, charisenexcelsis.

Right. "IN CHRIST!" That is "IN THE JEWISH MESSIAH!" However OUTSIDE of the Messiah there most certainly IS a distinction between "Jew and Gentile!"

Romans 3:1-4 (KJV)

1 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision? 2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God. 3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect? 4 God forbid (Greek: Mee genoito = "Never may-it-be!"): yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

[Retrobyter]

On 2/17/2020 at 3:39 PM, douge said:

You can say that we are born again, but there is no scriptural support for it.

Sorry, we do not become justified unto eternal life by asking Christ into or life or having a daily relationship...........

We believe the gospel and trust in the redemption of Christ:

This is the gospel by which we are saved.

1 Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
We are all sinners who can not save ourselves.
See Romans 3:23 Titus 3:5 Romans 5:6

Christ died for our sins; He was our substitute, He paid the full penalty and debt for our sin by his blood sacrifice.
See 2 Corinthians 5:21  Romans 3:24 Romans 3:25 Romans 3:26

He was buried.

He rose again for our justification ( to declare us righteous) and forgiveness of all our sin. He gives us His righteousness and eternal life.
See     Romans 4:25  Ephesians 1:7  Romans 4:22 Romans 4:23 Romans 4:24 1 Corinthians 1:30

All we have to do is believe the gospel.
See Romans 4:5 1 Corinthians 1:21 Ephesians 1:13

Believing is being persuaded that something is true.
See Romans 4:21

The moment you believe you have eternal life.
Titus 1:1 Titus 1:2 Titus 3:7 

Trust the gospel of your salvation. Believe in Jesus Christ to have provided payment for your sins and to give you eternal life. Place your faith in Jesus Christ, in his blood, his death and his resurrection.

Shalom, douge.

Well, yes and no. You've forgotten that we are ONE in the Messiah. So, .... 

If a child of Israel must be "born again" to be in the Messiah, how does a Gentile come into the Messiah?

The answer to your dilemma is found in Ephesians 2:

Ephesians 2:1-22 (KJV)

1 And you (Gentile Ephesians) hath he quickened (made alive), who were dead in trespasses and sins; 2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: 3 Among whom also we all had our conversation (lifestyle) in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. 4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened US TOGETHER with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) 6 And hath raised US up TOGETHER, and made US sit TOGETHER in heavenly places in Christ Jesus (in the Messiah Yeshua`): 7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward US through Christ Jesus (through the Messiah Yeshua`). 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For WE are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus (created in the Messiah Yeshua`) unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called "Uncircumcision" by that which is called "the Circumcision" in the flesh made by hands; 12 That at that time ye were ...
without Christ (outside of the Messiah),
being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel,
and strangers from the covenants of promise,
having no hope, and
without God in the world: 

13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. 14 For he is OUR peace, who hath made BOTH ONE, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between US; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of TWAIN (TWO) ONE new man, so making peace; 16 And that he might reconcile BOTH unto God in ONE body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: 17 And came and preached peace to you (Gentile Ephesians) which were afar off, and to them (children of Israel) that were nigh (close; near). 18 For through him WE BOTH have access by ONE Spirit unto the Father.

19 Now therefore ye (Gentile Ephesians) are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints (holy ones; the children of Israel), and of the household of God; 20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles (NT) and prophets (OT), Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone (the head angle stone; the capstone); 21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: 22 In whom ye (Gentile Ephesians) also are builded TOGETHER for an habitation of God through the Spirit.