Alive Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 22 Topic Count: 194 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 11,054 Content Per Day: 6.38 Reputation: 9,018 Days Won: 36 Joined: 09/12/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/09/1956 Share Posted April 25, 2020 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Gideon said: LOL, really? What did I miss in the question? 3,841 words, and I still missed the question?? What the heck?? As fair play, are you willing to answer a question if I ask you? Not that I have one, mind, you, but hypothetically? I promise I will come up with a doozy. Gids I am not playing games, here Gideon. I told you I thought you were smart enough to know what the question was and it has to do with the Cross and what happens there. There is not a thing in this universe as important than that. I laid out the question very carefully and very clearly...you simply didn't answer. Edited April 25, 2020 by Alive 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alive Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 22 Topic Count: 194 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 11,054 Content Per Day: 6.38 Reputation: 9,018 Days Won: 36 Joined: 09/12/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/09/1956 Share Posted April 25, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, DustyRoad said: Faced with a "choice" between men and the Lord I choose Jesus Christ; His Spirit teaches me and leads me into all truth. Even as a "babe" in Christ I understand the difference between men who stumble about browbeating others and those whom the Lord sends... the former issues demands while God's Spirit convicts and witnesses to my own spirit. My desire to make peace with you, @Alive, didn't come attached with a pathetic demand to see things "my way." That, however, is precisely what you returned to me. I'll continue to pray for you. Dusty--what in the world are you talking about? I simply said I would pray that the Lord will lead you to Truth--that means the Holy Spirit you just mentioned. And I did pray that way. Wow! You are seeing stuff that ain't there, man. Browbeating? Wow! That isn't me at all and I have done none of that stuff. I reckon I should leave you alone in the future...again, God bless you. Edited April 25, 2020 by Alive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhchristian Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 136 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 2,488 Content Per Day: 1.38 Reputation: 1,325 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/29/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted April 25, 2020 51 minutes ago, Alive said: only one of these viewpoints can be correct. Not so @Alive I Fully agree with your doctrine of Salvation by grace and being kept grace But I also believe we are sanctified by grace,which is not a work we do, but a work the Holy Ghost does in us when we "Hunger and thirst for righteousness" Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled. (Matt. 5:6) Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: (Eph. 4:13) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alive Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 22 Topic Count: 194 Topics Per Day: 0.11 Content Count: 11,054 Content Per Day: 6.38 Reputation: 9,018 Days Won: 36 Joined: 09/12/2019 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/09/1956 Share Posted April 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, dhchristian said: Not so @Alive I Fully agree with your doctrine of Salvation by grace and being kept grace But I also believe we are sanctified by grace,which is not a work we do, but a work the Holy Ghost does in us when we "Hunger and thirst for righteousness" Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled. (Matt. 5:6) Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: (Eph. 4:13) What in the world are you talking about...man, this is nuts. Not so, what? Salvation is not the same as a process of sanctification. I am only discussing Salvation. Gideon continues to go off into that realm instead of dealing with the first and once again causing confusion. God is not the author of confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 14 Topic Count: 79 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,177 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 826 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/04/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted April 25, 2020 48 minutes ago, Blood Bought 1953 said: It took you a barrel of computer ink to get there, lol , but your final sentence told me everything I need to know.....you allow a lot of leeway , but your Doctrine still comes down to one that is Performance Based. I Believe That our Security * IS * BULLETPROOF.........Why? “ ALL that come to me through My Son, “ I” will save to the UTTERMOST”. That is merely one of hundreds of Iron-Clad verses. How does ANYBODY explain away just that ONE verse? I have asked you to explain it to me and an on- looking World, But as usual , you evade it.Until you show otherwise , I will put you with the rest of the Multitude—- “ Jesus Saves, BUT!” Jesus Blood is Necessary, it’s just not “ Sufficient” on its own. ....God’s Grace goes VERY far— but it does not go farther than sin—- watch your step! We are “ secure”, but only up to a certain point! “ Saving to the Uttermost” does not really MEAN “ Saving to the Uttermost.” Please show how you explain that away.....no lengthy evasions this time.....please...... Brother, I have pointed out to you that OSAS teaching in the hearts of many believers is simply not as ironclad as you present it. You not once have explained the reasoning for the warnings, nor their "ironclad" refutibg of what you accept as truth, but have simply brushed them aside as if they did not exist. You have not responded in love to any who do not agree with you here, not just me, but rather have come back with harshness, rudeness, sarcasm and outright personal attacks. You have danced around calling any who do not accept your view of the truth as a heretic, only because if you said it out loud, you. might be disciplined or banned. I get that I cannot convince you to even look at other possibilities. i accept your position is yours. It is not mine. But I would like you to consider one thing, given that there are scriptures on both sides of the fence, wherher or not you are willing to acknowledge them. Think for a minute. If you are right, will anything I say affect theeternal reward of those who read what I present? Not one iota, right? But if you are incorrect and pushing a misunderstood grace that no longer even needs repentance to work, something curiously that the Bible tells is will be exactly the case in the last days, what could. be the cost be to those who hang on your every word? The purpose of this post was to remind readers that it is he that doeth righteousness who is righteous, even as he is righteous. Truth properly understood and walked in produces a gentle spirit, not a striving one. Love emanating through us is the ultimate acid test. If we exhibit grace and the fruits of the Spirit in how we interact with others, especially those who may disagree with us, it reveals God is at work in that persons heart, even if they may presently be found in error. If, however, in ones' interactions, they come off like the Pharisees did, and want to go for the jugular, because they think God needs defending, and respond with impatience, lack of kindness, no humility and zero displayable love, something is wrong. If they constantly toot their own horn as to how knowledgeable they are, if they lay traps to catch their opponent with their words, despite saying they are not doing so, rhis much is evident. Their old nature is on full display. it does not necessarily mean they are wrong, but it certainly should give seekers of the truth pause. I mean no disrespect here. I have patiently and with kindness tried to build a bridge of communication to discuss our differences. I see your scriptures and can understand why you might believe as you do. But if we are both honest, the same cannot be said about you. It is your way only and anyone who opposes you must not be saved or they would not believe such poppycock, right? Who knows? In the end you may be right as to your view of OSAS.. Frankly, if you were, I would be thrilled. I do not want to see any miss Heaven. But sadly, if I am honest, you have not exactly been the shining example of how to deal with other brothers in the Lord that are currently not of the same opinion as you. I do not say this to hurt or offend you. I simply hope you take this to heart and pray about it. We are all capable of being in error and God will faithfully correct us if we start going too far off the tracks. There is certainly nothing wrong with being fully convinced as to what the truth really is on any matter, and I find it admirable when a man or woman can care so much they are rooted strongly in their understanding. It is how we deal with others as we stand on what we see as the truth which is at issue here. Regardless, I wish God's full blessing upon you. I hold no animosity. I have stated what I felt needed to be said and will say no more as to your actions. May God lead both of us into HIS truth, no matter what it is. Amen and amen. be blessed, Gideon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 14 Topic Count: 79 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,177 Content Per Day: 0.30 Reputation: 826 Days Won: 1 Joined: 10/04/2013 Status: Offline Author Share Posted April 25, 2020 I feel like everyone has certainly had their opportunity to get their views heard on this subject. It sure ended up off the rails of its original intent so in order to get it back on the rails before this thread is closed as I have just requested, I would like to tell everyone, regardless of your viewpoints expressed here, that we are brothers and sisters in the Lord and that I love each snd every one of you and am praying for your blessing, however God chooses to do it. I also covet your prayers that I too would grow closer to the Lord in both wisdom, understanding and action. Lord knows I need it. ? blessings to all, Gids 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sower Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 14 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,301 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 5,921 Days Won: 1 Joined: 07/09/2009 Status: Online Share Posted April 25, 2020 1 hour ago, Alive said: @Gideon--you didn't answer the question. I won't ask again. 1 hour ago, Alive said: I am not playing games, here Gideon. I told you I thought you were smart enough to know what the question was and it has to do with the Cross and what happens there. There is not a thing in this universe as important than that. I laid out the question very carefully and very clearly...you simply didn't answer. "INSISTENCE IS FUTILE! " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhchristian Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 136 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 2,488 Content Per Day: 1.38 Reputation: 1,325 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/29/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted April 25, 2020 Just now, Alive said: What in the world are you talking about...man, this is nuts. Not so, what? Salvation is not the same as a process of sanctification. I am only discussing Salvation. Gideon continues to go off into that realm instead of dealing with the first and once again causing confusion. God is not the author of confusion. I Disagree with the Words @Gideon is using to describe what he is saying. I Believe in eternal security, He does not. You and I agree on that. But what he is expressing has some truth in it that you are missing, His words for things are not right but the Truth of them is there. You as a born again believer can choose to live in the fact that you are born again or you can "hunger and thirst after righteousness" and arrive at the fulness of Christ. Choice is yours, and the promises of God are yours if you choose to strive for the fulness of Christ? Perhaps your lack of understanding shows the lack of desire to reach the fulness of Christ in you? Many are called, few are chosen, those who are chosen must make their calling and election sure. (2 Peter 1:10) Think of it as Paul does. I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. (Phil. 3:14) Read this verse in its full context. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Bought 1953 Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 13 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 6,726 Content Per Day: 2.82 Reputation: 6,258 Days Won: 5 Joined: 12/03/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted April 25, 2020 2 minutes ago, Gideon said: Brother, I have pointed out to you that OSAS teaching in the hearts of many believers is simply not as ironclad as you present it. You not once have explained the reasoning for the warnings, nor their "ironclad" refutibg of what you accept as truth, but have simply brushed them aside as if they did not exist. You have not responded in love to any who do not agree with you here, not just me, but rather have come back with harshness, rudeness, sarcasm and outright personal attacks. You have danced around calling any who do not accept your view of the truth as a heretic, only because if you said it out loud, you. might be disciplined or banned. I get that I cannot convince you to even look at other possibilities. i accept your position is yours. It is not mine. But I would like you to consider one thing, given that there are scriptures on both sides of the fence, wherher or not you are willing to acknowledge them. Think for a minute. If you are right, will anything I say affect theeternal reward of those who read what I present? Not one iota, right? But if you are incorrect and pushing a misunderstood grace that no longer even needs repentance to work, something curiously that the Bible tells is will be exactly the case in the last days, what could. be the cost be to those who hang on your every word? The purpose of this post was to remind readers that it is he that doeth righteousness who is righteous, even as he is righteous. Truth properly understood and walked in produces a gentle spirit, not a striving one. Love emanating through us is the ultimate acid test. If we exhibit grace and the fruits of the Spirit in how we interact with others, especially those who may disagree with us, it reveals God is at work in that persons heart, even if they may presently be found in error. If, however, in ones' interactions, they come off like the Pharisees did, and want to go for the jugular, because they think God needs defending, and respond with impatience, lack of kindness, no humility and zero displayable love, something is wrong. If they constantly toot their own horn as to how knowledgeable they are, if they lay traps to catch their opponent with their words, despite saying they are not doing so, rhis much is evident. Their old nature is on full display. it does not necessarily mean they are wrong, but it certainly should give seekers of the truth pause. I mean no disrespect here. I have patiently and with kindness tried to build a bridge of communication to discuss our differences. I see your scriptures and can understand why you might believe as you do. But if we are both honest, the same cannot be said about you. It is your way only and anyone who opposes you must not be saved or they would not believe such poppycock, right? Who knows? In the end you may be right as to your view of OSAS.. Frankly, if you were, I would be thrilled. I do not want to see any miss Heaven. But sadly, if I am honest, you have not exactly been the shining example of how to deal with other brothers in the Lord that are currently not of the same opinion as you. I do not say this to hurt or offend you. I simply hope you take this to heart and pray about it. We are all capable of being in error and God will faithfully correct us if we start going too far off the tracks. There is certainly nothing wrong with being fully convinced as to what the truth really is on any matter, and I find it admirable when a man or woman can care so much they are rooted strongly in their understanding. It is how we deal with others as we stand on what we see as the truth which is at issue here. Regardless, I wish God's full blessing upon you. I hold no animosity. I have stated what I felt needed to be said and will say no more as to your actions. May God lead both of us into HIS truth, no matter what it is. Amen and amen. be blessed, Gideon You have no idea as to the State Of my mind as I post...... I have no anger, no disrespect or anything else negative in regard to you, Personally........I bet you are a great guy . A “ great guy” who has not made it to the place God wants you to be.For your OWN SAKE, God wants to bless you with the promised “ Abundant Life” given to those that REST in the Gospel Of His Amazing Grace.I used to think like you—- I have seen both sides— you have not.I am telling you from experience that you are missing out on the total joy that is out there just waiting to be had. As I post here, I am not even really thinking about you, much less trying to disrespect you......I use Legalist and those with weak, confused faith as “ Springboards” to get the Truth Of “ Nothing But The Blood” out there so that when we return to our churches and sing that song, we would not be found to be liars and hypocrites .Who wants that? I want Newbies to get started out on the right foot as they begin to walk this wonderful , Joyous Walk Of Faith....... I just read the first sentence or two of your post .....I kinda knew what was coming ( no answer to my question, of course )..... I am in a hurry, but I will get back to it......I consider you a Brother....It is your Doctrine that I abhor .........sometimes there appears to be an overlap......please ignore it......God Bless.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Behold Posted April 25, 2020 Group: Mars Hill Followers: 7 Topic Count: 87 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 3,795 Content Per Day: 1.32 Reputation: 6 Days Won: 3 Joined: 07/30/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted April 25, 2020 (edited) 31 minutes ago, dhchristian said: I Disagree with the Words @Gideon is using to describe what he is saying. I Believe in eternal security, He does not. Yesterday he posted that he DID believe in Eternal Security. Here is the man's actual Quote. @Gideon """" "i want to confirm that i absolutely believe in Eternal security" Edited April 25, 2020 by Behold 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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