JERUSALEM IS FALLING

[ENOCH2010]

If all is past, when was Damascus destroyed? 

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14 hours ago, ENOCH2010 said:

If all is past, when was Damascus destroyed? 

2 Kings 16:9

I didn't say that all was past, but most things are past.

 

Edited September 14, 2020 by abcdef
typo

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21 hours ago, ENOCH2010 said:

If all is past, when was Damascus destroyed? 

2 Kings 16:9

Is the answer something that you didn't want to hear?

Is it something different than what you have been told is the truth?

[ENOCH2010]

Read Isaiah 17 and get back to me. 

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9 minutes ago, ENOCH2010 said:

Read Isaiah 17 and get back to me. 

Yes, it was reduced to a ruinous heap.

You think that 2 Kings 16:9 is incorrect?

[Retrobyter]

On 8/11/2020 at 3:30 PM, abcdef said:

3 1/2 DAYS AFTER JERUSALEM FALLS JESUS WILL COME FOR THE KINGDOM AND THIS PLANET WILL END IN FIRE.

Shalom, abcdef.

This statement, of course, is nonsense. You may have a very vivid imagination, but you are DEAD WRONG! Where do you get such fabrications?! My Bible tells me that God says JUST THE OPPOSITE will happen!

Yeshua` won't "come for the Kingdom"; He BRINGS the Kingdom back with Him!

Luke 19:11-27 (KJV)

11 And as they heard these things, he added and spake a parable, because he was nigh to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear. 12 He said therefore,

"A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return. 13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, 'Occupy (Do business) till I come.'

14"But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying,

"'We will not have this man to reign over us!' 

15 "And it came to pass, that when he was returned, having received the kingdom, then he commanded these servants to be called unto him, to whom he had given the money, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading. 16 Then came the first, saying,

"'Lord, thy pound hath gained ten pounds.'

17 "And he said unto him,

"'Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities.'

18 "And the second came, saying,

"'Lord, thy pound hath gained five pounds.'

19 "And he said likewise to him,

"'Be thou also over five cities.'

20 "And another came, saying,

"'Lord, behold, here is thy pound, which I have kept laid up in a napkin: 21 For I feared thee, because thou art an austere man: thou takest up that thou layedst not down, and reapest that thou didst not sow.'

22 "And he saith unto him,

"'Out of thine own mouth will I judge thee, thou wicked servant. Thou knewest that I was an austere man, taking up that I laid not down, and reaping that I did not sow: 23 Wherefore then gavest not thou my money into the bank, that at my coming I might have required mine own with usury?'

24 "And he said unto them that stood by,

"'Take from him the pound, and give it to him that hath ten pounds.'

25 "(And they said unto him,

"'Lord, he HATH ten pounds!') 

26 "'For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him. 27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me!'"

Yeshua` also said,

Matthew 25:31-46 (KJV)

31 "When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, THEN shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

34 "Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand,

"'Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: 36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.'

37 "Then shall the righteous answer him, saying,

"'Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? 38When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? 39Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?'

40 "And the King shall answer and say unto them,

"'Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.'

41 "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand,

"'Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: 43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.'

44 "Then shall they also answer him, saying,

"'Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?'

45 "Then shall he answer them, saying,

"'Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.'

46"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."

Note here, though, that Yeshua` does not have them IMMEDIATELY THROWN into the fire! He just CONSIGNS them, AS A NATION, to the "everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels."

Furthermore, this planet does NOT "END IN FIRE!" What kind of a load of malarkey are you trying to pass off as real? Let's hear from God, shall we?

Psalm 89:1-52 (KJV)

1 {Maschil (Hebrew: Maskiyl = "A Contemplation")  of Ethan the Ezrahite.}

I will sing of the mercies of the LORD for ever: with my mouth will I make known thy faithfulness to all generations.
2 For I have said, Mercy shall be built up for ever: thy faithfulness shalt thou establish in the very heavens.

3 I have made a covenant with my chosen, I have sworn unto David my servant,
4 Thy seed will I establish for ever, and build up thy throne to all generations. Selah.

5 And the heavens shall praise thy wonders, O LORD: thy faithfulness also in the congregation of the saints.
6 For who in the heaven can be compared unto the LORD? who among the sons of the mighty can be likened unto the LORD?
7 God is greatly to be feared in the assembly of the saints, and to be had in reverence of all them that are about him.
8 O LORD God (Hebrew: YHWH Elohiym) of hosts, who is a strong LORD like unto thee? or to thy faithfulness round about thee?
9 Thou rulest the raging of the sea: when the waves thereof arise, thou stillest them.
10 Thou hast broken Rahab (Hebrew: RachaV) in pieces, as one that is slain; thou hast scattered thine enemies with thy strong arm.
11 The heavens are thine, the earth also is thine: as for the world and the fulness thereof, thou hast founded them.
12 The north and the south thou hast created them: Tabor and Hermon shall rejoice in thy name.
13 Thou hast a mighty arm: strong is thy hand, and high is thy right hand.
14 Justice and judgment are the habitation of thy throne: mercy and truth shall go before thy face.
15 Blessed is the people that know the joyful sound: they shall walk, O LORD, in the light of thy countenance.
16 In thy name shall they rejoice all the day: and in thy righteousness shall they be exalted.
17 For thou art the glory of their strength: and in thy favour our horn shall be exalted.
18 For the LORD is our defence; and the Holy One of Israel is our king.
19 Then thou spakest in vision to thy holy one (His clean one set apart), and saidst,

"I have laid help upon one that is mighty; I have exalted one chosen out of the people.
20 I have found David my servant; with my holy oil have I anointed him:
21 With whom my hand shall be established: mine arm also shall strengthen him.
22 The enemy shall not exact upon him; nor the son of wickedness afflict him.
23 And I will beat down his foes before his face, and plague them that hate him.
24 But my faithfulness and my mercy shall be with him: and in my name shall his horn be exalted.
25 I will set his hand also in the sea, and his right hand in the rivers.
26 He shall cry unto me, 'Thou art my father, my God, and the rock of my salvation!'
27 Also I will make him my firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth.
28 My mercy will I keep for him for evermore, and my covenant shall stand fast with him.
29 His seed also will I make to endure for ever, and his throne as the days of heaven (the skies).
30 If his children forsake my law, and walk not in my judgments;
31 If they break my statutes, and keep not my commandments;
32 Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes.
33 Nevertheless my lovingkindness (Hebrew: chesed = "covenant-keeping faithfulness") will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail.
34 My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.
35 Once have I sworn by my holiness that I will not lie unto David.
36 His seed shall endure for ever, and his throne as the sun before me.
37 It shall be established for ever as the moon, and as a faithful witness in heaven (in the skies). Selah.

38 But thou hast cast off and abhorred, thou hast been wroth with thine anointed.
39 Thou hast made void the covenant of thy servant: thou hast profaned his crown by casting it to the ground.
40 Thou hast broken down all his hedges; thou hast brought his strong holds to ruin.
41 All that pass by the way spoil him: he is a reproach to his neighbours.
42 Thou hast set up the right hand of his adversaries; thou hast made all his enemies to rejoice.
43 Thou hast also turned the edge of his sword, and hast not made him to stand in the battle.
44 Thou hast made his glory to cease, and cast his throne down to the ground.
45 The days of his youth hast thou shortened: thou hast covered him with shame. Selah.
46 How long, LORD? wilt thou hide thyself for ever? shall thy wrath burn like fire?
47 Remember how short my time is: wherefore hast thou made all men in vain?
48 What man is he that liveth, and shall not see death? shall he deliver his soul from the hand of the grave? Selah.
49 Lord, where are thy former lovingkindnesses, which thou swarest unto David in thy truth?
50 Remember, Lord, the reproach of thy servants; how I do bear in my bosom the reproach of all the mighty people;
51 Wherewith thine enemies have reproached, O LORD; wherewith they have reproached the footsteps of thine anointed.
52 Blessed be the LORD for evermore. Amen, and Amen.

Also, He spoke through His servant, Shlomoh ("Solomon"):

Ecclesiastes 1:4 (KJV)

4 One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

 

 

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10 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Shalom, abcdef.

This statement, of course, is nonsense. You may have a very vivid imagination, but you are DEAD WRONG! Where do you get such fabrications?! My Bible tells me that God says JUST THE OPPOSITE will happen!

Hi Retrobyter,

You may see it as not making much sense, at first, because most have a preconceived timeline, usually pretrib., which some are unable to escape.  

As it can be explained to the patient and those who are willing to continue, it will be found to be, not quite as unlikely as it first appears.

I'm going to assume that you will read some of the previous posts to understand my position more clearly.

I got my position from reading the Bible with an open mind, without a preconceived time line, and without "gaps", after 70 AD.

As far as just the opposite happening, I believe we will both find out in a very short time.  

 

10 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Yeshua` won't "come for the Kingdom"; He BRINGS the Kingdom back with Him!

Jesus will never set foot on this planet again.

He is coming for us, the kingdom, but we will not be returning to this planet again.

The theory that we will return to planet earth is full of contradictions.

-------

No one can see the face of Jesus in His glory and live, EX 33:20.

His returning in His glory to this planet would kill everyone who sees His face, ending all human life on this planet.

 

10 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Luke 19:11-27 (KJV)

11 And as they heard these things, he added and spake a parable, because he was nigh to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear. 12 He said therefore,

"A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return. 13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, 'Occupy (Do business) till I come.'

14"But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying,

"'We will not have this man to reign over us!' 

15 "And it came to pass, that when he was returned, having received the kingdom, then he commanded these servants to be called unto him, to whom he had given the money, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading. 16 Then came the first, saying,

"'Lord, thy pound hath gained ten pounds.'

17 "And he said unto him,

"'Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities.'

18 "And the second came, saying,

"'Lord, thy pound hath gained five pounds.'

19 "And he said likewise to him,

"'Be thou also over five cities.'

20 "And another came, saying,

"'Lord, behold, here is thy pound, which I have kept laid up in a napkin: 21 For I feared thee, because thou art an austere man: thou takest up that thou layedst not down, and reapest that thou didst not sow.'

22 "And he saith unto him,

"'Out of thine own mouth will I judge thee, thou wicked servant. Thou knewest that I was an austere man, taking up that I laid not down, and reaping that I did not sow: 23 Wherefore then gavest not thou my money into the bank, that at my coming I might have required mine own with usury?'

24 "And he said unto them that stood by,

"'Take from him the pound, and give it to him that hath ten pounds.'

25 "(And they said unto him,

"'Lord, he HATH ten pounds!') 

26 "'For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him. 27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me!'"

Yeshua` also said,

Matthew 25:31-46 (KJV)

31 "When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, THEN shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: 32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: 33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

34 "Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand,

"'Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: 35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: 36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.'

37 "Then shall the righteous answer him, saying,

"'Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? 38When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? 39Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?'

40 "And the King shall answer and say unto them,

"'Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.'

41 "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand,

"'Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: 43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.'

44 "Then shall they also answer him, saying,

"'Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?'

45 "Then shall he answer them, saying,

"'Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.'

46"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."

Note here, though, that Yeshua` does not have them IMMEDIATELY THROWN into the fire! He just CONSIGNS them, AS A NATION, to the "everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels."

Both of these scriptures show part of the period after 70 AD that pretrib "skips" over, the "gap", when Israel is scattered among the gentile nations.

When our Jesus comes for the kingdom at the resur/rapt, then it is the judgment as seen in Rev 20:10-15.

-------

It says that they go away into everlasting punishment, it is an assumption that the punishment is not immediate.

Do the righteous go immediately into eternal life? I believe that they do. It would seem then that the unrighteous would also face immediate consequences. 

 

10 hours ago, Retrobyter said:

Furthermore, this planet does NOT "END IN FIRE!" What kind of a load of malarkey are you trying to pass off as real? Let's hear from God, shall we?

Psalm 89:1-52 (KJV)

1 {Maschil (Hebrew: Maskiyl = "A Contemplation")  of Ethan the Ezrahite.}

I will sing of the mercies of the LORD for ever: with my mouth will I make known thy faithfulness to all generations.
2 For I have said, Mercy shall be built up for ever: thy faithfulness shalt thou establish in the very heavens.

3 I have made a covenant with my chosen, I have sworn unto David my servant,
4 Thy seed will I establish for ever, and build up thy throne to all generations. Selah.

5 And the heavens shall praise thy wonders, O LORD: thy faithfulness also in the congregation of the saints.
6 For who in the heaven can be compared unto the LORD? who among the sons of the mighty can be likened unto the LORD?
7 God is greatly to be feared in the assembly of the saints, and to be had in reverence of all them that are about him.
8 O LORD God (Hebrew: YHWH Elohiym) of hosts, who is a strong LORD like unto thee? or to thy faithfulness round about thee?
9 Thou rulest the raging of the sea: when the waves thereof arise, thou stillest them.
10 Thou hast broken Rahab (Hebrew: RachaV) in pieces, as one that is slain; thou hast scattered thine enemies with thy strong arm.
11 The heavens are thine, the earth also is thine: as for the world and the fulness thereof, thou hast founded them.
12 The north and the south thou hast created them: Tabor and Hermon shall rejoice in thy name.
13 Thou hast a mighty arm: strong is thy hand, and high is thy right hand.
14 Justice and judgment are the habitation of thy throne: mercy and truth shall go before thy face.
15 Blessed is the people that know the joyful sound: they shall walk, O LORD, in the light of thy countenance.
16 In thy name shall they rejoice all the day: and in thy righteousness shall they be exalted.
17 For thou art the glory of their strength: and in thy favour our horn shall be exalted.
18 For the LORD is our defence; and the Holy One of Israel is our king.
19 Then thou spakest in vision to thy holy one (His clean one set apart), and saidst,

"I have laid help upon one that is mighty; I have exalted one chosen out of the people.
20 I have found David my servant; with my holy oil have I anointed him:
21 With whom my hand shall be established: mine arm also shall strengthen him.
22 The enemy shall not exact upon him; nor the son of wickedness afflict him.
23 And I will beat down his foes before his face, and plague them that hate him.
24 But my faithfulness and my mercy shall be with him: and in my name shall his horn be exalted.
25 I will set his hand also in the sea, and his right hand in the rivers.
26 He shall cry unto me, 'Thou art my father, my God, and the rock of my salvation!'
27 Also I will make him my firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth.
28 My mercy will I keep for him for evermore, and my covenant shall stand fast with him.
29 His seed also will I make to endure for ever, and his throne as the days of heaven (the skies).
30 If his children forsake my law, and walk not in my judgments;
31 If they break my statutes, and keep not my commandments;
32 Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes.
33 Nevertheless my lovingkindness (Hebrew: chesed = "covenant-keeping faithfulness") will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail.
34 My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.
35 Once have I sworn by my holiness that I will not lie unto David.
36 His seed shall endure for ever, and his throne as the sun before me.
37 It shall be established for ever as the moon, and as a faithful witness in heaven (in the skies). Selah.

38 But thou hast cast off and abhorred, thou hast been wroth with thine anointed.
39 Thou hast made void the covenant of thy servant: thou hast profaned his crown by casting it to the ground.
40 Thou hast broken down all his hedges; thou hast brought his strong holds to ruin.
41 All that pass by the way spoil him: he is a reproach to his neighbours.
42 Thou hast set up the right hand of his adversaries; thou hast made all his enemies to rejoice.
43 Thou hast also turned the edge of his sword, and hast not made him to stand in the battle.
44 Thou hast made his glory to cease, and cast his throne down to the ground.
45 The days of his youth hast thou shortened: thou hast covered him with shame. Selah.
46 How long, LORD? wilt thou hide thyself for ever? shall thy wrath burn like fire?
47 Remember how short my time is: wherefore hast thou made all men in vain?
48 What man is he that liveth, and shall not see death? shall he deliver his soul from the hand of the grave? Selah.
49 Lord, where are thy former lovingkindnesses, which thou swarest unto David in thy truth?
50 Remember, Lord, the reproach of thy servants; how I do bear in my bosom the reproach of all the mighty people;
51 Wherewith thine enemies have reproached, O LORD; wherewith they have reproached the footsteps of thine anointed.
52 Blessed be the LORD for evermore. Amen, and Amen.

Also, He spoke through His servant, Shlomoh ("Solomon"):

Ecclesiastes 1:4 (KJV)

4 One generation passeth away, and another generation cometh: but the earth abideth for ever.

The new earth of heaven, the spiritual heaven and earth of Rev 21, will abide forever, not the planet earth.

The time when this planet ceases to be is after Rev 20:11, when this universe and planet fly away from Jesus on His throne.

-------

Gen 9:22, "While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease."

When it says "While the earth remaineth", it indicates a time when the earth and the things mentioned will cease to be.

That there is a time when the earth will, not remain.

[abcdef]

19 hours ago, ENOCH2010 said:

Read Isaiah 17 and get back to me. 

Have you read Isaiah 17?

Maybe you only read the verses that you wanted to, abandoning the context of the rest of the chapter.

It shows Israel during the Assyrian domination, vs 3-6.

-------

But right to the center of the matter.

Show me a picture of the city of Damascus, it's streets and buildings, after it was demolished by the king of Assyria.

You cannot.

You may say, "I can show you a picture of another city called Damascus, with different streets and buildings, built in the same place."

But the modern city is not the Damascus that was destroyed by the king of Assyria.

The city that was destroyed by the king of Assyria is gone forever,

It has ceased from being a city forever.

Edited September 15, 2020 by abcdef
typo

[Montana Marv]

6 hours ago, abcdef said:

Jesus will never set foot on this planet again.

He is coming for us, the kingdom, but we will not be returning to this planet again.

The theory that we will return to planet earth is full of contradictions.

Dead wrong; Blindly wrong; Just wrong

Zech 14:4 - On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley,, with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south.  v8 - On that day living water will flow out from Jerusalem v. 9 The Lord will be king over the whole earth.

Ezk 43 - Then the man brought me to the gate facing east, and I saw the glory of the God of Israel coming from the East.  His voice was like the roar of rushing waters, and the land was radiant with his glory.  The glory of the Lord entered the temple through the gate facing east.  Then the glory of the Lord filled the Temple. 7 - Son of man, this is the place of my throne and the place for the soles of my feet.  This is where I will like among the Israelites forever.

But this is forum, and your views are being critiqued.

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

[abcdef]

3 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Dead wrong; Blindly wrong; Just wrong

Wrong before hearing what I have to say?

Sometimes things look different, after they are discussed.

 

3 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Zech 14:4 - On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley,, with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south.  v8 - On that day living water will flow out from Jerusalem v. 9 The Lord will be king over the whole earth.

The Zech 14 passage is about the day of the Lord 70 AD destruction of Jerusalem vs 1,2.

After Jesus stood on the Mount, Jerusalem was divided and the people were carried away by Rome.

The people did flee according to the prophecies of Jesus.

The living waters are the Holy Spirit that was given on the day of Pentecost, it flows to to the gentile nations after Israel rejected the kingdom/church. Jn 4:11-14.

Jesus is ruling the earth, the kingdom/church since Pentecost.(Not the planet Earth)

 

3 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

Ezk 43 - Then the man brought me to the gate facing east, and I saw the glory of the God of Israel coming from the East.  His voice was like the roar of rushing waters, and the land was radiant with his glory.  The glory of the Lord entered the temple through the gate facing east.  Then the glory of the Lord filled the Temple. 7 - Son of man, this is the place of my throne and the place for the soles of my feet.  This is where I will like among the Israelites forever.

The place of His eternal throne among the people of Israel is now in heaven, Heb 12:22-24.

 

3 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

But this is forum, and your views are being critiqued.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Critique away! Bring it on! Don't stop! Time is running out! Hurry!

----

Try answering this question, 

Ex 33:20, says that no one can see His face in His glory and live.

So if Jesus returned to this planet in His glory,

Every human life on this planet would end.

So how is it possible that He returns in His glory, as some say, to rule in His glory, on planet earth? Every human would die. 

Can you answer?