Advice to help a suicidal friend?

[LonerAndy]

1 minute ago, other one said:

well, I'd have to talk to your family to know the details, but they do keep bailing you out so there is something positive in your relationship that you are missing, and that's the problem with most suicide prone people.   They only see the down side of things.

I can only think of one person in this world that I knew personally that I was glad to see die...  he got beat to death in a bar fight.  He was so sorry-evil spirited that the preacher at his funeral service told his kids that their dad was burning in hell and if they didn't change their ways they were headed there right behind him...  He's the only person I know that everyone was better off without him.

Personally I would miss seeing your  posts.    Not sure if that's worth staying alive for, but it's just little things like that which can add up.   You have one big problem and you place your worth on that one problem not taking into account all the other things that make up a relationship.   And it's those things the make knowing you worth while.    Putting everything into that one problem does make you prone to wanting to check out....    and whoever does that hurts the people around them...   and I know from experience that their close friends and family really never get over it.

Yeah, I'm sure my parents would be sad, for what reason is beyond me.  I have no close, or even distant friends, so that's not a problem.

I have no idea what other things make up a relationship, but it's a thought.

Proverbs 13:12 says Hope deferred makes the heart sick, but a dream fulfilled is a tree of life.

I have no dreams, and haven't in 30 years.  And as far as hope... I don't know what I would hope for at this point.

So I'm always curious what advice people give to those who are suicidal, because I can't imagine what advice would change anything.  It's just curious for me to hear what others come up with as a reason to keep on keeping on for no other reason than to keep on.

[MiraculousFaith]

On 10/21/2020 at 4:23 PM, Marathoner said:

The Lord bless you for being such a comfort to your friend. I lived with severe depression accompanied by suicidal ideations for many years so I have some insight into what your friend is going through, @MiraculousFaith.

Medication was of no effect and neither were various therapeutic methods. Nothing seemed to affect the cycles I endured. I reacted adversely to most psychotropic medications; they would either make me ill or magnify symptoms, making things much worse than they were without them.  

Take her word for it: she experiences suicidal ideations but has no intention of acting upon them. I've been there myself. The simple fact that you're "there" makes all the difference for your friend. Making yourself available with no strings attached is every bit as important as praying for her sake. Pray with her if she's willing. 

Encourage your friend in the Lord. Yes, even the servants of the Lord despair of living. Read 1 Kings 19 with her where you'll both discover how Elijah, the prophet of the Lord, fled to the wilderness in fear of Jezebel and asked the Lord to take his life. Read the book of Job to discover how a man whom the Lord proclaimed as righteous --- there was one on earth like His servant Job ---  cursed the day he was born from his mother's womb.  

Look to the Psalms where we learn that God has regard for the affliction of the afflicted... He will never turn His face away from those who suffer. Finally, remind your friend of the work which Christ Jesus started in her, that He is faithful to finish this work to the glory of God. We are being transformed by the Spirit to conform to the image of Christ from glory to glory, which can also mean "from one trial to the next."

I'm living proof that there is indeed an end to the darkness of despair.  
 

 

On 10/21/2020 at 4:50 PM, other one said:

I have had several friends and acquaintances commit suicide over the years including a niece with two little girls....

In every case toward the end they had convinced themselves that everyone would be better off without them...

If she's considering it herself make sure she knows in her heart that others would not be better off without her.  You and the others she knows need to show her she's needed in whatever ways are between them....    people can withstand a lot of mental anguish, but being a total burden on all your friends and family is just not tolerable to most people.

 

On 10/21/2020 at 1:43 PM, missmuffet said:

I hope your friend is seeing a professional mental health provider or a doctor. Sometimes we want to help but if we do not have the professional training we can make matters worse. If a person really needs a medication provided by a professional they should take that medication and not go off of it. That is where a serious problem can begin. You need to get the person stable. 

 

On 10/21/2020 at 12:22 PM, BeauJangles said:

These are important mental health care factors that do go co-jointly hand in hand. The problem is this. It is far easier to surmise the complications of individual needs first of all giving proper assessment. Then lining up decent psychological and or psychiatric care is a difficult match up. Cost is also insurmountable and if your income or insurance insufficient, there are difficulties lining decent patient/physician relations. Medication can be a long journey of exploration. Not all respond the same according to the symptoms and it's trial-and-error situation in many instances. Try to help your friend if you can with this so she doesn't get lost in the "system". 

 

On 10/21/2020 at 2:38 AM, Iamnikki said:

I personally am NOT going through clinical depression.. But I also have friends who are going through that and are suicidal. I also became depressed before. I admire your love for your friend, and your willingness to help her  What I've learned so far, is that it is very important to them to know they're not alone, and not isolated... Continue being there for your friend, even if you don't have to say anything. But be mindful of your own health also. If she mentions any plans she has for suicide... I think it's best to keep away any dangerous items in the house. Usually when they are in their lowest, they won't accept any advice or prescription u give, but will NEED your presence to be there. (Presence/listening > words)  you can bring her food sometimes (if u can). Continue to pray for her, and it's also good if she's part of a prayer/small group. It is not easy for them to reach out to people, so we have to check on them every now and then.
Does she go to counselling? It's BEST if she does.

Other advice I got:
1. Don't promise that it will be gone soon.
2. Don't judge and don't blame her.
3. Don't solve her problems.
4. Don't do things out of PITY.
5. Don't minimize her feelings.
6. Don't abandon.
7. If you're listening, don't tell your stories. (Prioritize hers.)

Hope this could somehow help.  will pray for your friend.

 

On 10/21/2020 at 5:39 AM, AnOrangeCat said:

Good advice in the above post, and yes, there can be a spiritual warfare element to it all. Despite all the focus on the chemical imbalance a lot of psychiatrists actually see it as a far more complicated thing. Sometimes the meds CAN trigger or worsen it and the withdrawals can range from relatively painless to brutal. Sometimes depression can be tied to our pasts or present situation. Diet and the amount of sleep we get can factor in there. It's important for her to look at her life from a variety of angles. If there are any things that can be identified as contributing to the depression, address them if possible. If sleep or diet are poor that needs to be handled. If she's feeling suicidal while on medication that she's been on for more than a month it might be time to switch and brace for the withdrawal.

 

On 10/21/2020 at 11:01 AM, Faith 23 said:

All great advice given above. Does she have health insurance? I would consider talking to her about a longer treatment program than just a couple days in the hospital. Somewhere that can help with underlying issues and also correct medication. 

I didn't know how else to respond to every one of you without making a couple dozen posts, so I want to sum up everything in one so all have the same info.

 

I'm flattered by all the responses, and I want to thank you all very much first of all.

 

Second: addressing the concern about counseling. Yes, she is definitely in counseling, therapy, has psych appointments, etc., and has been on multiple meds for the past few years. She is currently in heavy treatment and also legally required for related reasons to receive that treatment.

I don't pretend to know what her life is like and I applaud her for how far she has come since I met her even. It wasn't very long ago that I experienced suicidal thoughts, and not too many years ago that I acted on them. I sort of agree with the notion about advice: there's only so much you can say or do before someone tunes you out or chooses not to believe what they're hearing. In my own experience, I didn't want pity, I wanted help. I try not to pity her (though I feel bad for her in the pain sense, because I know it's painful -- perhaps more than my own pain was) and I have just been there for her.

I think what makes this hard for both me and her is the nature of her current bout of depression. She says she feels guilty and as if she's making wrong decisions that affect her life and others (which, again, is unfortunately true). She doesn't feel like she has a great relationship with God right now and every offer of prayer from me or others has pretty much been denied. I think if she really felt desperate she would welcome it (as more of a last resort). I personally take it as a somewhat good sign of simple disconnect; she's more worried about her doubt than her doubt should worry her. I just hate that it's contributing to the depression currently, and if I could make that part go away, I would.

So because of all this, I ended up telling her that everything she's asking the "why" questions for is completely normal (because it is). And that she should not feel bad about thinking through faith and religious beliefs. That God will guide her through those things, and all she needs to do is lean on Him for that spiritual guidance.

As far as mental help, I only hope she will rehab fully and be consistent about her treatment. I always always always encourage her to continue treating her physical and mental health alongside her spiritual, because I believe that all three are a part of our well-being. I've heard people tell her that medicine doesn't work, and I know she wishes she did not have to take it, but I always caution against it, especially cold turkey. I always tell her that if something isn't working or she doesn't feel she needs it to talk to her psychiatrist and decide how to deal with it.

At the end of the day, she's an adult. She's going to make the decision she thinks is best, but I hope that decision would be in sober-mindedness, and even if not, with her support system helping her. I can only respond in a realistic way, which can sometimes feel unsympathetic to me, but I think being honest with her is the best choice on my part and so far it has helped her sort through some of her thoughts. I never play it down, but I try to avoid making it bigger than it seems, if that makes sense.

 

Not sure if that answers every concern, but I hope it all makes sense.

Thanks!

[MiraculousFaith]

20 hours ago, LonerAndy said:

How can you convince someone, that others would not be better off without them?  Seems a strange concept.  I can't imagine a single person that would be worse off if I didn't exist.  Not one.

Obviously, if my extended family didn't have to bail me out when I get broke.... they would be better off, because they wouldn't have to pay for someone like me, that can't hold a job.   Just factually speaking... if I didn't exist, they wouldn't have to pay thousands to bail me out when I go broke.   Right?

I have reasoned this exact logic out just like you said right here. It's hard to even comprehend this kind of situation sometimes, especially because no one ever thinks it would happen to them. But I love something one of my friends (who also struggles with depression, ironically) said to me: "God saw the world and decided it needed one of you." I think about that sometimes. It's not amazing, cure-all advice, but it always gives me pause, personally. It may not for you or anyone else, and I am sorry if that is the only thing I have to contribute to this conversation.

 

Blessings!

[LonerAndy]

1 minute ago, MiraculousFaith said:

I have reasoned this exact logic out just like you said right here. It's hard to even comprehend this kind of situation sometimes, especially because no one ever thinks it would happen to them. But I love something one of my friends (who also struggles with depression, ironically) said to me: "God saw the world and decided it needed one of you." I think about that sometimes. It's not amazing, cure-all advice, but it always gives me pause, personally. It may not for you or anyone else, and I am sorry if that is the only thing I have to contribute to this conversation.

 

Blessings!

Yeah.... not so much.  I've heard that from well meaning people before, but seriously? 

That's a real ego boast thing to claim G-d was just up there in heaven saying "you know this earth I created and it's 8 billion people is just missing something.....  *snaps fingers* ANDY!  That's it! I need to put Andy down there, and that'll fix it!"

I just don't find that all that compelling.

15 years ago I was in one of those churchy groups, and the host pastor guy got up and said "Every single one of us is special, and no one can ever replace you.  No one else can take your spot in this community".

I remember thinking.... really?   Out of 8 billion people in this world, none of them, not even one, can sit in this chair, read this Bible and pray the way I can?

What can I say?  That just doesn't seem convincing to me.

G-d loves regardless of the fact that absolutely anyone can replace us, or that there is nothing redeeming about us.  Why is beyond me, but that is our G-d.

 

[other one]

8 hours ago, LonerAndy said:

G-d loves regardless of the fact that absolutely anyone can replace us, or that there is nothing redeeming about us.  Why is beyond me, but that is our G-d.

If you really believe that, you don't know yourself.

[Leenaa]

On 10/21/2020 at 7:42 AM, MiraculousFaith said:

Hi,

 

I have a friend who has dealt with a lot of mental challenges in her life, including depression. She's been on meds (partially by force and not simply by choice) for much of her teenage and adulthood (she's in her mid-20s). This past week, she has been claiming to be severely depressed by reoccurring doubts that are plaguing her. She claims that she isn't sure she really believes in God's truth (but she is more worried about the doubt than it deserves in my opinion), and that her decisions are leading her down a terrible path. The irony is that, yes, she has definitely made a lot of bad -- at least bad to me -- decisions, but I know that God still loves her and is walking with her.

Today she messaged me that she felt suicidal, but also assured me that she would not act on it. I've been down that road before and I'm apt to believe her at this time, but I don't know for sure how I should respond. Was wondering what you might tell a friend who feels like a no-good burden and is far too hard on herself for her flaws, to the point of excessive worrying and fatalistic mindset. I don't want to encourage any erratic behavior, but I am also not so sure she would enjoy ending up in a mental hospital again (for the second time in the last month). I briefly considered taking her while we were hanging out today, and I know it sounds kind of odd, but I think there is a spiritual warfare aspect to this alongside the other mental issues she's already struggling with. She isn't sure what to make of it all, and I guess I don't know either.

 

It's a strange and probably difficult situation, but I'd appreciate any experience or advice I might be able to pass along to her as a friend. She is certainly trying to better herself, but right now it isn't working out the best for her.

 

Thanks!

Look her upp, havet ger make You some coffe. Make some plans with her for the nearest future..

[BeauJangles]

On 10/25/2020 at 6:44 AM, other one said:

If you really believe that, you don't know yourself.

Or the Lord very well, apparently. 

[BeauJangles]

On 10/21/2020 at 1:50 PM, other one said:

being a total burden on all your friends and family is just not tolerable to most people.

Yep. That's a fact if I ever heard one. I hate to say this but, if your friend becomes a "chronic" about this it will tax you beyond your ability to desire endless continuation. People of such can drain others because in many instances all they're looking for is your pity. A lot don't want to help themselves either, so you will have to ascertain this situation very carefully. You also have to understand your support is not professional assistance. Not to say the psych biz is always the best in the world either. Finding the fit for an exact need isn't all that easy. The first choice of agencies or doctors may not be the correct one. It sometimes takes searching until the optimum results can be obtained. This is often a more complex situation for lay persons then they may fully comprehend as well. All the best to the opster's friend if she wants to take on an assignment.  

[Marathoner]

Of us it was said,

Are not two sparrows sold for a cent? And yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from your Father. But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. So do not fear; you are more valuable than many sparrows. (Matthew 10:29-31 NASB)

And of Christ it was written,

Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the Lord revealed?
For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him.
He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. (Isaiah 53:1-3 KJV)

When it is understood that the Almighty knew us before we were formed in the womb, we grasp that we live according the will of the Holy One who suffered as we suffer in this world. Life is neither paltry nor cheap, cast aside like chaff on the threshing floor: that is the work of man and the evil one, not Christ who created all things. 

There was a time I walked in the ignorance of darkness and I sought to end this life which I believed was a wasteful error. It would have been better if I were never born! I tried in vain for years to end it but in this flesh I was incapable of perceiving the mind of God who chose me before the foundation of the world. I endured because it pleased our Father in heaven that I should live. I didn't understand the vision which the Holy Spirit, sent into this world to minister to all men, revealed after my efforts failed:

The darkness of the wilderness was coming to an end in my Lord Jesus Christ. The great light dawning upon the mountain would be the day of my deliverance by His hand, when I would call upon His name and the Son of God would baptize me in His Holy Spirit. Do not be afraid, for the day comes. 

Suffering is hard to endure... hence the groanings and the emptying of ourselves. It's even harder to lay hold of the truth of our trials, that it is better to abandon this flesh so that we might be satisfied in Jesus Christ. When we have plenty we are apt to say, "I have need of nothing, I am full and see clearly." It's far better to suffer and cry out, "Lord, help me! I am blind and naked and have nothing. Only You can fill me, open my eyes so I can see, and clothe me so I won't be naked. Let it be according to Your will and not my own." As the Psalm testifies to us,

It is good for me that I have been afflicted; that I might learn thy statutes.
The law of thy mouth is better unto me than thousands of gold and silver.
Thy hands have made me and fashioned me: give me understanding, that I may learn thy commandments.
They that fear thee will be glad when they see me; because I have hoped in thy word.
I know, O Lord, that thy judgments are right, and that thou in faithfulness hast afflicted me. 
(Psalm 119:71-75 KJV)

Edited October 26, 2020 by Marathoner

[JohnR7]

On 10/21/2020 at 1:42 AM, MiraculousFaith said:

Today she messaged me that she felt suicidal

The bible says we are to die to self so we can live for Christ. "Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires". (Galatians 5:24) Over the years when I explain this to people I am amazed how fast they come out of it. Also I have noticed that loving, caring, giving people are always happy people. They do not think about themselves they think about others and they search for ways to help people. 

Man does not have a solution but God does.