Blood Bought 1953 Posted December 18, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 13 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 6,726 Content Per Day: 2.88 Reputation: 6,258 Days Won: 5 Joined: 12/03/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 18, 2020 (edited) 17 hours ago, Starise said: Even though I liked the OP I thought it leaned heavily toward making it seem everything is "ok" and we have no responsibility Everything” IS” Ok ( in regard to Salvation) if you Believe and Rest in 1Cor15:1-4...... The only “ Responsibility” that WE have is to Believe in the Gospel to the Point that we REST in it for our Salvation. Anybody can HEAR the Gospel , but it takes the Holy Spirit to OPEN YOUR HEART to receive it and let it Save you ( check out how this Works by the example of Lydia, the Seller Of Purple Acts 16 ) When it comes to Salvation, the Initiative belongs to God ....” NOBODY comes to God , lest the Spirit draw him” ) If one is not a Believer, they should pray that God make them a “ Lydia”, But then , if they are not a “ Believer” to begin with , are they going to pray that prayer? Beats me. Edited December 18, 2020 by Blood Bought 1953 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Bought 1953 Posted December 18, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 13 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 6,726 Content Per Day: 2.88 Reputation: 6,258 Days Won: 5 Joined: 12/03/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 18, 2020 18 hours ago, steve morrow said: GRACE PLUS NOTHING --- SAYS WHO JOHN 1:17 for the law was given by moses ---BUT GRACE AND TRUTH CAME BY JESUS CHRIST--- 1 CORINTHIANS 3:9 for we are laborers together with GOD you are GODS husbandry you are GODS building --3:10-- according to the grace of GOD which is given unto me as a wise masterbuilder I have laid the foundation and another buildeth thereon but let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon *******1 JOHN 1:4 I HAVE NO GREATER JOY THAN TO HEAR THAT MY CHILDREN WALK IN TRUTH******* MATTHEW 7:15 BEWARE OF FALSE PROPHETS WHICH COME TO YOU IN SHEEPS CLOTHING BUT INWARDLY THEY ARE RAVENING WOLVES TITUS 2:11 for the grace of GOD that bringeth salvation hath appeared unto all men --2:12-- teaching us that denying ungodliness and worldly lusts we should live sberly righteously and godly --IN THIS PRESENT WORLD-- LOVING THE LORD JESUS CHRIST Ephesians 2:8-9 GRACE alone means that God Loves, Forgives, and Saves us not because if who we are or what we do —- it’s what “ HE” did and our Faith in that and that alone..In a Nutshell—— “ Nothing But The Blood” For Salvation..... Two Things Save us —- Christ’s Blood and our Faith in that Blood.End Of Story.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve morrow Posted December 18, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,045 Content Per Day: 0.62 Reputation: 367 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/15/2019 Status: Online Birthday: 07/07/1955 Share Posted December 18, 2020 END OF STORY --- SAYS WHO 1 CORINTHIANS 2:16 FOR WHO HATH KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD THAT HE MAY INSTRUCT HIM ---BUT WE HAVE THE MIND OF CHRIST--- *******SHOULD NOT WE DRINK HIS BLOOD --AND-- EAT HIS FLESH******* HEBREWS 5:13 FOR EVERYONE THAT USETH MILK IS UNSKILFUL IN THE WORD OF RIGHTEOUSNESS --- FOR HE IS A BABE --- --5:14-- BUT STRONG MEAT BELONGETH TO THEM THAT ARE FULL OF AGE EVEN THOSE WHO BY REASON OF USE HAVE THEIR SENSES EXERCISED --- TO DISCERN BOTH GOOD AND EVIL --- JOHN 6:56 HE THAT EATETH MY FLESH AND DRINKETH MY BLOOD DWELLETH IN --ME-- AND --I IN HIM-- NOTHING BUT THE BLOOD --- NOTHING BUT GRACE JAMES 1:6 BUT LET HIM ASK IN --FAITH-- NOTHING WAVERING FOR HE THAT WAVERETH IS LIKE A WAVE OF THE SEA DRIVEN WITH THE WIND AND TOSSED --1:17--FOR LET NOT THAT MAN THINK THAT HE SHALL RECEIVE ANYTHING -- OF THE LORD-- ARE WE NOT TO HAVE FAITH IN WHAT JESUS HAS TAUGHT US ???? ROMANS 1:18 FOR THE WRATH OF GOD IS REVEALED FROM HEAVEN AGAINST ALL UNGODLINESS AND UNRIGHTEOUSNESS OF MEN WHO HOLD THE --- TRUTH --- IN UNRIGHTEOUSNESS 2 THESSALONIANS 2:10 AND WITH ALL DECEIVEABLENESS OF UNRIGHTEOUSNESS IN THEM ---THAT PERISH --- BECAUSE THEY RECEIVED NOT THE LOVE OF THE TRUTH --- THAT THEY MIGHT BE SAVED --- END OF STORY ??? ACTS 5:20 GO STAND AND SPEAK IN THE TEMPLE TO THE PEOPLE ALL THE WORDS OF THIS LIFE LOVING THE LORD JESUS CHRIST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GandalfTheWise Posted December 18, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 24 Topic Count: 40 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,459 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 2,377 Days Won: 2 Joined: 08/23/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted December 18, 2020 23 hours ago, Starise said: Even though I liked the OP I thought it leaned heavily toward making it seem everything is "ok" and we have no responsibility. No he/or she didn't expressly say that. Just seemed to tip that way more and say less about personal responsibilty. I knew what he was saying in a nutshell. Past threads and posts suggest to me that the original post is heavily influenced by teachings similar to that titled I NEVER KNEW YOU, The Horror Of The Great White Throne Judgement And How You Can Avoid It by Michael Patrick Bowen (available in PDF form at http://www.soulwinning.info/books/i_never_knew_you.pdf). This lays out the reasons for his belief that (from page 17) "I am at eternal odds with the false, counterfeit messages of salvation-by-works that are taught from virtually every pulpit today, on every television channel, and on every Christian radio station; however, I am not at eternal odds with the individuals who preach these counterfeit messages. My heart literally goes out to all of them because they simply do not understand Christ’s plan of salvation. They have been lied to by a crafty enemy named Satan, whose sole aim is to take as many people with him to the lake of fire as he can possibly manage to steal away from God using a counterfeit plan of salvation that appears so real, so genuine, and so holy that few ever realize they have been deceived by it. Oh reader, so many of today’s professing Christians who think they are going to heaven when they die are not going to make it to heaven as they had assumed because they’ve been lied to by today’s error-filled gospel messages." Who are some of these that author considers false teachers who teach salvation by works? Joel Osteen, Charles Stanley, Pat Robertson, Rick Warren, John Hagee, Beth Moore, James Dobson, Jimmy Swaggart, Billy Graham, and Franklin Graham. The site which hosts this book also adds John MacArthur to this list saying "One of the most popular religious teachers in America, who is widely recognized worldwide, is Pastor John MacArthur of the Grace Community Church in California. Sadly, Dr. MacArthur is a false prophet. It is a serious matter. There's a large independent Baptist Church down the street from me, aka, the Bob Jones University (BJU) crowd, who distribute Mr. MacArthur's Bible study materials to the congregation, poisoning the flock with false doctrine." The owner of the site says concerning Bowen's book: "Bowen documents the so-called “salvation” messages of some of the “great” pastors and evangelists of today, which do not give eternal life. He compares them to the message of Christ, which does give eternal life. He makes his comparisons respectfully, considering that these pastors and evangelists are just as deceived by Satan, the Father of Lies, as are their followers by the message they preach." In other words, those of that mindset seem convinced that people could not have been saved through what Charles Stanley, Billy Graham, Jimmy Swagart, James Dobson, or James MacArthur have taught. As far as I can tell, they are saying most or all people saved at Billy Graham rallies (or under the ministry of others listed as false teachers) did not believe the true gospel and thus aren't saved. As far as I can tell, what is being advocated is some form of salvation through grace alone which may or may not result in a changed life. In my opinion, it's one thing to correctly teach that no amount of works or keeping rules can save us. It's by far another to teach that a Christian may or may not exhibit a transformed life having become a new creation in Christ. As far as I can tell, what they are teaching is this. When you've had a conversion experience (whether called being born again, accepting Christ, being saved), that means you are good forever whether or not your life actually changes afterward. They seem to be condemning anyone who says that being saved will result in a changed life calling that salvation by works. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted December 18, 2020 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,180 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,454 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted December 18, 2020 Plain and simple entropy shows the judgement of God upon all first creation because of sin.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starise Posted December 18, 2020 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 13 Topic Count: 279 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 13,079 Content Per Day: 9.76 Reputation: 13,554 Days Won: 149 Joined: 08/26/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted December 18, 2020 46 minutes ago, GandalfTheWise said: Past threads and posts suggest to me that the original post is heavily influenced by teachings similar to that titled I NEVER KNEW YOU, The Horror Of The Great White Throne Judgement And How You Can Avoid It by Michael Patrick Bowen (available in PDF form at http://www.soulwinning.info/books/i_never_knew_you.pdf). This lays out the reasons for his belief that (from page 17) "I am at eternal odds with the false, counterfeit messages of salvation-by-works that are taught from virtually every pulpit today, on every television channel, and on every Christian radio station; however, I am not at eternal odds with the individuals who preach these counterfeit messages. My heart literally goes out to all of them because they simply do not understand Christ’s plan of salvation. They have been lied to by a crafty enemy named Satan, whose sole aim is to take as many people with him to the lake of fire as he can possibly manage to steal away from God using a counterfeit plan of salvation that appears so real, so genuine, and so holy that few ever realize they have been deceived by it. Oh reader, so many of today’s professing Christians who think they are going to heaven when they die are not going to make it to heaven as they had assumed because they’ve been lied to by today’s error-filled gospel messages." Who are some of these that author considers false teachers who teach salvation by works? Joel Osteen, Charles Stanley, Pat Robertson, Rick Warren, John Hagee, Beth Moore, James Dobson, Jimmy Swaggart, Billy Graham, and Franklin Graham. The site which hosts this book also adds John MacArthur to this list saying "One of the most popular religious teachers in America, who is widely recognized worldwide, is Pastor John MacArthur of the Grace Community Church in California. Sadly, Dr. MacArthur is a false prophet. It is a serious matter. There's a large independent Baptist Church down the street from me, aka, the Bob Jones University (BJU) crowd, who distribute Mr. MacArthur's Bible study materials to the congregation, poisoning the flock with false doctrine." The owner of the site says concerning Bowen's book: "Bowen documents the so-called “salvation” messages of some of the “great” pastors and evangelists of today, which do not give eternal life. He compares them to the message of Christ, which does give eternal life. He makes his comparisons respectfully, considering that these pastors and evangelists are just as deceived by Satan, the Father of Lies, as are their followers by the message they preach." In other words, those of that mindset seem convinced that people could not have been saved through what Charles Stanley, Billy Graham, Jimmy Swagart, James Dobson, or James MacArthur have taught. As far as I can tell, they are saying most or all people saved at Billy Graham rallies (or under the ministry of others listed as false teachers) did not believe the true gospel and thus aren't saved. As far as I can tell, what is being advocated is some form of salvation through grace alone which may or may not result in a changed life. In my opinion, it's one thing to correctly teach that no amount of works or keeping rules can save us. It's by far another to teach that a Christian may or may not exhibit a transformed life having become a new creation in Christ. As far as I can tell, what they are teaching is this. When you've had a conversion experience (whether called being born again, accepting Christ, being saved), that means you are good forever whether or not your life actually changes afterward. They seem to be condemning anyone who says that being saved will result in a changed life calling that salvation by works. While I think some of these evangelists have done far more good than harm in getting the gospel message out there, with maybe the exception of Joel Olsteen who preaches more of a prosperity gospel than Billy Graham or Charles Stanley. I'm not as sure about the others. I have never heard Billy Graham or Charles Stanley preach that our lives shouldn't be changed. I would say the idea of salvation is stressed more than what happens after that. I see evangelists more like surgeons or specialists while pastors deal with the clean up afterwards. I believe they all have a place. I have seen evangelists unsuccessfully attempt to be pastors. Not that some couldn't cross over. Pastor work involves a lot more attention to people on an individual level, that is, if they are doing their job. I have heard some pastors describe themselves as primarily teachers. Sometimes I see churches with an assistant pastor who compliments the main pastor. The team works well together using their individual strengths. I like this better because often times the attention is drawn to one man. I think the church works best with various teachers and preachers over the same congregation. The evangelists are the car salesmen, the pastors are the car mechanics. The first step is getting saved. The person who isn't saved has nothing to build on. What we often see on TV leaves a lot to be desired for sure. Salvation is seen sometimes as a "once and done" kind of thing, when it's really our responsibility to grow in the Lord. This is an ongoing process. Works are but an outward showing of an inner change. The danger you allude to I agree with. That people make a "decision" for Christ, like telling a woman you decided to love only her. Only the person making that choice really knows if they mean it to the extent they would make a lifetime commitment to it. Or did the choice to go up front with the "saved" people make you temporarily feel better only to go right back to the old man afterwards? More like a one night stand. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Bought 1953 Posted December 19, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 13 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 6,726 Content Per Day: 2.88 Reputation: 6,258 Days Won: 5 Joined: 12/03/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 19, 2020 14 hours ago, steve morrow said: HEBREWS 5:13 FOR EVERYONE THAT USETH MILK IS UNSKILFUL IN THE WORD OF RIGHTEOUSNESS --- FOR HE IS A BABE --- --5:14-- BUT STRONG MEAT BELONGETH TO THEM THAT ARE FULL OF AGE EVEN THOSE WHO BY REASON OF USE HAVE THEIR SENSES EXERCISED --- TO DISCERN BOTH GOOD AND EVIL --- “ Babes” lack the Faith to REST in the Gospel Of Grace.......they constantly strive to “ Add” to it with “ do do” this or “don’t” do that.....it even sounds babyish— a bunch of “ do do” The most Mature Believers are those that Understand this Wisdom...”Love God and live as you please”. When you mess up— and you WILL ‘ mess up “— you BOLDLY approach God at the “ Throne Of Grace” and+do the same things with your Sins that God does—- you put them on the Cross! You LEAVE then their. Then you Forget about them ....just like HE does..... The above approach is for “ meat eaters” only......Babes are preoccupied with “taste not, touch not”...... what a bore ! What a lack of Faith it reveals ! Babes spend their time criticizing the mature.....they think the mature are just looking for ways to “ sin and get away with it” Therein lies the Secret they never get....Knowing I can do what I “want “—- Knowing I can Sin and never be damned for it makes me want to sin LESS , not more.....God has changed my “ Wants”.....to UNDERSTAND this, you have to LIVE it....Being a “ Free Man in Christ” is to have a diet completely devoid of Milk......The” Freedom” to be a Slave to God. That’s where I am ......how about you ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tzephanyahu Posted December 20, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 69 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 1,625 Content Per Day: 0.79 Reputation: 2,033 Days Won: 1 Joined: 09/10/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted December 20, 2020 On 12/19/2020 at 6:38 AM, Blood Bought 1953 said: Understand this Wisdom...”Love God and live as you please”. On 12/19/2020 at 6:38 AM, Blood Bought 1953 said: Knowing I can do what I “want “—- Knowing I can Sin and never be damned for it On 12/18/2020 at 9:09 AM, Blood Bought 1953 said: The only “ Responsibility” that WE have is to Believe in the Gospel On 12/19/2020 at 6:38 AM, Blood Bought 1953 said: Understand this Wisdom...”Love God and live as you please”. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve morrow Posted December 20, 2020 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,045 Content Per Day: 0.62 Reputation: 367 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/15/2019 Status: Online Birthday: 07/07/1955 Share Posted December 20, 2020 DO THIS OR DO THAT --- REMEMBRANCE OF GRACE LUKE 8:21 AND HE ANSWERED AND SAID UNTO THEM MY MOTHER ---AND MY BRETHREN--- ARE THESE WHICH HEAR THE WORD OF --GOD-- AND DO IT AGAIN --- TITUS 2:11 FOR THE GRACE OF GOD THAT BRINGETH SALVATION HATH APPEARED UNTO ALL MEN --2:12-- TEACHING US THAT DENYING --- UNGODLINESS--- AND WORLDLY LUSTS --WE SHOULD-- LIVE RIGHTEOUSLY AND GODLY IN THIS PRESENT WORLD EPHESIANS 2:8 FOR BY GRACE ARE YOU SAVED THROUGH FAITH AND THAT NOT OF YOURSELVES --IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD-- 2:9-- NOT OF WORKS LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST PSALM 33:4 FOR THE WORD OF THE LORD IS RIGHT AND ALL HIS WORKS ARE DONE IN TRUTH JOHN 14:6 JESUS SAITH UNTO HIM I AM --THE WAY----THE TRUTH----AND THE LIFE-- NO MAN COMETH UNTO TO THE FATHER BUT BY ME JOHN 8:43 WHY DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND MY SPEECH EVEN BECAUSE YOU CANNOT HEAR MY WORD AGAIN --- JAMES 1:6 BUT LET HIM ASK IN FAITH --NOTHING WAVERING-- FOR HE THAT WAVERETH IS LIKE A WAVE IN THE SEA DRIVEN WITH THE WIND AND TOSSED --1:7-- FOR LET NOT THAT MAN THINK THAT HE SHALL RECEIVE ANYTHING OF THE LORD LUKE 6:46 AND WHY CALL YOU ME LORD LORD AND DO NOT THE THINGS WHICH I SAY ************************************************* 2 THESSALONIANS 1:7 AND YOU WHO ARE TROUBLED ---REST--- WITH US WHEN THE LORD JESUS SHALL BE REVEALED FROM HEAVEN WITH HIS MIGHTY ANGELS --1:8-- IN FLAMING FIRE TAKING VENGEANCE ON THEM THAT --KNOW NOT GOD-- AND THAT OBEY NOT THE GOSPEL OF GOD ACTS 10:34 THEN PETER OPENED HIS MOUTH AND SAID OF A TRUTH I PERCEIVE THAT GOD IS NO RESPECTER OF PERSONS ************************************************* ECCLESIATES 5:3 FOR A DREAM COMETH THROUGH THE MULTITUDE OF BUSINESS ---AND A FOOLS VOICE IS KNOWN BY MULTITUDE OF WORDS--- PROVERBS 17:28 EVEN A FOOL WHEN HE HOLDETH HIS PEACE IS COUNTED WISE --AND HE THAT SHUTTETH HIS LIPS-- IS ESTEEMED A MAN OF UNDERSTANDING ROMANS 10:3 FOR THEY BEING IGNORANT OF GODS RIGHTEOUSNESS AND GOING ABOUT TO ESTABLISH THEIR OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS HAVE NOT SUBMITTED THEMSELVES UNTO THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF GOD PROVERBS 8:8 ALL THE WORDS OF --MY MOUTH-- ARE IN RIGHTEOUSNESS THERE IS NOTHING FROWARD OR PERVERSE IN THEM DOES NOT THE BLOOD AND THE WATER AND THE SPIRIT OF JESUS CHRIST CLEANSE US FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS LOVING THE LORD JESUS CHRIST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Bought 1953 Posted December 21, 2020 Group: Royal Member Followers: 13 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 6,726 Content Per Day: 2.88 Reputation: 6,258 Days Won: 5 Joined: 12/03/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 21, 2020 They seem to be condemning anyone who says that being saved will result in a changed life calling that salvation by works. Simply absurd .The whole “POINT” of Christianity , which I have mentioned many times ,is For a Person to Turn to God as a Lost Sinner ,putting his Entire Trust in the Shed Blood Of Jesus to Save them and then God will put His Holy Spirit in them to TRANSFORM them into “The IMAGE of His SON”. Why would I “ Condemn” people whose lives have been changed? Just at the place that I used to work, I have seen hard, rough, hateful men that were Transformed into kind, meek men.....it was a delight to see these transformations.Paul says in Gal.6:15, that the ONLY THING THAT MATTERS is “ being Transformed into a New Creation.....and you presume I’m gonna “ CONDEMN” that? I am sure you did not mean to hurl insults my way, but consider what you are accusing me of..... The only thing that I would “ condemn” are the Ignorant , self-Righteous Religious “ Fruit Inspectors” That use their role as “Inspectors” to become threatening bullies that want to grab a Fruit Tree ( a saved person ) by the throat and yell, “CHANGE, DAMN YOU,CHANGE!..... People would never “ think” of getting real fruit from a real tree in this manner.... Peer Pressure in Churches can manufacture a “ change” in a person that will do nothing but make a person a Phony .....A Newbie ACTS in a certain changed manner to get the SPYS off their Keisters ..... Any type Of Positive , Moral Change is good, but God ain’t looking for “ Change” ( something anyone can outwardly do) ....God is looking for TRANSFORMATION.....the Creation of an actual NEW BEING, with a NEW Heart......the “ Fruit” will occur naturally ......and as in my own personal case.....90% of my changes were on the “ inside of the cup” that naturally showed up on the “ outside of the cup” .....it took a very long time for my Natural Fruit to manifest itself and it was 99% stuff that was important to God and invisible to the Judgmental Goons In the Church. To sum up......God ain’t interested in “ Spiritual Imitation” , that would be “ religion. God is insterested in Spiritual FRUITION , “ that” would be Christianity .... God is the only One that can be in control of my Transformation ...I can’t do it and I refuse to be a phony about what I am....for better or worse ...... I do what I can do....I practice Faith ( like Paul said, we finish this Walk the same way we started it— Faith! ) and in turn , I let God do what only HE can do .....Transform my HEART .... A” changed Life” stemming from will- Power and peer pressure is what I am against.... A “ changed life” stemming from a New Heart? That’s what God wants and that’s all that I try to promote .... When a person says that the Changed Life is what “ Gets” you Saved and also says that the Changed Life is what “ keeps” you Saved.....that is when you cross the line into Legalism.If one goes beyond “ Nothing But The Blood” for Salvation......they are straying into Legalism and you will “ Fall from Grace” as a result....some say that equals Damnation and others say it does not .....you decide.... lol.....I feel like I am rambling ....sorry.....maybe somebody needs to hear all of this ....God Bless..... 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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