David1701 Posted February 16, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,731 Content Per Day: 3.55 Reputation: 3,522 Days Won: 12 Joined: 11/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted February 16, 2021 4 hours ago, Starise said: While I praise the Lord right along with you brother, I think there's one HUGE difference between someone begging to pay you and someone else in "ministry" that spends millions of dollars on themselves and their family. Meanwhile as I'm sure you are well aware, there are people out there in need both physically and spiritually. I go back to the idea of WWJD? Would He have spent lots of money on Himself and take a little left over and give it away so as to make people think that yes, we are giving to the poor. The Bible says that to him who is given much, much is expected. If you have millions of dollars to throw around that was GIVEN to you by people who thought it would be used for ministry work , who TRUSTED you to use the money for this and instead you use much of it for yourself and your immediate family, I call that a self aggrandizing money machine. Don't look at what they SAY look at what they DO. I think Joyce is getting off much too lightly here. She knew they were on to her and made it look legit by saying she repented, yet what has really changed? And, the problem is not even mainly the money; it's the false teachings, including blasphemy and witchcraft, taught as if it were "faith". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David1701 Posted February 16, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,731 Content Per Day: 3.55 Reputation: 3,522 Days Won: 12 Joined: 11/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted February 16, 2021 2 hours ago, Marathoner said: Mercy, my friend. How do you know that her repentance was contrived in such a way? The doors were blown open on the so-called prosperity preachers decades ago so this isn't exactly news. I say "mercy" because who among us can claim to have done no wrong? Let he who is without sin cast the first stone, @Starise. An argument may be made that any one of us have gotten off lightly; we were slaves to sin before Christ raised us up to serve Him in this world. I remember the parable of the servant who was forgiven of much by his Lord. After being liberated, he showed no mercy to a fellow servant who owned him a pittance. Upon hearing of this, his Lord was wrathful and had the wicked servant cast into bondage. Those who show no mercy shall receive no mercy; the measure of judgment we mete will be returned to us. Who is without sin? The Son of the living God who judges us all, great and small. Let us refrain from railing accusations remembering that vengeance belongs to the Lord. You really need to investigate the teachings of the Prosperity "gospel" preachers. The main problem is not that they are filthy rich from the gullible giving of their followers; the main problem is their blasphemous false teachings about the cross and their teaching of witchcraft, disguised as "faith". 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tristen Posted February 17, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 9 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,367 Content Per Day: 0.63 Reputation: 1,340 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/26/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted February 17, 2021 6 hours ago, David1701 said: I was not flippant. I was not attacking someone over trivialities (the heresies are very serious); and it is your false accusations that come under the subject of your post, ironically. I would recommend you to read "Christianity in Crisis", by Hank Hanegraff, which is not about Joyce Meyer, but about that genre of false teaching (people like Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, etc.); but you would probably trash him, as you have trashed me. “I was not flippant. I was not attacking someone over trivialities (the heresies are very serious); and it is your false accusations that come under the subject of your post, ironically” Well, you spoke against a Christian minister by firstly providing some unsupported Innuendo linking her to the “prosperity gospel” (which you did not define). Then you pointed me to a link of rationally weak arguments – i.e. basically claiming that since she has made a few questionable statements over her decades of ministry, her authenticity is forever in question. I would consider none of the errors pointed out in the link to be very serious heresies – especially in the context they are presented. “I would recommend you to read "Christianity in Crisis", by Hank Hanegraff, which is not about Joyce Meyer, but about that genre of false teaching (people like Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, etc.); but you would probably trash him” You are correct to assume that I would be suspicious of the motives of someone who has dedicated so much effort to attacking Christians and Christian ministries, rather than using their time and gift to glorify God. I am personally convinced that this instinct to slander Christians is a satanic trap that far too many Christians are diving into - head-first. “as you have trashed me” But its perfectly ok for you to “trash” someone ministering in the name of Christ – because you disagree with them over some non-essential doctrines? It was not my intent to “trash” you – but rather to give you a perspective that you may not have previously considered; i.e. something for you (and others reading) to take to God – just in case. You have a motive to warn against the “prosperity gospel”. Well I have a motive to warn against the propensity of some Christians to readily denigrate potential works of God – simply because we might disagree with them on some issues. I personally have a healthy fear of, and love for, my God – and would be loathe to think I had spoken against a work that He had a hand in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GandalfTheWise Posted February 17, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 24 Topic Count: 40 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,459 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 2,377 Days Won: 2 Joined: 08/23/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted February 17, 2021 7 hours ago, David1701 said: I would recommend you to read "Christianity in Crisis", by Hank Hanegraff, which is not about Joyce Meyer, but about that genre of false teaching (people like Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, etc.); but you would probably trash him, as you have trashed me. In a rather ironic development, Hank Hanegraaff (known as the "Bible Answer Man" on his radio show joined the Eastern Orthodox Church in 2017 and has come under fire from various heresy hunting groups. Many of them are convinced he's departed from the faith and is not a Christian. There is also some controversy associated with allegations of plagiarism in some of his books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duck Posted February 17, 2021 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 27 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 404 Content Per Day: 0.32 Reputation: 239 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/28/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted February 17, 2021 11 hours ago, clancy said: It’s strange, because I too was going to comment on Joyce Meyers,millions, then a little voice in my head, told me to stay quiet....well of course,I believe that was God asking me to zip it.....so zip it I will......Joyce is the Lord’s concern, not mine.? Agree. The battle belongs to The Lord... been getting this message all week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whyme Posted February 17, 2021 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 82 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 2,300 Content Per Day: 1.97 Reputation: 1,125 Days Won: 10 Joined: 02/16/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted February 17, 2021 I don't trust her or many other teachers. She gets rich selling her teaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thewhitedove Posted February 17, 2021 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 70 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 459 Content Per Day: 0.25 Reputation: 384 Days Won: 1 Joined: 04/14/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted February 17, 2021 14 hours ago, Starise said: You know I see it as sad in a way because there are literally THOUSANDS of women out there who could use another woman to relate to. I think on some level Joyce accomplishes this, but in other ways she drops the ball. The message that women can be victorious in the Lord is a good message. I think we need to reflect on the many positives of the word. As a speaker in this area she excels as she relates well to women, although I have seen men in her audiences too. One day God will judge all of us and Joyce will be standing right up there with me and everyone else. Of course it's easy for a wealthy woman with a few mansions and a private jet to get her around who is in need of nothing to stand and preach "blessings" to others. Yes according to her she had a rough life early on. I think many women relate to this and feel a kinship with her. She found a "niche" that works in working with these women. That's how I see it. Who really benefits from it? Joyce certainly benefits financially. Not just rich but filthy rich. If a person sincerely desires to relate to those closest to their ministry what is the best way to do that? I would say it is to get closer to their level. I'm not saying live in poverty, just live like a normal person. In that way show the world money really means nothing to you. I agree. She has a platform that serves a purpose for sure but I felt that she presented the Bible as a self help manual, which in many ways it is...it is THE book to live your life by. I just feel that the message of the cross isnt emphasised, nor is the willingness to suffer for Christ, to run the race. Being a Christian is a hard walk at times, as we die to self each day and take up our cross every morning. It's a slog depending on your season. Sometimes it can feel desperate, and yet it can be in those times of difficulty that we meet Christ, and not always in the form of an earthly blessing. Joyce was a great introduction to Christianity for me but I dont know how anyone can go deeper into the mysteries and depths of Christ with her teachings. As I said, I did learn a lot from her, but not more than I could have learned through conventional, secular psychology. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1to3 Posted February 17, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 139 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 4,224 Content Per Day: 1.23 Reputation: 3,075 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/28/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted February 17, 2021 (edited) I tried to expose Joyce Meyers here a few years ago, I showed the evidence then. Many wolves in sheep's clothing today, Many churches embrace freemasonnery the kundalini spirit. What they say, how they dress, how they set up their stages, what is the imagery they are using? They are telling us in plain sight who they represent. --------------------- The apostasy of the church 1 Timothy 4:1-2 4 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, The bible says make your election a sure thing. 2 Peter 1:10 10Therefore, brothers, strive to make your calling and election sure. For if you practice these things you will never stumble, 11and you will receive a lavish reception into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.… Edited February 17, 2021 by 1to3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starise Posted February 17, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 13 Topic Count: 279 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 13,083 Content Per Day: 9.76 Reputation: 13,562 Days Won: 149 Joined: 08/26/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted February 17, 2021 7 hours ago, Thewhitedove said: I agree. She has a platform that serves a purpose for sure but I felt that she presented the Bible as a self help manual, which in many ways it is...it is THE book to live your life by. I just feel that the message of the cross isnt emphasised, nor is the willingness to suffer for Christ, to run the race. Being a Christian is a hard walk at times, as we die to self each day and take up our cross every morning. It's a slog depending on your season. Sometimes it can feel desperate, and yet it can be in those times of difficulty that we meet Christ, and not always in the form of an earthly blessing. Joyce was a great introduction to Christianity for me but I dont know how anyone can go deeper into the mysteries and depths of Christ with her teachings. As I said, I did learn a lot from her, but not more than I could have learned through conventional, secular psychology. For me it gets more personal. I won't go into it in detail here. Lets just say there was a time in my life when I was involved with someone who was doing the exact OPPOSITE of what the Bible taught. This person's behavior really affected me in a big way negatively. The whole time they were doing things no Christian person should ever be accused of to others with NO empathy whatsoever, this same person was preaching to me and yes, listening to Joyce Myers on a regular basis. Is Joyce Myers personally responsible? Certainly not, yet I still make that negative connection to this very day and probably always will. After looking deeper into Joyce I would not personally feel comfortable with her ministry as a guidepost. Like you say maybe as positive icing on the cake "if" I were a woman it might be tempting. For me though, I can't get away from the guilty by association. Too much went down to forget it.Too much does not add up for me. Yet another personal association I make is someone else who did some very heartless and callous things to me had her last name. So am I biased just a little? Absolutely. Do I still think she's not entirely transparent and real? Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David1701 Posted February 17, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 15 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,731 Content Per Day: 3.55 Reputation: 3,522 Days Won: 12 Joined: 11/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted February 17, 2021 (edited) 19 hours ago, Tristen said: “I was not flippant. I was not attacking someone over trivialities (the heresies are very serious); and it is your false accusations that come under the subject of your post, ironically” Well, you spoke against a Christian minister by firstly providing some unsupported Innuendo linking her to the “prosperity gospel” (which you did not define). Then you pointed me to a link of rationally weak arguments – i.e. basically claiming that since she has made a few questionable statements over her decades of ministry, her authenticity is forever in question. I would consider none of the errors pointed out in the link to be very serious heresies – especially in the context they are presented. “I would recommend you to read "Christianity in Crisis", by Hank Hanegraff, which is not about Joyce Meyer, but about that genre of false teaching (people like Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, etc.); but you would probably trash him” You are correct to assume that I would be suspicious of the motives of someone who has dedicated so much effort to attacking Christians and Christian ministries, rather than using their time and gift to glorify God. I am personally convinced that this instinct to slander Christians is a satanic trap that far too many Christians are diving into - head-first. “as you have trashed me” But its perfectly ok for you to “trash” someone ministering in the name of Christ – because you disagree with them over some non-essential doctrines? It was not my intent to “trash” you – but rather to give you a perspective that you may not have previously considered; i.e. something for you (and others reading) to take to God – just in case. You have a motive to warn against the “prosperity gospel”. Well I have a motive to warn against the propensity of some Christians to readily denigrate potential works of God – simply because we might disagree with them on some issues. I personally have a healthy fear of, and love for, my God – and would be loathe to think I had spoken against a work that He had a hand in. Do you not realise that supporting an heretical teacher is just as bad as denigrating a godly one? The teachings mentioned in the Web site to which I linked are common to the "name-it-and-claim-it" preachers, who teach "faith" as a force that anyone, whether Christian or otherwise, can use (this is witchcraft, not Christianity). They teach that the devil was torturing the Lord in hell, after the cross, and that the Lord had to be rescued on a legal technicality, but the Bible says that Christ defeated the devil on the cross. They teach that we (i.e. Christians) do not have God in us; but that we are little gods (even the Mormons don't go this far!). They teach not to criticise any ministry (very convenient for false teachers...) and claim that anyone who criticises their "ministry" is satanic. I see that you are using a similar tactic. Bad company corrupts good character... Edited February 17, 2021 by David1701 clarification Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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