Yes, but is the Matrix's Oracle Reloaded?

[nebula]

This is going to sound odd, but I agree with all of the above.

OK, so I like the sci-fi/fantasy genre, and my dad wanted to see the movie, yada-yada. (I just walked out of the theater during the sex-scene and no problems!).

The first Matrix movie was a good movie as far as movie quality goes. The second movie - not so great. Well, for those that like action scenes and don't care about substance it was great. Well, that is what it felt like - a lot of fight scenes interrupted by a story line to weave the fight scenes together.

The comparison to a video game is more correct than you realize. I have discovered that to really understand the movie, you have to play the video game, as it offers missing elements of the story. Apparently, there are also supposed to be some mini-movies that coincide with the Matrix Reloaded that add more, though I forget what they call them or where to see them. If this is the wave of the future with movies.... :suspect:

On the other hand, there is now a mystery going on. Some people are suspecting a "matrix within the matrix." But someone who played the video games said that Neo actually touched the Source (what "saves" humanity) before bookin it out as fast as he could to save Trinity, but in touching the Source he is now stuck between the two worlds.

As far as the the spiritual content - it all got washed out. At first, Neo is told there are no choices; all the choices have been made already. But when in the room with the Architect (the designer of the Matrix - he's in the form of a human, but he could just as easily be a program simulation of the machine that created the Matrix for all we know), Neo is told that there have been six versions of him already, and they all made the same choice - not that it really was a choice. The Matrix only works because there is a 1% margin of error, that which allows a few people to realize the truth of the Matrix and break free. Within this error allowance, the program creates a "One," someone who has this power to manipulate the Matrix (though there are indications that Neo is able to do more than his predecessors, i.e. an opponent at first telling Neo he is no different from the others, then watching Neo stop a round of bullets changes his mind and states, "O, you have skill!"). The purpose of this One is to enter the control room, touch the Source, and select a handful of males and females to found the new Zion - as the old is on its way to being destroyed again. This keeps the Matrix alive and the humans hooked up to it alive. But the Architect informs Neo he is different form the others in that he has love for another. This makes him different for some reason, though it is not stated why. So, when he is given the choice to "save humanity" by continuing the Matrix with the cycle of Zion or the choice to save Trinity, the Architect has Neo weaved in this tale that he really has no choice in the matter. So, in choosing to save Trinity he is actaully fighting against the Matrix.

It makes it very complicated to say what is the "right" thing to do here.

So, basically, whatever New Age message that was brought across in the film in the beginning-middle of the film, in my opinion, totally got thrown away because it all came out to be a lie.

But now the door is open for post-modernism philosophy to take control, because that sure was opened up with this new twist.

Oh, and Neo ain't nothing like Jesus at all by any means! "I didn't find you," he says to a young man, "you found me." Not! But apart from one of the ships being named the Logos, I didn't see any Biblical parallels this time. But who except Christians are looking for or paying attention to those?

Bottom line - the Matrix is a movie for people who like action flicks. The first one had some pretty strong spiritual parallels - some good, some wrong - that made the story more intriguing, and it was actually a good story (story-quality wise that is) which made it more worth seeing that most action flicks that come out (again, that is for people who like action flicks. The second movie, as far as movies go, the only thing it has going for it is the mystery aspect of it. What is the truth now?

(BTW, God-Man, do you think Persephone transferred something to Neo? Remember how she put on the lipstick before she kissed him? Anyway, some others have speculated this.) Sorry for the side-not folks. It is a perplexing mystery. :x:

[Ovedya]

Nebula,

OOOOOOOHHHHHHH.....You really got me going now!.....

I think the Matrix will end up being a "cult genre" trilogy....kind of like the Lord of the Rings. There are only a few people that really caught on to the things you mentioned. Not to say that people are stupid, but it takes a certain kind of Sci-fi fan to really appreciate the twists and turns in the storyline.

Okay, so the whole cyberpunk-kung-foo-fighter thing went a little overboard in Reloaded. I agree with that. I think they used all the action in order to appeal to a broader audience. It would not have had as much appeal and market ability if it were bent too much on the Sci-fi side. Where the first movie had a good balance of both, Reloaded went a little overboard. Hopefully Revolutions will get back to the balance. It seems logical that it would, since they have a lot of loose ends to tie up.

I'm voting for the "Matrix within a Matrix" theory. Neo had the ability to destroy the Squidies after jumping through the door. But I also like the idea that this was an imbued power by touching the Source, or by some other means. But let me dwell on the "Matrix within a Matrix" thing for a moment. In the first movie we saw what the post apocalyptic world looked like through the simulation on the Nebucanezzar. Remember how Morpheus told Neo that the simulation was constructed from "bits and pieces" and some guesswork? But then on the other hand how he had seen vast fields of people being grown? What if that world was really just another kind of Matrix?

Think about it some more. When Morpheus was being interrogated by Agent Smith, Smith told him about the failure of the first Matrix. People could not cope with Utopia - they needed pain and misery. But what about hope? What would those "disconnected" people have to hope for? Neo himself was stuck in a dead-end job - just another wannabe Cyberpunk hacker with an unusual sensation of being disconnected. Knowing the truth - being out of the reality he knew - would give him hope. So then, maybe the Matrix needed to create an alternate universe in order to deal with this anomaly.

Now, think about this post-apocalyptic world: destroyed ruins of buildings, filth everywhere, and unforgiving weather. Does this seem to be the kind of place to make and harvest humans? It seems more logical to me that the real world is just that, but that the real environment that people are in is more like a huge clean room. Like that long hallway between realities in Reloaded.

[nebula]

(snip) it takes a certain kind of Sci-fi fan to really appreciate the twists and turns in the storyline.

Who do you think I got my information from?

**************************************************

I go for the Matrix within the Matrix idea, too - but the guy who played the video game is the one who says otherwise.

Didn't you think theat control room in Zion was a bit out of place? (Like, where did all this technology come from in comparison to the rest of the city, which is more mechanical in nature? And why in the Control Room were there people hooked up - did you notice that?)

Very odd.

[Ovedya]

That's one of the greyer areas. According to the first movie those first people that have come out of the Matrix did not know what time it was really. It stands to reason, however, that the technology was already there to use. Zion was the last human city on the earth, so it could have been abandoned and not destroyed. I suppose if we were teo read the original stories, that would all be explained, though.

[Guest hdamaall]

Nebula,

OOOOOOOHHHHHHH.....You really got me going now!.....

I think the Matrix will end up being a "cult genre" trilogy....kind of like the Lord of the Rings. There are only a few people that really caught on to the things you mentioned. Not to say that people are stupid, but it takes a certain kind of Sci-fi fan to really appreciate the twists and turns in the storyline.

Okay, so the whole cyberpunk-kung-foo-fighter thing went a little overboard in Reloaded. I agree with that. I think they used all the action in order to appeal to a broader audience. It would not have had as much appeal and market ability if it were bent too much on the Sci-fi side. Where the first movie had a good balance of both, Reloaded went a little overboard. Hopefully Revolutions will get back to the balance. It seems logical that it would, since they have a lot of loose ends to tie up.

I'm voting for the "Matrix within a Matrix" theory. Neo had the ability to destroy the Squidies after jumping through the door. But I also like the idea that this was an imbued power by touching the Source, or by some other means. But let me dwell on the "Matrix within a Matrix" thing for a moment. In the first movie we saw what the post apocalyptic world looked like through the simulation on the Nebucanezzar. Remember how Morpheus told Neo that the simulation was constructed from "bits and pieces" and some guesswork? But then on the other hand how he had seen vast fields of people being grown? What if that world was really just another kind of Matrix?

Think about it some more. When Morpheus was being interrogated by Agent Smith, Smith told him about the failure of the first Matrix. People could not cope with Utopia - they needed pain and misery. But what about hope? What would those "disconnected" people have to hope for? Neo himself was stuck in a dead-end job - just another wannabe Cyberpunk hacker with an unusual sensation of being disconnected. Knowing the truth - being out of the reality he knew - would give him hope. So then, maybe the Matrix needed to create an alternate universe in order to deal with this anomaly.

Now, think about this post-apocalyptic world: destroyed ruins of buildings, filth everywhere, and unforgiving weather. Does this seem to be the kind of place to make and harvest humans? It seems more logical to me that the real world is just that, but that the real environment that people are in is more like a huge clean room. Like that long hallway between realities in Reloaded.

whooa back it up a little please. you're right here, but don't complare the lord of the rings to the matrix. the LOR trilogy is in a whoole completely different ball park. J.R.R. Tolkien was a devout Chrustian, and was the person that led C.S. lewis to the Lord. just wanted to point that out.

[Ovedya]

I think you may have missed the point. I was talking baout the movie turning into a "cult classic." Not too many people were impressed with Reloaded, and now Revolutions. Only the real "Matrix freaks" will go to see the movie over and over, buy t he extended CD's, etc., etc. This is likely to happen to the Lord of the Rings as well. Most "non-Tolkiens" do not get the story. Star Trek had the trekkies, Star Wars also had a huge cult following, and these two movies are likely to have the same.

[jacketfan2005]

the matrix to me was just an action movie, i dont let things get to my head... but also it did have some biblical influence, the name of the ship, the verse on the plaque, and a few others.

[Snowdoove]

Greetings~

I am not sure how I found this web site, "Underingstanding the Matrix",

http://user.pa.net/~drivera/matrixch5.htm.

This article is 10 pages long and parts are very interesting.

Snowdoove :il: :il: :il:

[Guest Eyes on Jesus]

The language alone that is used in these movies, should be enough to keep the true believers in Jesus Christ away from them, But it is the condition of our hearts before the Lord God, and how far away people are from him that keep them going to see movies like this and others like it, not minding to listen to the Lords name being used in vain, well it is just like you are saying it is ok for others to use his name in vain, by you not getting up out of your seat and leaving the theaters, or changing the channel on your tv sets, God is the great deliverer, he brought me out of the pit so many christians today are wallowing in, and I can tell you, movies just arent worth, the separation they cause between you and the Lord, for You can be certain that the language used in the films are not pleasing in the eyes of God.

Deuteronomy 5:11 - Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain: for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.

Here's a sample of what pluggedinonline.com tells you of the language in these movies.

Deepen your relationship with Jesus Christ, not the world

Reloaded

crude or profane language: One f-word echoes around a room full of video monitors displaying Neo

[nebula]

Hey, Eyes!

I appreciate your sentiments.

However, foul language is become so common place around me that I have learned to just phase it out. If I were to become offended ecerytime I heard God's name being used as a swear word, I couldn't even go to the grocery store! I just let it ride over my head and sing/say words of praise unto God.

I don't mean this to justify anything. Just making a comment.