When was Satan kicked out of heaven?

[1to3]

2 minutes ago, Starise said:

If all creation was 'good' then a bad apple crept in there that was already bad.

Not really, Lucifer was created perfect and good,Lucifer became corrupted sometime after day seven.

[1to3]

43 minutes ago, Starise said:

Oh here is where I had my ideas from-

 an even more exact detail is provided in Job 38:4-7. There we read, "Where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth? Tell me, if you have understanding. Who determined its measurements—surely you know! Or who stretched the line upon it? On what were its bases sunk, or who laid its cornerstone, when the morning stars sang together and all the sons of God shouted for joy?" We find that angels (here described as "sons of God") existed before the earth was developed. Therefore, angels existed on the first day of creation in Genesis 1.

Hmmm, I don't see it that way from the perspective of what is written in scripture of the Holy bible. when the stars and angelic being were created on day 4, they got to witness and see the rest of creation happen.

From the perspective of what is written in the Holy bible, in the beginning was God=the Father, Son, Holy Spirit. the stars and angelic beings came to be within the creation period. Yes they came before man, but they could not BE before God began CREATING.  Cherubs are in the realm of angelic beings and are created beings, they perform different tasks, cherubim are different from Arch Angels and seraphims. In the beginning was just God, than came CREATION period, where God began creating, forming everything else.

Edited April 13, 2021 by 1to3

[1to3]

47 minutes ago, Starise said:

The fallen angelic host might not have been expressly included in the "all was good" idea.

If it would not then it would have been mentioned. What is however clearly mentioned is that when God finished CREATING everything, God was pleased and deemed ALL good.   Then God rested.

[Jaydub]

Luke 10

¹⁷ Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name.”

¹⁸ And He said to them, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven. ¹⁹ Behold, I give you the authority to trample on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall by any means hurt you.

[Charlie744]

What a great topic! If the Bible reveals the answer to this I am not able to find it!  But we can all speculate:

 

1) Here is what I have come to (again, no Scripture, if there even is any on this), but I think we might try to break this down into smaller bits if we can.... 

       a) God created all the angels in heaven,

               1) Lucifer was the top dog and all the other angels fell way behind him in beauty, power, abilities, etc.: all the other angels admired him greatly,

        b) God then created the heavens, the earth the stars, the universe, etc. Everything in a physical world that He wanted to include in a physical world,

                 1) On day 6 we know that God created Adam,

        c) Soon after Adam and Eve were created they were instructed not to eat of the tree..... 

                  1) Now we have the first mention / appearance of Lucifer / Satan / Serpent intent on deceiving A & E to eat of the tree,

I believe the above may properly represent the "knowns" found in Genesis..... I guess now comes the conjecture:

        d) Despite his beauty, admiration from ALL other angels, gifts, abilities, etc., by God he was NOT made in the "image of God": he just happened to be the top angel,

                 1) therefore, Lucifer was created as a "spirit being" and not as Adam who was given a physical body, he was "breathed into" by God HIMSELF,

                           a) God imparted "His Spirit" (not the Holy Spirit) into Adam and he BECAME a "living soul". Lucifer was NOT made a "living soul" despite all his glory given him by God..... 

                           b) Now, even thought this "human" or "man" may not look as brilliant and beautiful and powerful with all the amazing gifts, here comes this "new creation" who can not begin to do anything he can do.....  but Adam is made in God's image and has a very "special" relationship with him .... something Lucifer can never have with God.... the angels are not built / created for this kind of relationship or interaction with God - angels are messengers and do not have HIS "Spirit" within him.

                                   1) this will now cause Lucifer to see "red" and he is not able to accept being second to these "humans"..... 

                                   2) prior to Adam's creation, Lucifer had no restrictions in heaven and since there was no physical world (yet) he had nothing to be jealous or worry about,

                                   3) when he witnessed this special relationship with Adam he would jump right down to the Garden in an attempt to corrupt or destroy this "precious" relationship with the Creator. Since he had been a "good boy" up to this time, he had no restrictions on visiting this "new physical world",

                                               a) but he learned of the one and only command by God given to Adam - do not eat of the tree.... here is Lucifer's opportunity to show God this "new creation" where you imparted your "Spirit" into will indeed disobey you and I will show you just how this "human" is overrated and must be destroyed - He is not what you think.... he will certainly disobey you!

                                   4) Well, Lucifer certainly did deceive Adam and he disobeyed God and we know the story,

                                              a) Adam was kicked out of the Garden,

                                              b) Lucifer was kicked out of heaven,

                                              c) Mankind is trying to get back into HIS Presence,

                                              d) Lucifer / now Satan is still trying to deceive / corrupt mankind,

 

2) It has been almost 6,000 years of this spiritual battle and it will soon come to an end,

            a) For those that have obeyed Jesus, welcome home,

            b) For those that have NOT obeyed Jesus and accepted the Cross, welcome gone!

Just my thoughts, Charlie

[1to3]

52 minutes ago, Starise said:

In the end, WHEN it happened isn't as important to me as what happened as a result and how this has affected not only Adam and Eve but all men from then on. The war is still a ragin' they just moved the battleground to earth.

fruit really something edible, or was this a way to explain something we might not have grasped otherwise?

 Yes the battleground is within the principalities of first and second heaven. The 3rd heaven is the place where only Light and good exists. Christ Jesus is the door, the bridge, the Blood covering that allows us to become acceptable to ever be able to be in the presence of Gods light and to be able live with God forever more in the third heaven where no evil ever exists.

 

[BK1110]

I will start with saying that I do not know for sure. I'll follow up with saying that I consider myself an "old-earth creationist," though labels can sometimes do more harm than good. That's too big to go into here but I'll point you to the work of Dr. Hugh Ross (who has many free videos on Youtube so no purchase nessicary to learn more) if you're interested in getting a fuller picture of my frame of reference.

But just to be simple about it, there's nothing I see in Genesis that indicates that the Genesis account precludes God creating things before it. We don't know for certain what God did or was doing before Genesis begins. It could be that everything with Satan and the angels falling happened after "In the beginning," but it's not necessarily true. "In the beginning" could simply be "the beginning of this universe and it's time, space, and matter," after all.

[Justin Adams]

8 minutes ago, BK1110 said:

We don't know for certain what God did or was doing before Genesis begins.

Hugh Ross is brilliant. After ten minutes my brain turns to glue and I seek coffee. In the Wisdom book(s), and other second temple literature, it appears that the 'bad-holy-ones' were tweaked at having to bow to God's human creation. Revelation, at the birth of Christ, seems to say that this caused a huge heavenly battle and haSatan (or satan 'proper noun') was kicked out. This was Yeshua's advent, "behold, I saw Satan fall like lightning from Heaven". This was NOT at the beginning, though we can see haSatan (the Nacash) gets his indictment in The Garden.

[enoob57]

The creation of angels are not mentioned... however the statement of Job they were present on the 4th day... we know everything was started on the 1st day as for having place for all that would be and this is reiterated here
Gen 2:1-3

2 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.   Staying true to the written format we see heavens (plural) and earth finished then all the host within them (which falls all else) see note below

2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
KJV

So sometime after God made place for His creation and the 4th day angels were created... we also know by the above that Lucifer had not fallen yet "And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it"
chapter 2 is reiteration of creation probably due to the added event satan formed lie into himself because now we have a tree representing good and evil that man was not to take part of...


note: to be true to the revealed word which is our only source of truth according to God John 17:17  Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.  no gap no anything else is permitted in the strict confines of God's Word for He has given us this verse below and it is to be headed as toward obedience to God in His revealed truth 

2 Cor 10:5

5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
KJV
thus we are to form our understanding to the Word of God and not to fanciful not found in His Word things called imaginations....

[enoob57]

43 minutes ago, SONshine said:

 So, when was the beginning? 

day one...