The MARK of the Beast is literal

[justme7]

this same type of technology is being thought about for uses of identification in places like China. i think that the main point is, yes, we do have the technology. while tracking devices for known pedifiles does not fall under the 'mark of the beast' category, we can all see that this technology has the potential to bring prophecy to fulfillment. whether this type of technology will be used or not, we do all know that the 'mark' must be literal......eventually (if in our lifetime), there will be a mark neccesary to buy and sell. in my mind that is the determining factor. when i first read of this technology and it's possible ramifications, my very first thought was of the 'mark' naturally. i guess there's no telling how it will actually come, only the knowledge that it will. freaky business! i pray that we the body can see with clear eyes and deny this hideous mark in faith, when (if in our lifetimes) it is imposed upon us.

whether or not we should track pedifiles?? yes, but in this way??? not so sure.

the way that the gov. has been tracking them is somewhat ineffective. even though they are suppose to register wherever they live, so many do not. having known a pedifile and seen the life of a child destroyed by one, i do think the issue is more than serious and find a means of effectively keeping track of them desirable.

[Trust & Obey]

You are forgetting that  Satan is the master of deception.  Do you think he is going to be so blatant?  That this mark of the beast will be so obvious that even nonbelievers will recognize it?  Someone who doesn't believe in God and doesn't read the Bible?  Do you think someone or some gov. is going to say:  Take this microchip and worship me or die.  I don't think it is going to be that simple.

In Christ,

CarolineS

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, I do believe it will be that blatant. You forget the other side of that coin. And, that is that it MUST be blatant, or else people might "accidentally" take the Mark. God would not have it that way. Nobody is going to "accidentally" swear allegiance to the Beast.

Nay, men will know they are swearing allegiance to the Beast and the false system.

The prophecies on the mark are very literal and there is no need for "figurative interpretation."

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It always amazes me that people will read the Book of Revelation and understand that the dragon, the beasts, a woman clothed with the sun, a Lamb, etc. are all symbolic. Then they read about a mark and all of a sudden the mark has to be literal.

Secondly, how can you know what this mark is, if you do not first identify the beast that causes all to receive this mark?

In Christ,

CarolineS

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, whatever the Mark is it will be used to track world commerce. A microchip implant has that capacity. So, I draw the connection there simply because it fits well and is a real possibility seeing as it is TODAY's technology and is being used for other purposes as I write this.

Regarding what is symbolic and what is not... so, what does "forehead" symbolize? What about "right hand?" What does that symbolize? What does "John" (the one who penned the book) symbolize? What does "God" symbolize?

You get the point. Some things are obviously symbolic, whereas other things are not obvious. If you want to impose some symbolism on them then you are certainly free to do that. But, understand that your symbolic interpretation cannot be any more valid than someone else's symbolic interpretation regarding the Mark seeing as you cannot prove one is accurate and the other is inaccurate.

However, if you just read the prophecy the way it is written it explains itself. Nobody will be able to "buy or sell" (i.e. engage in commerce or sustain themselves) without "the Mark" in "their right hand or forehead."

It is pretty simple if you let it be. Try not to overcomplicate that which needeth not be.

[Trust & Obey]

this same type of technology is being thought about for uses of identification in places like China.  i think that the main point is, yes, we do have the technology.  while tracking devices for known pedifiles does not fall under the 'mark of the beast' category, we can all see that this technology has the potential to bring prophecy to fulfillment.  whether this type of technology will be used or not, we do all know that the 'mark' must be literal......eventually (if in our lifetime), there will be a mark neccesary to buy and sell.  in my mind that is the determining factor.  when i first read of this technology and it's possible ramifications, my very first thought was of the 'mark' naturally.  i guess there's no telling how it will actually come, only the knowledge that it will.  freaky business!  i pray that we the body can see with clear eyes and deny this hideous mark in faith, when (if in our lifetimes) it is imposed upon us.

whether or not we should track pedifiles??  yes, but in this way???  not so sure.

the way that the gov. has been tracking them is somewhat ineffective.  even though they are suppose to register wherever they live, so many do not.  having known a pedifile and seen the life of a child destroyed by one,  i do think the issue is more than serious and find a means of effectively keeping track of them desirable.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Amen. That was my point. These examples are simply evidence of the trends towards tracking and controlling people with advanced technology. This technology makes a literal interpretation of the Mark completely viable.

[fenwar]

The whole of Revelation is laden with metaphor and symbolism. John is talking in code to a persecuted church and does not mention their persecutors by name. And he is being shown "visions" which are illustrations of the truth, not depictions of actual events. When you try to read them as literal prediction, you end up with all kinds of confusion.

I've tried to illustrate this before using analogies but most people don't seem to "get it"... here's another take:

When people talk about computer hacking, they may divide hackers up into two categories. "White hat hackers" are the benevolent hackers, who might be employed by a company to test their system defences, or who inform software manufacturers of the vulnerabilities they find. "Black hat hackers" are those who probe defences and exploit software for malicious purposes or personal gain.

The use of imagery from Western movies is obvious - "the good guys wear white" - but equally obvious is the fact that these hackers aren't actually wearing white or black hats!

John's vision has some similarities to Ezekiel's vision (described in Ezek 8-11). Both men see God marking people out, so that he can tell the difference between the righteous and the unrighteous. John is drawing on that imagery and extending it so that not only do the righteous receive a mark - so do the unrighteous. So later on when he sees a vision of the judgement, he knows that those he sees "burning" are the wicked - because he saw them get the mark earlier in the vision.

This is for his benefit and his readers' benefit; he knows his readers will understand because they will be familiar with Ezekiel already (and if not - they'll know someone who does) - just like the hackers' "hats" are for our benefit. It's an image we'll understand because we already have the cultural familiarity with Western movies.

Fifty years ago, to say that one would have a "mark" in/on the right hand or in/on the forehead, so that no one could buy or sell..." would make less sense than it does now.

And to John's audience it would have made even less sense. Why would he write something they couldn't possibly understand? The fact is, he didn't. If anything, he wrote this to make it easier for them to understand.

If I hear that the police are rounding up and jailing "black hat" hackers, I know that they're getting what was coming to them. If John tells his readers that those who took "the mark of the Beast" will be judged by God, the audience knows that they'll be getting what's coming to them.

That's what this imagery is all about. It's not hocus-pocus - it's a very simple concept.

[Skeptic]

You are forgetting that

[Sgtazur]

Not much in the Bible is symbolic. People back then actually believed dragons roamed the earth. Drawings of these things go back thousands of years and are even still believed alive by some (china and the druins(sp) of Ireland) The only thing that makes things in the bible symbolic is because we don't believe in dragons or monsters and such. The Bible is as simple as it is written, people over analyze it because they either don't like what it says or they don't believe what  is said is possible. When and if this happens, I think we will know and it will be as simple as the bible says it will be.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There are some passages in the bible which recall:

"9And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. "

They link the image/symbol of the dragon right to the Devil himself.

[Skeptic]

Not much in the Bible is symbolic. People back then actually believed dragons roamed the earth. Drawings of these things go back thousands of years and are even still believed alive by some (china and the druins(sp) of Ireland) The only thing that makes things in the bible symbolic is because we don't believe in dragons or monsters and such. The Bible is as simple as it is written, people over analyze it because they either don't like what it says or they don't believe what

[CarolineS]

You are forgetting that

[NITE OWL]

CarolineS

You are so close to the truth. Nothing you said is out of line.

Good post

[CarolineS]

CarolineS

You are so close to the truth. Nothing you said is out of line.

Good post

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks Nite Owl.

I just cannot figure out how it is all going to fall into place. But I think we are getting close. I have decided the only preparation is spiritual preparation. The Word, Jesus, and faith; prayer, trust in God; the willingness to follow where ever

Christ leads. And the ability to discern false doctrine from truth.

God help us all in the days ahead and in the time of testing coming upon the earth.

In Christ,

CarolineS