Who Is The Angel Of The LORD?

[Your closest friendnt]

On 4/23/2022 at 7:24 AM, Selah7 said:

Have you ever wondered who the Angel of the LORD is?  

The Angel of the LORD is GOD Himself! 

you can never justify this with scripture.  

The Angel of the Lord was send on a mission fro the Lord God Almighty.

The Lord God had many Angels and very powerful ones. Whom the Lord send to men to do his will, with specific instructions and spoke to people what the Lord had asked them to say. 

Because not all Angels are from God, the scripture testifies that the specific Angel in the context is from the Lord God Almighty.

That the Lord God has send him, that he is on a mission from God Almighty the Lord. 

They were other Angel's, the fallen Angel's, from the Gods of the Idolaters and the Egyptians, and the Canaanites. 

They were in Canaan and it was important that the Angel's of the local Gods were not the ones who were sent to them, but one of the Angel's of the Lord God.

With Lot we see not one but two Angel's from God almighty and Lot called them Lords. 

They were called Lords, all the Angels from the Lord God were address as Lord. 

God had Angels and he sent them on missions equipped with power.

As in the case of Samson, the Angel who said to Samson's parents not to make a burnt offering to him, but to make the offering to the Lord.

That what the Angel said to his parents who wanted to offer a burned offering to him...

The Angel made the distinction between him and the Lord. 

If you want to offer a burn offering, offer it to the Lord and not to ME. 

And they still called him Lord and or God, because that's how the people talked about the Angels, they were seeing the Angels and not the Lord.

The Angel who spoke to Moses from within the burning Bush., 

They are not destroyed by fire, like the Angel who spoke to Samson's parents who Jump on the offering fire. 

The Law was given to Moses from the Lord through Angels. 

Melhisedec who was a Priest to the Lord, and who was also a King of the city of (not remembering the name), but Abraham knew it because he was a confidante of Abraham and he had pledge to fight with him as Abraham had pledge not to fight against him but with him.

As the brothers who were Confederate with Abraham and they went to the war with him.

Melhisedec was a king and a Priest to the Lord and not in any Temple of God.

The same with Jesus Christ who was a King and a Priest to God and not in the Temple but without the Temple, just like Melhisedec.

The Temple does not lead to the Heavenly Father, only to the Lord God. 

That's why Jesus offered himself outside the Temple of Jerusalem because his sacrifice open the way to the Heavenly Father.  Removed the veil to the Heavenly Father. 

And no other Preist could do that because they did not have a Temple for the Heavenly Father. 

Jesus was the only Temple of the Heavenly Father. 

The Heavenly Father only recognized Jesus, as his Temple as we see that during the baptism with John.

It had to be Jesus as no one else could do.  

 

Edited April 25, 2022 by Your closest friendnt

[Dennis1209]

43 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said:

What are you trying to prove that the Lord God almighty the Creator of Heaven and earth and man had no Angels under his command and he had to do everything himself. Read the scriptures without the fixation of Christophany. 

His name is Jesus the appointed Christ to be. 

And that did not happen  before the Cross, but after Jesus had to go all the testing God had put before him.

And it is the Heavenly Father who Judged him and declared him the Christ in Heaven and on Earth.  

He sat him on the Throne to his right. 

Jesus said if I do not obey God to drink this cup who has put infront of me I will never be declare the Christ of God. 

Genesis 32:27 And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob. 28. And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed. 29. And Jacob asked him, and said, Tell me, I pray thee, thy name. And he said, Wherefore is it that thou dost ask after my name? And he blessed him there.

A messenger angel in his authority changes Jacob’s name to Israel? Where is it said in the Bible any messenger angel ever blessed anyone?

Daniel 3:28 Then Nebuchadnezzar spake, and said, Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, who hath sent his angel, and delivered his servants that trusted in him, and have changed the king's word, and yielded their bodies, that they might not serve nor worship any god, except their own God.

Another Christophany, again, in my opinion.

The pre-incarnate Jesus made several physical appearances, including Abraham with two angels. Notice the all-capitalized name of the LORD.

Genesis 18:1 And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;

[Marathoner]

I'm not following any of that, YCF. Sorry, don't get what you're saying.

@Selah7 is referring specifically to the angel of the LORD, the LORD being a traditional rendition translators use for YHWH. 

As she and others have pointed out in this topic, in those instances where the angel of the LORD appears in the Hebrew scriptures, it is clear that the angel of the LORD is God Himself. 

I'm not understanding what you wrote because if I take what is written at face value, you're claiming the Son of God didn't exist until He was born to Mary? That He wasn't the Son of God unless He did whatever you're claiming in Gethsemane? 

Confusing, because Christ asserted His eternal being and nature more than once in the Gospels. The apostle John in particular made sure that we all know that...

Jesus Christ is the Son of God. 

He is the Word of God.

He has always been with the Father, and IS God. All things were created through Him.

Those are central to faith in Christ. So, perhaps I am simply not understanding what you wrote. 

[Your closest friendnt]

3 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said:

Genesis 32:27 And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob. 28. And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed. 29. And Jacob asked him, and said, Tell me, I pray thee, thy name. And he said, Wherefore is it that thou dost ask after my name? And he blessed him there.

A messenger angel in his authority changes Jacob’s name to Israel? Where is it said in the Bible any messenger angel ever blessed anyone?

Daniel 3:28 Then Nebuchadnezzar spake, and said, Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, who hath sent his angel, and delivered his servants that trusted in him, and have changed the king's word, and yielded their bodies, that they might not serve nor worship any god, except their own God.

Another Christophany, again, in my opinion.

The pre-incarnate Jesus made several physical appearances, including Abraham with two angels. Notice the all-capitalized name of the LORD.

Genesis 18:1 And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;

Daniel 3:28 

Daniel 3:28 Then Nebuchadnezzar spake, and said, Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego,

who hath sent his angel, and delivered his servants that trusted in him,

Sometimes the Angel identify himself, and sometimes when he was asked what is your name, he said "why you dare to ask" or something like that.

To Christophany, it is something out of the blue...

It is something the disciples of Jesus Christ did not teach, because they did not believe it. 

[Your closest friendnt]

3 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

I'm not following any of that, YCF. Sorry, don't get what you're saying.

@Selah7 is referring specifically to the angel of the LORD, the LORD being a traditional rendition translators use for YHWH. 

As she and others have pointed out in this topic, in those instances where the angel of the LORD appears in the Hebrew scriptures, it is clear that the angel of the LORD is God Himself. 

I'm not understanding what you wrote because if I take what is written at face value, you're claiming the Son of God didn't exist until He was born to Mary? That He wasn't the Son of God unless He did whatever you're claiming in Gethsemane? 

Confusing, because Christ asserted His eternal being and nature more than once in the Gospels. The apostle John in particular made sure that we all know that...

Jesus Christ is the Son of God. 

He is the Word of God.

He has always been with the Father, and IS God. All things were created through Him.

Those are central to faith in Christ. So, perhaps I am simply not understanding what you wrote. 

I am encouraged that you open up your self. 

[Your closest friendnt]

@Marathoner, 

Because you believe that the Lord can teach, this is why I do not fill in the gaps. 

[Marathoner]

It is worth reading what George has contributed to this excellent topic. Our brother @Dennis1209also touches upon the same thing in what he wrote about above: theophany.

He shared a key passage from Genesis 32, one my favorites in understanding the theophany! Jacob declared that he saw God and lived... so in keeping with the harmony of the scriptures, we know that Jacob who became Israel did not see our Father. The harmony of the scriptures teaches us that:

No man has seen the Father at any time;

His Son, the Word of God, explains the Father;

The Son of God is the express IMAGE of our Father in heaven;

The Son speaks what He hears the Father say, and does what He sees the Father doing;

The Son of God IS God, has always been God, and will always be the Lord God Almighty;

Therefore, whenever man witnesses God in the scriptures, he has witnessed the Son of the living God. He appeared in the likeness of a man to Abraham and others, like Joshua. In these passages where God is witnessed, either in the likeness of man or the angel of YHWH, there is no question He is God. He speaks as God Himself.

It is true that until the Word of God became flesh, no one knew of God as our Father; this was a mystery. When Jesus Christ came and walked among us in this flesh, He explained the Father to us. Hence why I say, God spoke plainly to us all without a veil separating man from Him as in days of old. 

However, we who are in Christ, illuminated by the Spirit of God, read the Hebrew scriptures and understand what was a mystery in their day. The Hebrew scriptures testify if the Son of God! 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Marathoner
Typos

[Your closest friendnt]

1 hour ago, Dennis1209 said:

Genesis 32:27 And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob. 28. And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed. 29. And Jacob asked him, and said, Tell me, I pray thee, thy name. And he said, Wherefore is it that thou dost ask after my name? And he blessed him there.

 

 

1 hour ago, Dennis1209 said:

A messenger angel in his authority changes Jacob’s name to Israel? Where is it said in the Bible any messenger angel ever blessed anyone?

Why did you have to say that? 

All the Angels in the Old Testament send by YHWH to men were on a mission from YHWH.

YHWH gave them a message to bring to someone and YHWH gave them the power and the authority to speak the words they had received from YHWH.

Why do you have to say that I said that they took matters in their own hands and acted in their own Authority without having been authorized by YHWH...as in the case of Jacob. 

If the Angel from YHWH had acted on his own authority without being on a mission from YHWH, why YHWH has spoken about Jacob as Israel and has validated the blessing of the Angel (what was his name again?) Through out as to what happened there after and we have the Israelites, which what the blessing was that all the children of Jacob will be included in the Blessing to Abraham, that none will be excluded, as it happened with Ismael and the other children of Abraham and with Esau, Jacob's brother.  

 why you did not post the posting of the one who is supposed to have post that? 

Why, is it because no one has said what you claim in bold.

The events with Daniel happened so Long ago and since that time no one has come to disagree with the word of Nabuchadnezzar who said YHWH sent his Angel to shut the Lions mouths. 

Daniel did not say anything contrary to that.

All the prophets of God never said anything contrary to that and YHWH had a lot of time to set the record strait and has never said anything to the contrary, and Jesus and the disciples, mostly Jesus, because if that had to do with him he would have mention it, he would have known.

Jesus said that Abraham has seen my day and he rejoice.

He never said those things about theophany he never said anything to suggest anything leading to that, and why he would hide it, if it was so.

This teaching is from men and not from God. 

Check the day when it started to circulate amongst the believers you will be surprised. 

The Hebrew said things to the contrary and he made it clear that YHWH was above the Angels, not an Angel himself. 

Every time he appeared to Abraham in a dream all the time he first Identified himself.

Never spoke to anyone before first Identifying who he was. 

 

1 hour ago, Dennis1209 said:

Daniel 3:28 Then Nebuchadnezzar spake, and said, Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, who hath sent his angel, and delivered his servants that trusted in him, and have changed the king's word, and yielded their bodies, that they might not serve nor worship any god, except their own God.

Another Christophany, again, in my opinion.

The pre-incarnate Jesus made several physical appearances, including Abraham with two angels. Notice the all-capitalized name of the LORD.

Genesis 18:1 And the LORD appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;

1 hour ago, Marathoner said:

I'm not following any of that, YCF. Sorry, don't get what you're saying.

@Selah7 is referring specifically to the angel of the LORD, the LORD being a traditional rendition translators use for YHWH. 

As she and others have pointed out in this topic, in those instances where the angel of the LORD appears in the Hebrew scriptures, it is clear that the angel of the LORD is God Himself. 

I'm not understanding what you wrote because if I take what is written at face value, you're claiming the Son of God didn't exist until He was born to Mary?

 

In the Baptist of Jesus, two men were standing besides one another. 

One of them was the miracle Man from a high Priest as a father who did the service in the most Holy place, whom the Lord God knew. 

And the Angel of the Lord-not YHWY himself, but an Angel of YHWH whose name was Gabriel spoke to Zaharias and not out of his own authority but according to the authority he had received from YHWH...

And his word to Zaharias came to pass. 

This is John a man with the greatest genealogy than any man in Israel even ISSAC. 

And the Man Jesus (not Christ) but Jesus of Nazareth the appointed Christ to be from The Heavenly Father.

 

The Heavenly Father said: 

This is my Son pointing to the Man Jesus, who was about 30 years old.

He said I am please with him, because Jesus was asked by the Father to go to John so it can happen what Happened and John had the witness that Jesus is the Messiah and because the Holy Spirit did not recognize John as being from above, because only Jesus had the Life of the Heavenly Father. JESUS was YHWH before he enter our world when he was born as Jesus from Mary after the gestetion period of nine months the same for a man. YHWH was the WORD.

AS in John one, no more and not less.

John has said it all.

1 hour ago, Marathoner said:

That He wasn't the Son of God unless He did whatever you're claiming in Gethsemane? 

Confusing, because Christ asserted His eternal being and nature more than once in the Gospels. The apostle John in particular made sure that we all know that...

Jesus Christ is the Son of God. 

He is the Word of God.

He has always been with the Father, and IS God. All things were created through Him.

Those are central to faith in Christ. So, perhaps I am simply not understanding what you wrote. 

 

[Selah7]

Ycf, good morning.  
 

Angels, cherubim, archangels, and seraphim, have all been created by YHWH.  However, there is only one “Angel of the Lord;” His name is YHWH, the "I AM THAT I AM," who throughout time, has manifested Himself to humans in divine manifestations—a theophany.

in Christ, Selah

[Selah7]

@Your closest friendnt

The passage below gives a clear example of a Divine theophany.  

And the angel of the LORD found her by a fountain of water in the wilderness, by the fountain in the way to Shur. And he said, Hagar, Sarai's maid, whence camest thou? and whither wilt thou go? And she said, I flee from the face of my mistress Sarai. And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Return to thy mistress, and submit thyself under her hands. And the angel of the LORD said unto her, I will multiply thy seed exceedingly, that it shall not be numbered for multitude. And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Behold, thou art with child, and shalt bear a son, and shalt call his name Ishmael; because the LORD hath heard thy affliction. And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him; and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren. And she called the name of the LORD that spake unto her, Thou God seest me: for she said, Have I also here looked after him that seeth me?

- Genesis 16:7-13 (KJV)

S.