Sower Posted May 24, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 14 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,269 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 5,891 Days Won: 1 Joined: 07/09/2009 Status: Offline Share Posted May 24, 2022 34 minutes ago, Heleadethme said: Amen. Me too. I was raised in Catholicism but never heard the gospel preached there....salvation by faith, the need to be born again, Jesus dying to atone for our sins, etc. Sadly just a deadness in the Catholic churches I've been in. Most are not born again, their belief is just a mental belief, it isn't the faith of Christ that is not of our own.....they are lost souls, and many are antagonistic against the true gospel that is apart from their religion. Yes, much of the doctrine and practices....as well as the institution itself is false, not to mention corrupt. Well, it has always been about "whosoever will" and I'm sad for those Catholics I know and only desire that they would know Christ for real. If you don't mind my asking, from a fellow escapee, how did you come to know about the amazing grace of the gospel. Did you drift away from discontent, or did a faithful Christian sow a seed into your soil? My wife and I 40+ yrs ago were at a baptist funeral for our next door neighbor's 13 yr old son when the pastor giving the parting prayer said little Jimmy was in heaven because he was saved, a child of God. And anyone who expects to go to heaven needs to be saved, born again. The seed was sown! Matured, and blossomed. I heard His voice! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starise Posted May 24, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 13 Topic Count: 279 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 13,126 Content Per Day: 9.66 Reputation: 13,666 Days Won: 149 Joined: 08/26/2020 Status: Online Share Posted May 24, 2022 3 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said: Do some protestants hold the belief that the sins of a believer in Jesus Christ can be counted against him after he dies. The Bible teaches all saved men will be judged for all things done in the body, both good and bad. This judgement will not determine salvation since we are already saved. The lost will stand in a separate judgement. Some men will be saved "as by fire".They did little or nothing however they are still saved. Others will receive great rewards. Responsibilities, rewards and positions in heaven will be determined by this judgement.Some men will judge angels. A lost man cannot be prayed into heaven after he dies. Neither can a saved man be taken from God's hand. The question then is, what are we doing with that was given to us? Remember the parable of the talents. One man hid the only talent he had.Another man invested and multiplied what was given to him.The Lord was displeased with the man who hid his only talent. The fields are white for the harvest. It is the evil ones who want us to think we don't have a chance to aid in bringing the word to the lost and to reap a great harvest of souls. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heleadethme Posted May 25, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 15 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,371 Content Per Day: 1.35 Reputation: 3,268 Days Won: 5 Joined: 07/10/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 25, 2022 (edited) 15 hours ago, Sower said: If you don't mind my asking, from a fellow escapee, how did you come to know about the amazing grace of the gospel. Did you drift away from discontent, or did a faithful Christian sow a seed into your soil? My wife and I 40+ yrs ago were at a baptist funeral for our next door neighbor's 13 yr old son when the pastor giving the parting prayer said little Jimmy was in heaven because he was saved, a child of God. And anyone who expects to go to heaven needs to be saved, born again. The seed was sown! Matured, and blossomed. I heard His voice! By the time I was in my late teens my family was only attending Mass on special occasions, which suited me fine and I didn't bother with it at all once I finished high school. But in my late twenties the Lord out of the blue gave me a desire to go to church one day at Easter time, didn't know why I had that desire, I thought it was strange because I was agnostic at the time. And I had a definite 'instinct' not to go to a Catholic church knowing there was nothing real there for me...so I called up an uncle and aunt of mine who were born again believers and had witnessed to me and asked if I could accompany them to their church (happened to be Brethren in Christ). It happened that they were holding a gospel preaching 'crusade' that Easter season, and long story short, the Lord got hold of me and revealed Himself and the gospel in a miraculous way and put me in the path of righteousness. Hardly stopped crying with joy for a solid week, I was so happy there was a God after all, and that I knew Him. I did leave that church after a while though because they were cessationist and I knew that what God had done in me was a series of miracles including deliverance from nicotine addiction, and that He still does miracles today according to His word, however, was so grateful to be saved and to know Jesus! "Let us therefore go to Him OUTSIDE THE CAMP, BEARING HIS REPROACH" seems to be kind of a theme with me for many years. I have nowhere to lay my head, so to speak, no where on this earth to call home spiritually. Like Abraham, seeking the city that is above. The Lord led me out of the churches and called me to "come out of her" and more recently has shown me that His will for His church (people) is the simplicity of Christ, which I keep trumpeting now and then like a broken record. That necessitates firstly a change of heart, because religious-ness comes from the flesh and mind of man......all the usual stuff....ambition, control, seeking to establish our own righteousness instead of submitting to the righteousness of Christ, outward appearances of things, etc. The scriptures say "except the LORD build the house, they labour in vain." He only builds on His own foundation of Christ....which includes His simplicity. How did Jesus do things when He was on earth? He SIMPLY went around doing good and preaching the good news with SIGNS ACCOMPANYING.......no special robes, no special rituals, no special titles, no special building, etc., just real life with the Holy Spirit. "Wherever two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst." So simple...and all the various parts/ members of the body of Christ simply functioning in their gifts, as the Lord leads. "When you come together, every one of you hath......." whatever spiritual gift the Lord gives to each one and leads us to share. He is only Head of His church when He is leading it by His Spirit. Not the way man-made churches do things with men usurping the Headship of Christ. There is to be no schism in the Body...no division between so called clergy and so called laity.... all just have different gifts that's all. Better stop there, I'm going on a bit long. Edited May 25, 2022 by Heleadethme 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heleadethme Posted May 25, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 15 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,371 Content Per Day: 1.35 Reputation: 3,268 Days Won: 5 Joined: 07/10/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted May 25, 2022 14 hours ago, Starise said: The Bible teaches all saved men will be judged for all things done in the body, both good and bad. This judgement will not determine salvation since we are already saved. The lost will stand in a separate judgement. Some men will be saved "as by fire".They did little or nothing however they are still saved. Others will receive great rewards. Responsibilities, rewards and positions in heaven will be determined by this judgement.Some men will judge angels. A lost man cannot be prayed into heaven after he dies. Neither can a saved man be taken from God's hand. The question then is, what are we doing with that was given to us? Remember the parable of the talents. One man hid the only talent he had.Another man invested and multiplied what was given to him.The Lord was displeased with the man who hid his only talent. The fields are white for the harvest. It is the evil ones who want us to think we don't have a chance to aid in bringing the word to the lost and to reap a great harvest of souls. Yes....the parable of the talents where the Lord warns that even the little someone has could be taken away from them. I have a sense from scripture that salvation is not something we're to take for granted. We aren't to just sit around relaxing on our laurels. We're told to work out our salvation with fear and trembling. We're admonished to run the race so as to win it, and that those who strive for the mastery are not crowned except they run lawfully. There are those to whom Jesus will say, "Away from me you who practice lawlessness" even though they were doing works for God. Fruitless tree being cut down, etc. Lots of things in the word to spur us on and keep us from falling asleep at the wheel. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sower Posted May 25, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 14 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,269 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 5,891 Days Won: 1 Joined: 07/09/2009 Status: Offline Share Posted May 25, 2022 1 hour ago, Heleadethme said: And I had a definite 'instinct' not to go to a Catholic church knowing there was nothing real there for me. As did I. My wife, Lutheran, and I a catholic quit going to catholic church. We wanted to be a part of a church, but my/our instinct/spirits said not the RCC (too many gargoyles and statues of dead people, and so many black robes, and my spirit saying flee). Later at that baptist funeral we heard the gospel, the great news. Perhaps a month later my wife accepted Christ (believed) in the back yard alone by herself, and later I also while driving my old VW bug at night going home out in the country, telling God everything I believed, and wanted Him to let me know if I was saved by actually just believing. He did, and it was confirmed in my heart. The fork in the road experience. (And He will direct thy path!) We both have a heart now to share the knowledge-truth to whomsoever will. Someone shared the good news with us. We believed. Our lives were changed. Pass it on. I think, Heleadethme, we have been given understandings of the deceptions of RCC false teachings and the desire to expose them to the truth. I let my words of truth to be examined with/by the inspired word of God, and accept any criticism. The word is Light. I share that Light. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted May 25, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 0 Topic Count: 909 Topics Per Day: 0.19 Content Count: 9,657 Content Per Day: 2.02 Reputation: 5,839 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/07/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted May 25, 2022 5 minutes ago, Sower said: As did I. My wife, Lutheran, and I a catholic quit going to catholic church. We wanted to be a part of a church, but my/our instinct/spirits said not the RCC (too many gargoyles and statues of dead people, and so many black robes, and my spirit saying flee). Later at that baptist funeral we heard the gospel, the great news. Perhaps a month later my wife accepted Christ (believed) in the back yard alone by herself, and later I also while driving my old VW bug at night going home out in the country, telling God everything I believed, and wanted Him to let me know if I was saved by actually just believing. He did, and it was confirmed in my heart. The fork in the road experience. (And He will direct thy path!) We both have a heart now to share the knowledge-truth to whomsoever will. Someone shared the good news with us. We believed. Our lives were changed. Pass it on. I think, Heleadethme, we have been given understandings of the deceptions of RCC false teachings and the desire to expose them to the truth. I let my words of truth to be examined with/by the inspired word of God, and accept any criticism. The word is Light. I share that Light. And that's the rub. Which I am ecstatic to hear!!! It's all about Jesus. Period. There are true believers in Roman Catholicism despite Roman Catholicism. There are true believers despite Protestantism. There are true believers despite Messianic Judaism. Underneath all the isms (organizations) is the true Church Organism despite the other. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted July 10, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.55 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 10, 2022 On 5/20/2022 at 7:02 PM, Anne2 said: It was Messianic Judaism that brought this around Starise. I found i thought what was total shaking off of Catholicism in Messianic Judaism. Low and behold, it was JEWISH CATHOLICISM, the sacraments in keeping the commandments of oral law. Just stating what happened to me. Blessed are you oh lord, king of the universe who Sanctifies us with his commandments. Yep there it was staring me in the face. So, I looked it up on the internet Read Mark Kinzer. The Enduring sacramental Character of Jewish life The Enduring Sacramental Character of Jewish Life in the Messiah A Messianic Jewish Perspective Mark S. Kinzer (Presented at the Roman Catholic – Messianic Jewish Dialogue Group on August 27, 2013) © Mark S. Kinzer Sacrament & Kedushah1 The sacraments are efficacious signs of grace, instituted by Christ and entrusted to the Church, by which divine life is dispensed to us (CCC 1131). This began my scriptural study of the law from the bible. The authority of the priesthood etc. etc. The Rabbis usurped them when the temple was destroyed and a new priestless Judaism emerged (by the Authority of Rome). Their traditions of Jesus day truly became law under Rome. They transferred many things of the temple to the synagogue. Thats why synagogues are sometimes called temples. Jesus is our High Priest now: ”Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin. Let us then approach God’s throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.” (Hebrews 4:14-16) And we are Priests under Jesus The High Priest: “But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light.” (1 Peter 2:9) “Jesus, the Christ, who isthe faithful witness and the first begotten of the dead and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us and washed us from our sins with his own blood and has made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him beglory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.” (Revelation 1:5-6) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne2 Posted July 11, 2022 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,499 Content Per Day: 1.47 Reputation: 622 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted July 11, 2022 (edited) 21 hours ago, Fidei Defensor said: Jesus is our High Priest now: Who denies this? Nobody that I can see? Am I missing something? 21 hours ago, Fidei Defensor said: And we are Priests under Jesus The High Priest: “But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light.” (1 Peter 2:9) OK? As far as I know, so does Catholicism. The high priest is Jesus Christ. The priest officiating like the sons of Aaron The people of the congregation like the levites. As far as I know the Catholic laity are PARTICIPANTS in the communion. They participate in response with the clergy. I believe , The Orthodox even face the same direction as the clergy, and do not sit (no pews) during the service, in their participation in the ministration. My point is these ideas are not absent. That is what the missal is for. It helps the congregant to join in the ministration as a whole body. The high priest and his function distinct from.... The sons of Aaron and their function distinct from....... The Levites and their function........ Edited July 11, 2022 by Anne2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted July 11, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 165 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,997 Content Per Day: 1.55 Reputation: 2,607 Days Won: 15 Joined: 04/29/2017 Status: Offline Share Posted July 11, 2022 3 hours ago, Anne2 said: Who denies this? Nobody that I can see? Am I missing something? OK? As far as I know, so does Catholicism. The high priest is Jesus Christ. The priest officiating like the sons of Aaron The people of the congregation like the levites. As far as I know the Catholic laity are PARTICIPANTS in the communion. They participate in response with the clergy. I believe , The Orthodox even face the same direction as the clergy, and do not sit (no pews) during the service, in their participation in the ministration. My point is these ideas are not absent. That is what the missal is for. It helps the congregant to join in the ministration as a whole body. The high priest and his function distinct from.... The sons of Aaron and their function distinct from....... The Levites and their function........ The difference is there is no Levite Priesthood class, we all our priests and equal in Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne2 Posted July 11, 2022 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 7 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,499 Content Per Day: 1.47 Reputation: 622 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted July 11, 2022 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Fidei Defensor said: The difference is there is no Levite Priesthood class, we all our priests and equal in Christ. There is no more order of Aaron or Levitical priesthood anymore either. Nobody is arguing that there is. Rather, It was for a pattern and Shadow. Is 66:18 For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory. 19 And I will set a sign among them, and I will send those that escape of them unto the nations, to Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, that draw the bow, to Tubal, and Javan, to the isles afar off, that have not heard my fame, neither have seen my glory; and they shall declare my glory among the Gentiles. 20 And they shall bring all your brethren for an offering unto the LORD out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, saith the LORD, as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the LORD. {litters: or, coaches } 21 And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, saith the LORD. Edited July 11, 2022 by Anne2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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