Daniel 9:26, 27 explained through New Test verses? YES? or no

[Eternally Gratefull]

14 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

But without any Scripture...it's just conjecture, right?  

I think we see in scripture by looking through all prophecy that there is more than enough evidence to show what I am saying is true.  That prophecy relates to Israel. The 4 beasts of daniel ruled over Isreal. One conquered them. Taking that alone and knowing that Egypt and Assyria also ruled over Israel BEFORE the time of Daniel 2 and 7, we can see it fits well.. I have not posted my write - up study on daniels beasts in this thread and you probably did not see it in the other chatroom. I may post that later and we can look at that. 

 

It is the weekend, I will try to get to the rest of your post. Please be patient. I have a lot to do the next two days. I am not ignoring you. I love our conversations..

[DeighAnn]

21 minutes ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

I think we see in scripture by looking through all prophecy that there is more than enough evidence to show what I am saying is true.  That prophecy relates to Israel. The 4 beasts of daniel ruled over Isreal. One conquered them. Taking that alone and knowing that Egypt and Assyria also ruled over Israel BEFORE the time of Daniel 2 and 7, we can see it fits well.. I have not posted my write - up study on daniels beasts in this thread and you probably did not see it in the other chatroom. I may post that later and we can look at that. 

 

It is the weekend, I will try to get to the rest of your post. Please be patient. I have a lot to do the next two days. I am not ignoring you. I love our conversations..

Let's pick it back up starting Monday as that would work well for me too!  

[Eternally Gratefull]

On 6/24/2022 at 5:00 PM, DeighAnn said:

But without any Scripture...it's just conjecture, right?  

And the Muslims have had 'sway' for longer than any of the others, haven't they? And talk about iron and clay not mixing.... 

This is not about who has had sway longer. This is about prophecy. Once again, if you look at prophecy we see prophecy up until the death of christ. Then it is silent up until the end, when we start to see the last day prophecies come true. 

In between is silence. Because again, if you look at prophecy, most of it concerns israel. Which was destroyed in 70 AD and left desolate 

the next event in prophecy is the 1 week covenant. 

Iron and clay is the final form of rome. Not sure what that has to do with Muslims or islam.

On 6/24/2022 at 5:00 PM, DeighAnn said:

Reading Chapter 17 I find not one thing that relates to the time John was actually living.  It is all written from the perspective of final generation and JUDGMENT having fallen and so the period would be 'The Kingdoms of the world become Christs'.  No where in the entire Chapter is one taken out of that time for a perspective 'from Johns day'.  

I do not see how you can say that.

1 is. (Present) 5 have fallen. (Past tense) 1 is yet to come (future tense) . When John is writing this, the reader should look at his time of writing. I do not see why we would look anyplace else. The passage parallels with Daniels prophecies quite nicely.. if we ar looking at this all as a future event and an event in the future. Then it makes no sense. At least to me

On 6/24/2022 at 5:00 PM, DeighAnn said:

Events taking place during final generation

Revelation 17:1 And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:
 

Revelation 17:2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.

Revelation 17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

Still The final generation

Revelation 17:4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:

Revelation 17:5 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.

Revelation 17:6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

Still The final generation

Revelation 17:7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns.

Still The final generation

Revelation 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

His 'vision' is SEEN of the final generation and it is speaking to what happens at that time and what follows, and so far there has been no change to the subject being discussed, and so no reason to STOP that train of thought, go to JOHNS TIME to reckon the kingdoms from THEN and then head back to the future.  


Revelation 17:9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.

Revelation 17:10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.


Since the timing is of the JUDGMENT on the world, it would HAVE TO BE CHRISTS KINGDOM 'that is',  and the short space what is coming at Satans release

Christ kingdom has not even started yet. This is before the return of christ. The kings in my view are gentile kings who have ruled over Jerusalem. One more has to rule in the “time of the gentiles” as paul called in it romans 11. That one more is the antichrist. Or the final form of Rome, or the iron clay or 4th beast.

Like I said, when you look at this with all of prophecy together. It becomes clear.

On 6/24/2022 at 5:00 PM, DeighAnn said:

Revelation 17:11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

This confirms what KINGDOM is current 

Revelation 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

AGAIN, thou sawest is PAST tense for John, FUTURE to his time, to go back to his time for the rendering,  AGAIN, doesn't make any sense to me. 
 

Revelation 17:13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

Revelation 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Revelation 17:15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.

Revelation 17:16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

Revelation 17:17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

Revelation 17:18 And the woman which thou sawest is thatgreat city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

I disagree,

the beast what was was the rome In Christ’s day. That beast “is not” today. It is dead and has been dead since rome fell

remember the prophecy in daniel. There are ten toes (kings) three of them are removed. That leaves 8. Ruled by the antichrist

dan 7: ²⁴ The ten horns are ten kings Who shall arise from this kingdom. And another shall rise after them;
He shall be different from the first ones, And shall subdue three kings.
²⁵ He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, Shall persecute^[j] the saints of the Most High, And shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time.

so we see

there Were ten.

another one arises making 11

the 11th subdues or Removes 3, That leaves him number 8

It is the antichrist.or the final form of the Roman Empire. 

 

On 6/24/2022 at 5:00 PM, DeighAnn said:

That is why we see this different.  I don't know why ROME is so important to anyone but it is somehow.

The final kingdom will be Satans AS THEY ALL KIND OF HAVE BEEN, then there will be no kingdom under his influence.  

WHY ROME?  I just don't get it.  

Daniel speaks of 4 kingdoms from the time of babylon until the return of christ

1. Babylon

2. Media-Persia

3. Greece

4 Rome

There is no other gentile kingdom. 

As for rome. Some of what was prophesied concerning rome was fulfilled in christ time. Other stuff that was prophesied about rome has not happened even today. 

The 4th beast will be destroyed by the return of christ (the stone who destroyed the statue in Dan 2. The return of christ to put an end to the 4th beast in Dan 7. There is no one else it can be

many believe it will be a european empire. Which will resemble rome in that it will come from the same general area. 

On 6/24/2022 at 5:00 PM, DeighAnn said:

OK, PLEASE explain the preoccupation with Rome.  Why Rome.  Why don't you think of those who ARE PRESENTLY  in  Israel and who don't think they should be there

Again, Rome is the final gentile empire or kingdom which will be in power when christ returns (see dan 2 and 7) Not sure what you are asking about Israel can you explain further?

 

 

Edited June 27, 2022 by Eternally Gratefull

[DeighAnn]

15 hours ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

I do not see how you can say that.

1 is. (Present) 5 have fallen. (Past tense) 1 is yet to come (future tense) . When John is writing this, the reader should look at his time of writing. I do not see why we would look anyplace else. The passage parallels with Daniels prophecies quite nicely.. if we ar looking at this all as a future event and an event in the future. Then it makes no sense. At least to me

Another way GOD keeps us interested?  It is genius, pure and simple everyone reading the same thing but cant understand how it's coming out different.  I will try to show more detail and my end, have a few questions I need you to , maybe might help to sense.  First see if I am following your thoughts

Trying to follow your line of thought, if I understand what you are saying...
1  Egypt, -  
2  Assyria, -  740 - 612  
3  Babylon, - 612 - 539
4  Medo - Persia, - 539 - 331

5  Greece, - 330 -323 - 5TH FALLEN

6  Rome.  - 246BC - 476AD  John in present kingdom -  ONE IS

7  ??????  476 - present* - THE OTHER IS NOT YET COME, WHEN HE COMETH HE MUST CONTINUE ON A SHORT SPACE


8  __???_____________________________________  EIGHTH 

*1500+ years?, would that be considered a 'short space'?


WHERE DO THESE fit in your 'timeline'?
The beast that was? 
and is not? 
even he is the eighth,
and is of the seven,
and goeth into perdition.

----------------------------

 view from the actual point in 'TIME' the angel is showing John

The beast that was? Ezekiel 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee. By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire. Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee. Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

Revelation 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth:  

Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
...and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.


1  Babylon, - 612 - 539

2  Medo - Persia, - 539 - 331

3  Greece, - 330 -323  

4  Rome.  - 246BC - 476AD Revelation 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.
 
5  12 Tribes of Ishmael  - 5 ARE FALLEN

WE ARE CURRENTLY HERE
(1ST 1/2 OF LAST WEEK BEGINS  Revelation 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

6  Satan and angel kicked to earth - ONE IS -  And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.  These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.  Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.  Revelation 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.


THIS IS WHERE 'IN TIME' THE ANGEL HAS TAKEN JOHN 5 are fallen, one is ending one is beginning- JUDGMENT
7  LORDS DAY  - Satan bound, and is not, and is of the seven, -  THE OTHER IS NOT YET COME,  ...and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

Revelation 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.  Revelation 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done  Revelation 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.  Revelation 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.  Revelation 16:20 And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found. Revelation 16:21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great.

8  Satan loosed, ascend out of pit, he is the eighth, and goeth into perdition. -  WHEN HE COMETH HE MUST CONTINUE ON A SHORT SPACE -


 

Revelation 17:6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

Revelation 17:7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns.

Revelation 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: (SATAN)  and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.



 

[Eternally Gratefull]

31 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Another way GOD keeps us interested?  It is genius, pure and simple everyone reading the same thing but cant understand how it's coming out different.  I will try to show more detail and my end, have a few questions I need you to , maybe might help to sense.  First see if I am following your thoughts

Trying to follow your line of thought, if I understand what you are saying...
1  Egypt, -  
2  Assyria, -  740 - 612  
3  Babylon, - 612 - 539
4  Medo - Persia, - 539 - 331

5  Greece, - 330 -323 - 5TH FALLEN

6  Rome.  - 246BC - 476AD  John in present kingdom -  ONE IS

7  ??????  476 - present* - THE OTHER IS NOT YET COME, WHEN HE COMETH HE MUST CONTINUE ON A SHORT SPACE


8  __???_____________________________________  EIGHTH 

*1500+ years?, would that be considered a 'short space'?

Why are you trying to take it to today? There is a prophetic Gap. There is no prophecy of anything between the time of 70 ad until the future prince confirms a covenant for 1 week. Until then, all we have is wars and rumors of wars. Nation rising against nation and kingdom against kingdom.

Once again, Jerusalem is who these gentile leaders hold sway over.  Jerusalem was destroyed in 70 AD and Israel scattered. If your trying to fill in the gap with more nations. You can’t, where does Hitler fit. Or the British empire or the rest of them? They are not there. Because once again we are in a prophetic gap.

the short time is the 3.5 years where do you get 1500?

look at Daniel 2. There are 4 kingdoms. The 4th kingdom is in power when christ returns

Same with Daniel 7

Same with Daniel 9

once agin, they fit quite well

If your going to yell and talk to me like I do not know what I am talking about. I will move on.. 

38 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

WHERE DO THESE fit in your 'timeline'?
The beast that was? 
and is not? 
even he is the eighth,
and is of the seven,
and goeth into perdition.

I have answered this question multiple times. I even showed in daniel specifically where it talks about the 10 kingdoms, plus 1 and after he destroys three. He himself being 8. So what did I miss?

Please go back and read what I have said. If you do not understand what I am saying, please quote my words and ask particular questions. 

As for the rest of your post. I can not agree. It does not fit with Daniel and his prophecies. Prophecy fits together like a puzzle. Thats how we shoudl interpret them.

Again, Daniel said there will be ten kingdoms. Then one will arise. Making 11. He will subdue three, leaving 7 of the origional. He being the 8th.

And again, Jerusalem and Israel is who the gentiles rule over. The period of prophecy stopped in 70 AD. And will not start up again until the prince makes a covenant. 

In the middle of that covenant he breaks it with the abomination of desolation. At the end of the 7 years christ returns. 

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

Why are you trying to take it to today? There is a prophetic Gap. There is no prophecy of anything between the time of 70 ad until the future prince confirms a covenant for 1 week. Until then, all we have is wars and rumors of wars. Nation rising against nation and kingdom against kingdom.

What about Lev 26?  

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

the short time is the 3.5 years where do you get 1500?

from the fall of Rome...until now is the 5th. 

 

1 hour ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

look at Daniel 2. There are 4 kingdoms. The 4th kingdom is in power when christ returns

Daniel 2:32 This image's head was of fine gold (1) ,
his breast and his arms of silver (2) ,
his belly and his thighs of brass (3),
Daniel 2:33 His legs of iron (4) ,
his feet part of iron and part of clay (5).

I see 5 myself.  

[DeighAnn]

 

1 hour ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

I have answered this question multiple times. I even showed in daniel specifically where it talks about the 10 kingdoms, plus 1 and after he destroys three. He himself being 8. So what did I miss?

Please go back and read what I have said. If you do not understand what I am saying, please quote my words and ask particular questions. 

As for the rest of your post. I can not agree. It does not fit with Daniel and his prophecies. Prophecy fits together like a puzzle. Thats how we shoudl interpret them.

Again, Daniel said there will be ten kingdoms. Then one will arise. Making 11. He will subdue three, leaving 7 of the origional. He being the 8th.

And again, Jerusalem and Israel is who the gentiles rule over. The period of prophecy stopped in 70 AD. And will not start up again until the prince makes a covenant. 

In the middle of that covenant he breaks it with the abomination of desolation. At the end of the 7 years christ returns. 

I will go back and read it all again.  

[Eternally Gratefull]

11 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

What about Lev 26?  

fits perfectly.

Lev 26

70 AD is the final punishment all this occured in 70 AD

²⁷ ‘And after all this, if you do not obey Me, but walk contrary to Me, ²⁸ then I also will walk contrary to you in fury and I, even I, will chastise you seven times for your sins.²⁹ You shall eat the flesh of your sons, and you shall eat the flesh of your daughters ³⁰ I will destroy your high places, cut down your incense altars, and cast your carcasses on the lifeless forms of your idols and My soul shall abhor you.³¹ I will lay your cities waste and bring your sanctuaries to desolation, and I will not smell the fragrance of your ^[h]sweet aromas ³² I will bring the land to desolation, and your enemies who dwell in it shall be astonished at it ³³ I will scatter you among the nations and draw out a sword after you your land shall be desolate and your cities waste.

That was the end as I showed.

The end of Daniel 9 was to be when Isreal repented and made an end of sin.

Lev 26 deals with that also

⁴⁰ ‘But if they confess their iniquity and the iniquity of their fathers, with their unfaithfulness in which they were unfaithful to Me, and that they also have walked contrary to Me ⁴¹ and that I also have walked contrary to them and have brought them into the land of their enemies if their uncircumcised hearts are humbled, and they accept their guilt ⁴² then I will remember My covenant with Jacob, and My covenant with Isaac and My covenant with Abraham I will remember;I will remember the land.

 

all the OT prophets spoke of Isreal repenting and bring brought back into the land at the end, And Jesus setting up his throne in Jerusalem. and ruling with a rod of iron.

 

inbetween 70 AD, and the time of Jacobs trouble, or great tribulation. or end of the age as it is called it in Matt 24. is a time of quiet. where there is no prophecy. Much like the time between Micah and the NT

[Eternally Gratefull]

13 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

from the fall of Rome...until now is the 5th. 

where are you getting this data? The is no OT prophecy about that time period in history. why would God mention it now?

Daniel 2:32 This image's head was of fine gold (1) ,
his breast and his arms of silver (2) ,
his belly and his thighs of brass (3),
Daniel 2:33 His legs of iron (4) ,
his feet part of iron and part of clay (5).

I see 5 myself.  

I do too. But as you see. The feet and Legs have iron.

Legs were Rome in Christ's time

feet of iron and clay is the ten nation confederacy led by the man of sin, or as many call it Rome 2. who will be in power when Christ returns. Christ will defeat him, he is the last gentile ruler in the age or time of the gentiles. When this is done the fullness of the gentile is completed

it will be at the end of that that Israel repents and is restored.

rom 11:

²⁵ For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own ^[f]opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. ²⁶ And so all Israel will be ^[g]saved, as it is written:

“The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
²⁷ For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”

when this happens. Dan 9 is fulfilled.