Charlie744 Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 55 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 2,690 Content Per Day: 1.72 Reputation: 862 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/29/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2022 20 minutes ago, other one said: I'm not sure what you mean by "The Law". If you are speaking of the ten commandments, they were not enough to satisfy the Father in living in his presence. If you follow Jesus closely he transformed the ten commandments from just physical commandments to spiritual commandments and wrapped them up in the two he gave us. For instance take the commandment against murder.... fixed it to the point that you can't even want to commit murder and not just that you can't physically do so. With this way you aren't even supposed to hate anyone without just cause. Same as having lust for your neighbors stuff and his wife. If you look upon her with lust in your heart you are already guilty of adulatory. The ten commandments do not really cover loving your neighbor as is expected for Jesus followers to do. Read Matthew chapter 25 starting with verse 40. Jesus is judging people and sending them to hell. Read that closely and you sill discover that none of the reasons given actually break any of the ten commandments... You can go to hell without breaking "the law". People ask, "Am I my brothers keeper?" Well Jesus says for the most part, "Yes, you are." And that's some of the reasons that it wasn't enough to just be under the law. The laws of Moses were basically rules for us to live together here on earth, and Jesus's laws are to prepare us to live in the heavenly realm with them. The ten commandments were not enough to prepare us for that. The 10 commandments that were written in stone are now written in our hearts and minds- same 10. They were given to reveal many things - the character and image of God, His commands to live by, the way to our salvation, etc. They gave us everything we needed to understand just how we must live and how far we are from God. We, on our own are utterly incapable of fulfilling those commandments- even for a day. Jesus confirmed the New Covenant with His sacrifice giving us the only way to salvation- the Law was not and could not be done away with, however, Jesus addressed the other side of the equation- He would pay the price for our sins. It is just as with the scene when God established His covenant with Abraham- it was God who fulfilled BOTH sides - He established or gave Abraham the promise and then HE went through the animals that were cut in half. Here we have God’s 10 commandments and once again, God will be “cut off” and perform the other side of the covenant. The one side of His covenants with man would never change- it is the other side that Jesus is addressing- who will pay for our sin. The 10 commandments are complete- there is not one sin that can not be found to be in at least one of His commandments. There are not two commandments but still 10- Jesus was summarizing the full nature and scope of His law.. He revealed it was so much more than a list of rules to follow- the Jews treated the law as a legalistic set of instructions and commands. Jesus showed/told them no, it is more than a set of rules- it revealed just how far we are from being able to be with Him because He will not be in the presence of ANY sin- this sacrifice if Jesus would make that possible- He designed the only way to be reconciled to Him— but without ever removing, eliminating, lowering, changing or diluting His laws. Just my thoughts. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,887 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,775 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, DeighAnn said: Sorry but I am not following you here. Joined to Christ, to the New Covenant? Grace and eternal life though Grace? OK but what does that tell me about what was wrong with being under the law? I have a different question you might answer, as far as 'death' and 'resurrection' goes , WHAT is the difference Under the law when they died what happened? Under grace when we die what happens? Under the Law when they died what happened? This question could be made a little different, and this is because we have those who died with the Law and those who died cut of from the Law.. Cut off from the Law, cut off from God, cut off from the community, cut off from Abraham... Some of the Israelites died and were included in Abraham their Patriarch and some died not included in Abraham... Edited July 16, 2022 by Your closest friendnt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,260 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,988 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2022 46 minutes ago, Charlie744 said: The 10 commandments that were written in stone are now written in our hearts and minds- same 10. They were given to reveal many things - the character and image of God, His commands to live by, the way to our salvation, etc. So which of the ten did those in Matthew 25 break that caused them to go to hell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,260 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,988 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2022 48 minutes ago, Charlie744 said: They gave us everything we needed to understand just how we must live and how far we are from God. We, on our own are utterly incapable of fulfilling those commandments- even for a day. again I ask which of the ten did those in Matthew chapter 25 break that caused Jesus to send them to hell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie744 Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 55 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 2,690 Content Per Day: 1.72 Reputation: 862 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/29/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2022 9 minutes ago, other one said: So which of the ten did those in Matthew 25 break that caused them to go to hell? Not following you here... please explain. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,260 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,988 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2022 49 minutes ago, Charlie744 said: Jesus confirmed the New Covenant with His sacrifice giving us the only way to salvation- the Law was not and could not be done away with, however, Jesus addressed the other side of the equation- He would pay the price for our sins. Quote Ex 20:8-11 8 "Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is a sabbath of the Lord your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter, your male or your female servant or your cattle or your sojourner who stays with you. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day and made it holy. NASB Quote John 5:16-17 And for this reason the Jews were persecuting Jesus, because He was doing these things on the Sabbath. 17 But He answered them, "My Father is working until now, and I Myself am working." NASB Oh my, Jesus just confessed he is working on the Sabbath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,398 Content Per Day: 8.00 Reputation: 21,569 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted July 16, 2022 On 7/14/2022 at 11:58 AM, DeighAnn said: What was wrong with being under the law? Why weren't we just given the Holy Spirit to help us follow the law perfectly? Besides the rituals (blood sacrifice), temple and priests being all wrapped up in Christ, what else changed? The Bible is clear you cannot be under the law for the law only condemned Romans 7:9 (KJV) [9] For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died. Romans 3:23 (KJV) [23] For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; The solution is Christ who satisfied the law and brought in the perfect law of libery... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,260 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,988 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2022 3 minutes ago, Charlie744 said: Not following you here... please explain. Thanks. Obviously you haven't read Matthew chapter 25 starting at verse 30, or you would not ask me that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie744 Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 55 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 2,690 Content Per Day: 1.72 Reputation: 862 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/29/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2022 1 minute ago, other one said: Oh my, Jesus just confessed he is working on the Sabbath. So because Jesus knew the true meaning of the Law as opposed to the incorrect understanding and application of the law, their condemnation is relevant or represents a true judgement against Christ? Essentially, you are saying that Jesus was guilty of a law that He Himself understood better than any man possibly could BASED ON THE ERRANT understanding and application of the law by the Pharisees? Jesus NEVER sinned against God or His 10 commandments!!!!!! The Pharisees claimed He did... Are you then saying they (Pharisees) were right in their understanding and application of the law and Jesus was just breaking the law? I hope not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie744 Posted July 16, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 55 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 2,690 Content Per Day: 1.72 Reputation: 862 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/29/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted July 16, 2022 6 minutes ago, other one said: Oh my, Jesus just confessed he is working on the Sabbath. What do you think this phrase is speaking about? You might want to consider what He meant by this - I believe Jesus answered this in John 5:7-21. Jesus did not WORK on the Sabbath as the Pharisees had incorrectly interpreted how to keep His commandments - Jesus understood the essence of the Law and both the physical and spiritual keeping of the law - HE WAS DOING HIS FATHER'S WORK NOT WORK AS MAN WOULD DEFINE IT. 7The sick man answered Him, “Sir, I have no man to put me into the pool when the water is stirred up; but while I am coming, another steps down before me.” 8Jesus said to him, “Rise, take up your bed and walk.” 9And immediately the man was made well, took up his bed, and walked. And that day was the Sabbath. 10The Jews therefore said to him who was cured, “It is the Sabbath; it is not lawful for you to carry your bed.” 11He answered them, “He who made me well said to me, ‘Take up your bed and walk.’ ” 12Then they asked him, “Who is the Man who said to you, ‘Take up your bed and walk’?” 13But the one who was healed did not know who it was, for Jesus had withdrawn, a multitude being in that place. 14Afterward Jesus found him in the temple, and said to him, “See, you have been made well. Sin no more, lest a worse thing come upon you.” 15The man departed and told the Jews that it was Jesus who had made him well. 16For this reason the Jews persecuted Jesus, [d]and sought to kill Him, because He had done these things on the Sabbath. 17But Jesus answered them, “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” 18Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God. 19Then Jesus answered and said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, but what He sees the Father do; for whatever He does, the Son also does in like manner. 20For the Father loves the Son, and shows Him all things that He Himself does; and He will show Him greater works than these, that you may marvel. 21For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will. 22For the Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, 23that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him. When we obey God's commandments in both the physical and spiritual way we are doing the WORK OF THE FATHER - not the secular definition of work. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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