Your closest friendnt Posted August 30, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,876 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,769 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted August 30, 2022 10 minutes ago, JimmyB said: Said to whom? It was said to the Jews, not to any Christian. This so truth, he also told them that no one has seen or spoke or has heard the voice of the Heavenly Father... Jesus never called upon the Lord God Almighty, the God of Abraham because he was the Lord God Almighty who was before Abraham in his former state of being, before he enter our world borned after the nine months incubation period in the womb of Mary. The seed of a woman, a man is born without a human Father, without the seed of a man. The word became flesh...the Creator of everything and man, the Lord God Almighty, the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob...the God of Israel, the Lord God of the Sinai Covenant, the God of Abraham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayin jade Posted August 30, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 44 Topic Count: 6,178 Topics Per Day: 0.87 Content Count: 43,798 Content Per Day: 6.20 Reputation: 11,244 Days Won: 58 Joined: 01/03/2005 Status: Online Share Posted August 30, 2022 33 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said: Are you posting this for me, have read anything to my postings that I ever said anything contrary to that. Please if you did bring it to my attention because you are very highly rated, in my respect, and you will never guess why... Now this is the question at hand so I can make it clear. Does the scriptures support anywhere whether expressly or by an illustration that someone can be lost if he has not recorded the denial of believing in Jesus Christ, or better if he dies without the denial recorded in his heart that Jesus Christ has died for the forgiveness of his sins? The registered denial in the heart of a person is what will condemn him... Yes I did post it in response to your post, because you wrote .... Even our children who are born unto Jesus, even for then the time will come that they have to decide whether or not they want to continue with Jesus Christ or no And that sounded like anyone born is a child of God until they decide to reject. Whereas scripture states that no one is without sin, and they are lost until they believe and then they become children of God. But it is possible I misinterpreted your post. I did not sleep well last night (pain) and am pretty exhausted today. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted August 31, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,876 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,769 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted August 31, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, ayin jade said: Yes I did post it in response to your post, because you wrote .... Even our children who are born unto Jesus, even for then the time will come that they have to decide whether or not they want to continue with Jesus Christ or no And that sounded like anyone born is a child of God until they decide to reject. Whereas scripture states that no one is without sin, and they are lost until they believe and then they become children of God. But it is possible I misinterpreted your post. I did not sleep well last night (pain) and am pretty exhausted today. Dear sister, thank you for responding even though you are not feeling so good, Paul who was a Pharisee and he knew from his Jewish background that the chosen children of Abraham were born to the Lord...while in the womb belong to the Lord, before they were born...that's why Paul said that even if one of the parents, whether it is the man or the woman, their children are sanctified and born unto Jesus Christ, they are his children, is it not that we pray for them even before they are born and say one more for Jesus and never anything else to the contrary...it follows that when they grow up are free to make their decision, and no one can refuse them and forbid them to stay in the faith of Jesus Christ or to to follow a different religion, like Buddhism... It is impossible that Paul said that for the reason you brought up. Paul was preaching the Gospel to the first generation of people after the Cross, most all of them were either born in Judaism or in a pagan family...so Paul did have to say to the Jews who were under the Atonement of the Law that they are in their sins, because that was the truth, that's why on the day of Penticost all those people who believe they show them selves in their sins even thought they were upright to the Law, obedient to the Law, inspite of that, but not every Jew was ready to allowed one self to see that and leave Abraham and the Law and cling unto Jesus, no one was ready to face the chastisement from their family and their community. Some also were upright in their way like Nathaniel who was commented by Jesus... But it is about having our Sins forgiven by the blood of Jesus because in him we have continuously forgiven of sins...even if we sin our sins are not counted against us... And we can be in the presence of God and live in the presence of God because we are the children of Jesus Christ who is the Son of God...in other words we are the children of God because of Jesus Christ... Edited August 31, 2022 by Your closest friendnt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sower Posted August 31, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 14 Topic Count: 32 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 5,267 Content Per Day: 0.97 Reputation: 5,886 Days Won: 1 Joined: 07/09/2009 Status: Offline Share Posted August 31, 2022 2 hours ago, JimmyB said: Said to whom? It was said to the Jews, not to any Christian. That is correct.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueFollowerOfChrist Posted August 31, 2022 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 9 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,049 Content Per Day: 1.60 Reputation: 597 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/26/2022 Status: Offline Share Posted August 31, 2022 Salvation is an instant blink of an eye doing of God. We become Holy and saints at the moment of salvation. However the process of living a holy life will not be complete until death. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted August 31, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,250 Content Per Day: 3.32 Reputation: 16,662 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted August 31, 2022 7 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said: Back to the earlier issue at hand, the Devil never bought the human race as it is claimed in the post, it held it captive....That's why it was announced in the prophets when the Messiah the Christ of God will come will set the CAPTIVES FREE... Blessings dear friendnt. I fear you have misunderstood. I believe we are saying the same thing. I didn't ever say that the devil bought the human race. Due to the sin of Adam all mankind inherited his sin nature. Rom 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—Rom 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man's obedience many will be made righteous. Col 1:12 giving thanks to the Father who has qualified us to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in the light.Col 1:13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, Col 1:14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. Col 1:13 AMP, ALT3 [The Father] has delivered and drawn us to Himself out of the control and the dominion of darkness and has transferred us into the kingdom of the Son of His love. The redeemer has always been the person who could buy us back from slavery. People sold themselves into slavery to work off a debt. The near relative who could pay off the debt could redeem them and buy them out of slavery. When Adam sinned all mankind became slaves to sin. By default that meant we were under the or dominion of darkness. Jesus our Redeemer paid our sin debt with His own blood. We only need to accept that and receive Christ as our Redeemer/Savior. Satan did not buy us. Adam placed himself and his descendants into the devil's kingdom when he chose to obey satan instead of God. God kicked mankind out of the garden. Christ redeemed us (bought our freedom) out of slavery to sin. re·deem| rəˈdēm | verb [with object]• • archaic buy the freedom of. To gain or regain possession of something in exchange for payment. To Pay the necessary money to clear a debt. Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin. Rom 6:16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one's slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness? Rom 6:18 And having been set free from sin, you became slaves of righteousness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnR7 Posted August 31, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 49 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,907 Content Per Day: 1.29 Reputation: 614 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/03/2018 Status: Offline Birthday: 03/06/1952 Share Posted August 31, 2022 On 8/28/2022 at 2:24 AM, R. Hartono said: God is not a laundry service that clean your sins with the blood of the Lamb. Revelation 7:14 They washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. It looks like we are the ones that need to wash our robe. If we want to attend the marriage supper of Lamb. Luke 14 11But when the king came in to see the guests, he spotted a man who was not dressed in wedding clothes. 12‘Friend,’ he asked, ‘how did you get in here without wedding clothes?’ But the man was speechless. 13Then the king told the servants, ‘Tie him hand and foot, and throw him into the outer darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’ 14For many are called, but few are chosen.” 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted August 31, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,250 Content Per Day: 3.32 Reputation: 16,662 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted August 31, 2022 7 hours ago, Your closest friendnt said: To say if you do not have Jesus Christ then you belong to the Devil, this is one of the erroneous beliefs common to christianity I understand what you are saying about satan losing his power because of Jesus' death and resurrection. Jesus bruised his head. A concussion. His power over us due to fear of death was destroyed by His resurrection. Heb. 2: that through death He might destroy him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, Heb 2:15 and release those who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage. Satan no long holds the power of death. Christians are set free from bondage to fear of death. However, those who don't trust in Christ are still in bondage to that fear. Only those who have been presented the Gospel and are being drawn by the Holy Spirit can be in the valley of decision. The Bible doesn't support your theory that all unsaved humanity is now in the valley of decision. I do believe that those who have rejected Christ God will continue to call especially if we are praying for them that God soften their hearts. Rom 8:9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. Rom 8:10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you. To me this clearly says that only those who are born again of the Holy Spirit will be resurrected to everlasting life. To have the Holy Spirit dwelling in us is to have Christ. If we have Christ, we have life. Those who don't have Christ, don't have life everlasting. 1Jo 5:12. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. Jhn 3:36 “He who believes in (trust in, relies upon) the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.” So if anyone doesn't belong to God, by default they are in the kingdom of darkness and definitely not a part of God's kingdom of light. I don't find any mention in the Bible of a mid ground for anyone after the resurrection. Satan is still the accuser and deceiver of the brethren, let alone of unbelievers who have fallen for his lies hook line and sinker. We are told in the Revelation that he will be overcome by the blood of Christ and the word of our testimony, and those who loved not their lives even till death. We do need to be actively testifying of the goodness of God in our lives and of those we know. We can especially testify about how God has removed fear by revealing His love to us, how we don't fear death, and how He has filled our lives with His joy and peace. We can be actively praising and worshipping God for Who He is. We can also demonstrate His love for each other. Jhn 13:35. “By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted August 31, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,876 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,769 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted August 31, 2022 2 hours ago, Willa said: Blessings dear friendnt. I fear you have misunderstood. I believe we are saying the same thing. I didn't ever say that the devil bought the human race. Due to the sin of Adam all mankind inherited his sin nature. Rom 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—Rom 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man's obedience many will be made righteous. Col 1:12 giving thanks to the Father who has qualified us to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in the light.Col 1:13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, Col 1:14 in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins. Col 1:13 AMP, ALT3 [The Father] has delivered and drawn us to Himself out of the control and the dominion of darkness and has transferred us into the kingdom of the Son of His love. The redeemer has always been the person who could buy us back from slavery. People sold themselves into slavery to work off a debt. The near relative who could pay off the debt could redeem them and buy them out of slavery. When Adam sinned all mankind became slaves to sin. By default that meant we were under the or dominion of darkness. Jesus our Redeemer paid our sin debt with His own blood. We only need to accept that and receive Christ as our Redeemer/Savior. Satan did not buy us. Adam placed himself and his descendants into the devil's kingdom when he chose to obey satan instead of God. God kicked mankind out of the garden. Christ redeemed us (bought our freedom) out of slavery to sin. re·deem| rəˈdēm | verb [with object]• • archaic buy the freedom of. To gain or regain possession of something in exchange for payment. To Pay the necessary money to clear a debt. Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin. Rom 6:16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one's slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness? Rom 6:18 And having been set free from sin, you became slaves of righteousness. Hi sister Willa, thank you for the scriptures, it's good to read them again and refresh our memory. Jesus defeated the Devil with his obedience to the Heavenly Father all the way to the Cross... At some time before the last Supper Jesus told to Peter that the Devil is coming and he has nothing in him... That time we can say that Jesus was in full obedience to the Father. From that even till the even of Jesus praying in the Garden with his disciples quite some time had passed, and how we would know if Jesus was still in full obedience to the Father and as Jesus had said earlier that he is clean, that the Devil had nothing in him... I am doing something and that is that we do not need to have always scripture to expressly say that, like Jesus repeating that the Devil has nothing in him....at that time in the Garden...but we can infer from what Jesus said that at that time he was still clean ..and we can do that from what Jesus said that the Father is telling that the moment has has come is to surrender himself and go all the way to the Cross... If Jesus was not clean at that time the Father will not tell Jesus that the time, the final face of his mission has come and he needed to surrender himself and then die on the Cross.. From those statement that the Father gave his witness that Jesus was clean, that the Devil has nothing in him... Even when Jesus said: this is the blood of the New Covenant that will be said first the forgiveness of the sins of many people... Jesus knew that he will die for the forgiveness of the sins for every one who believes in him including the Gentiles we can understand this our selves, but his disciples were not in the position at that time to understand what he was saying, and Jesus also imply that no everyone will believe in him and have the forgiveness in him... They were before the fact of the Cross, and with the erroneous belief that Jesus will not and if he is the Messiah, he has to live forever... On the Cross he said to his mother "mother here is your Son, pointing to John...and John hear is your mother. His mother and the other women and his disciples at that time had a very strong hope and belief that a miracle will happen and Jesus will come down from the Cross, because the Messiah was not supposed to die...that implies that to them if Jesus dies then he was not the Messiah... And they believed that this was the moment for Jesus to revealed himself to Israel that he is the Christ when he will come down from the Cross... But Jesus really puzzled them, when he said at that one of the most sensitive moments to his mother "mother here is your Son, and John here is your mother, implying that he will not come down from the Cross as they hoped for but that he will died...So this kind of communicating a message without saying the precise words was common at that time, and it is a beautiful way to say something without saying the specific words... So looking for scripture that has the specific words to support an argument as the argument I have put forwards is not the only way, and we cannot demand the production of scripture that has those specific words to show proof...because Jesus Christ pointed to the two disciples that a lot of things were about him, pointing to them to hidden messages given in this form of communication and in messages given by illustrations of the events that took place in the old Testament... Like after the disobedience of Adam the Lord said to him that from dust you came and to dust you will return, and not before his disobedience... The message was that Adam will die physically...and that could not happen if he did not disobeyed God.. And also they will not mature even biologically or be in a very slow rate of biologically maturing as to have children...because if that could happen, there would be a big problem...if not them, but if one of their children eat from the tree ,some will be expelled from the Garden and some will remain there... Because Adam was created in the Garden and he did not have a Heavenly Inheritance...neither he had an Inheritance in the heart of the earth as in Hades, or Sheol, as he was in the earthly body definitely he could not go down to Sheol he would have to die first... The same thing, as he was in the earthly body with the earthly needs he could not go and live in Heaven, definitely no... After the fall, Adam and his children had the fellowship with God and he accepted their worship... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted August 31, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,876 Content Per Day: 2.41 Reputation: 2,769 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted August 31, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Willa said: I understand what you are saying about satan losing his power because of Jesus' death and resurrection. Jesus bruised his head. A concussion. His power over us due to fear of death was destroyed by His resurrection. Heb. 2: that through death He might destroy him who had the power of death, that is, the devil, Heb 2:15 and release those who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage. Satan no long holds the power of death. Christians are set free from bondage to fear of death. However, those who don't trust in Christ are still in bondage to that fear. Only those who have been presented the Gospel and are being drawn by the Holy Spirit can be in the valley of decision. The Bible doesn't support your theory that all unsaved humanity is now in the valley of decision. I do believe that those who have rejected Christ God will continue to call especially if we are praying for them that God soften their hearts. Rom 8:9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His. Rom 8:10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you. To me this clearly says that only those who are born again of the Holy Spirit will be resurrected to everlasting life. To have the Holy Spirit dwelling in us is to have Christ. If we have Christ, we have life. Those who don't have Christ, don't have life everlasting. 1Jo 5:12. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. Jhn 3:36 “He who believes in (trust in, relies upon) the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.” So if anyone doesn't belong to God, by default they are in the kingdom of darkness and definitely not a part of God's kingdom of light. I don't find any mention in the Bible of a mid ground for anyone after the resurrection. Satan is still the accuser and deceiver of the brethren, let alone of unbelievers who have fallen for his lies hook line and sinker. We are told in the Revelation that he will be overcome by the blood of Christ and the word of our testimony, and those who loved not their lives even till death. We do need to be actively testifying of the goodness of God in our lives and of those we know. We can especially testify about how God has removed fear by revealing His love to us, how we don't fear death, and how He has filled our lives with His joy and peace. We can be actively praising and worshipping God for Who He is. We can also demonstrate His love for each other. Jhn 13:35. “By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.” There is the need to identify the issues at hand... Like in the passage of scripture in John 3:18 referred to in your quoted post.. Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. ***The message is a two fold message, the first one is that the one who believes in Jesus is not condemned (without adding nothing) and the other is that he who does not believe is condemned already.. This scripture is very unique because it includes what someone has to believe or to deny for to be not condemned and or to be condemned... Or to be Saved in Jesus. Or to be lost, separated from Jesus Christ and God... The one who is not condemned has the faith in his heart that as per the latter part of John 3:18, that he has believe in the name of (Jesus) the only begotten Son of God... And the one who is condemned he has not believe in the name of the only begotten Son of God... The one is found with faith in Jesus in his heart, and the other has registered the denial that Jesus is the Christ of God... ***but please consider that there many people who have died since the Day of Penticost with neither having the faith of Jesus in their hear nor the denial of Jesus in their heart...please consider that... And the question is not only what happens to those people but also why people insist that they Devil will take them, when the devil can have only those who died with the denial in their heart when they did not believe in the name of the only begotten Son of God...which is Jesus for Clarity... They do not have the denial, and they do not have the faith.. Have you never thought about that I am wondering because I have form the opinion that you have been given the power to understand and reason things like that out... In other words you do not need to cut and paste what someone else says. In Other words, there is evidence as I have observed that the power of the Holy Spirit is at work in you, and that you are not ignorance about that, that you are quite conscious about that. If the Devil has to wait for the Judgement of Jesus Christ to take all those who have been found with the denial that Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. How can someone support the idea that those who are not have registered neither the faith nor the denial that Jesus is the Christ are but DEFAULT belong to the Devil without the Judgment of Jesus Christ, without them first appearing before the judgement sit of Jesus Christ, before bowing down to him.. There is now a new question at hand...because everyone one has to be judged according to his faith in the only begotten Son of God...according to John 3:18... Are those people ready to appear as they are before the Judgment sit of Jesus Christ to be judged according to believing or not believing in him... Please give it some careful thought.. God bless Edited August 31, 2022 by Your closest friendnt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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