What Happens If A Believer Is Caught In Sin When Jesus Comes Back?

[Vine Abider]

1 hour ago, other one said:

If you are sinning, are you really saved??

Of course yer saved . . . yer just sinning.

33 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

We are all sinners oo. You and me and everyone. 

1 John 1:8

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Jesus Christ died on the cross for our sins past, present and future. We will not be perfect until we get to heaven.

 

The word does not say we are identified as sinners after we are regenerated, rather we are saints who sometimes sin.

[enoob57]

God has helped us understand this:

Romans 7:20 (KJV)

[20] Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

[21] I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

[22] For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

[23] But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

[24] O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

[25] I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

 

[missmuffet]

1 hour ago, Vine Abider said:

Of course yer saved . . . yer just sinning.

The word does not say we are identified as sinners after we are regenerated, rather we are saints who sometimes sin.

You saw the verse I posted. Yes, we are sinners. 

[Vine Abider]

13 hours ago, missmuffet said:

You saw the verse I posted. Yes, we are sinners. 

Sure I saw it, but saying we are still identified as sinners is contrary to the new covenant.  We still sin of course, but that's not who God created us in Christ - we are a new creation, a brand new man, old things have past away, we are born again, the righteousness of God in Him, glorified, etc. & etc.  There are verses that speak to all those identifying marks as a brand new creation of God, as you are most likely aware.

We get trapped into thinking that just because we may still sin from time to time, that who we are is still just remaining an old sinner person.  Not true - regenerated ones are a brand new creation - according to Him and His apostles.

Edited December 21, 2022 by Vine Abider
For better clarity

[missmuffet]

2 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

Sure I saw it, but saying we are still identified as sinners is contrary to the new covenant.  We still sin of course, but that's not who God created us in Christ - we are a new creation, a brand new man, old things have past away, we are born again, the righteousness of God in Him, glorified, etc. & etc.  There are verses that speak to all those identifying marks as a brand new creation of God, as you are most likely aware.

We get trapped into thinking that just because we may still sin from time to time, that who we are is still just remaining an old sinner person.  Not true - regenerated ones are a brand new creation - according to Him and His apostles.

Are Christians sinners, saints, or both?

https://www.gotquestions.org

ANSWER

Christians are both sinners and saints. All human beings are sinners because we are born in sin. But not all humans are saints. According to the Bible, a saint is not someone who has done wonderful things, nor is it someone who has been deemed a saint by a church or organization. The word translated “saint” in the New Testament, hagios, literally means “sacred, physically pure; morally blameless or religious; ceremonially consecrated; holy.” In the context of New Testament passages, saints are those who belong to the body of Christ, saved by grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8–9). In other words, saint is another word for a Christian, a true believer in the Lord Jesus Christ.
 

 

It is a clear biblical truth that all are born in sin and all have a sin nature. Scripture says that God created humankind originally good and without a sin nature: "Then God said, ‘Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness.’ . . . God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them” (Genesis 1:26–27). However, Genesis 3 records the fall of Adam and Eve, and with that fall sin entered into the two previously sinless creatures. And when they had children, their sin nature was passed along to their offspring. Thus, every human being is a sinner.

 

Saints, on the other hand, are not born saints; they become saints by being reborn. Because we have all “sinned and fallen short of the glory of God” (Romans 3:23), we are all in need of spiritual rebirth, without which we will continue in our sinful state throughout eternity. But God, in His great mercy and grace, has provided the (only) means for turning a sinner into a saint—the Lord Jesus Christ, who came “to give His life as a ransom for many.” When we confess our need for a Savior from sin and accept His sacrifice on the cross on our behalf, we become saints.

 

There is no hierarchy of saints. All who belong to Christ by faith are saints, and none of us are more “saintly” than our Christian brothers and sisters. The apostle Paul, who is no more of a saint than the most obscure Christian, begins his first letter to the Corinthian church by declaring that they were “sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be saints, together with all those who in every place call upon the name of our Lord Jesus Christ” (1 Corinthians 1:2, emphasis added). In this verse, hagios is translated “saints,” “holy,” and “sanctified” in different Bible versions, leading to the unmistakable conclusion that all who have ever called upon Christ for salvation are saints, made holy by the Lord. We are all “fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God” (Ephesians 2:19).

 

We are not saints because we have been declared to be saints by a church, nor can we work our way to sainthood. Once we are saved by faith, however, we are called to certain actions befitting our calling as saints of God. “But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; for it is written: ‘Be holy, because I am holy’” (1 Peter 1:15–16). Saints are not sinless, but the lives of saints do reflect the reality of the presence of Christ in our hearts, in whom we “live and move and have our being” (Acts 17:28).

Edited December 21, 2022 by missmuffet

[Vine Abider]

1 hour ago, missmuffet said:

Are Christians sinners, saints, or both?

https://www.gotquestions.org

ANSWER

Christians are both sinners and saints. All human beings are sinners because we are born in sin. But not all humans are saints. According to the Bible, a saint is not someone who has done wonderful things, nor is it someone who has been deemed a saint by a church or organization. The word translated “saint” in the New Testament, hagios, literally means “sacred, physically pure; morally blameless or religious; ceremonially consecrated; holy.” In the context of New Testament passages, saints are those who belong to the body of Christ, saved by grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8–9). In other words, saint is another word for a Christian, a true believer in the Lord Jesus Christ.
 

 

It is a clear biblical truth that all are born in sin and all have a sin nature. Scripture says that God created humankind originally good and without a sin nature: "Then God said, ‘Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness.’ . . . God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them” (Genesis 1:26–27). However, Genesis 3 records the fall of Adam and Eve, and with that fall sin entered into the two previously sinless creatures. And when they had children, their sin nature was passed along to their offspring. Thus, every human being is a sinner.

 

Saints, on the other hand, are not born saints; they become saints by being reborn. Because we have all “sinned and fallen short of the glory of God” (Romans 3:23), we are all in need of spiritual rebirth, without which we will continue in our sinful state throughout eternity. But God, in His great mercy and grace, has provided the (only) means for turning a sinner into a saint—the Lord Jesus Christ, who came “to give His life as a ransom for many.” When we confess our need for a Savior from sin and accept His sacrifice on the cross on our behalf, we become saints.

 

There is no hierarchy of saints. All who belong to Christ by faith are saints, and none of us are more “saintly” than our Christian brothers and sisters. The apostle Paul, who is no more of a saint than the most obscure Christian, begins his first letter to the Corinthian church by declaring that they were “sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be saints, together with all those who in every place call upon the name of our Lord Jesus Christ” (1 Corinthians 1:2, emphasis added). In this verse, hagios is translated “saints,” “holy,” and “sanctified” in different Bible versions, leading to the unmistakable conclusion that all who have ever called upon Christ for salvation are saints, made holy by the Lord. We are all “fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God” (Ephesians 2:19).

 

We are not saints because we have been declared to be saints by a church, nor can we work our way to sainthood. Once we are saved by faith, however, we are called to certain actions befitting our calling as saints of God. “But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; for it is written: ‘Be holy, because I am holy’” (1 Peter 1:15–16). Saints are not sinless, but the lives of saints do reflect the reality of the presence of Christ in our hearts, in whom we “live and move and have our being” (Acts 17:28).

Good.  However, I don't see anything in that article saying we now identify as sinners, just that once we're reborn we sometimes still sin.   That is except for the first sentence, "Christians are both sinners and saints," which is wrong. 

Our old man was crucified with Christ and now we are glorified as per Romans 8:30, "And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified."

[missmuffet]

35 minutes ago, Vine Abider said:

Good.  However, I don't see anything in that article saying we now identify as sinners, just that once we're reborn we sometimes still sin.   That is except for the first sentence, "Christians are both sinners and saints," which is wrong. 

Our old man was crucified with Christ and now we are glorified as per Romans 8:30, "And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified."

Suit yourself. 

[other one]

1 John 3

3 See how great a love the Father has bestowed upon us, that we should be called children of God; and such we are. For this reason the world does not know us, because it did not know Him. 2 Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we shall be. We know that, when He appears, we shall be like Him, because we shall see Him just as He is. 3 And everyone who has this hope fixed on Him purifies himself, just as He is pure. 4 Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness. 5 And you know that He appeared in order to take away sins; and in Him there is no sin. 6 No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or knows Him. 7 Little children, let no one deceive you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous; 8 the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, that He might destroy the works of the devil. 9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother. 11 For this is the message which you have heard from the beginning, that we should love one another; 12 not as Cain, who was of the evil one, and slew his brother. And for what reason did he slay him? Because his deeds were evil, and his brother's were righteous.

13 Do not marvel, brethren, if the world hates you. 14 We know that we have passed out of death into life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love abides in death. 15 Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer; and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 16 We know love by this, that He laid down His life for us; and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren. 17 But whoever has the world's goods, and beholds his brother in need and closes his heart against him, how does the love of God abide in him? 18 Little children, let us not love with word or with tongue, but in deed and truth. 19 We shall know by this that we are of the truth, and shall assure our heart before Him, 20 in whatever our heart condemns us; for God is greater than our heart, and knows all things. 21 Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence before God; 22 and whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments and do the things that are pleasing in His sight. 23 And this is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. 24 And the one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And we know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
NASB

 

[Vine Abider]

20 hours ago, missmuffet said:

Suit yourself. 

I've had this conversation with many.  Some see their new identity clearly, others don't yet.  For me the Lord shone awesome light on Romans 7:17-18 (see below quote) about ten years ago and made it most clear in an instant.  Then I saw that literally hundreds of new testament verses speak to our new identity as saints and not sinners (which again doesn't mean we don't sin).

Quote

 "But now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin that dwells in me. For I know that good does not dwell in me, that is, in my flesh"

Then these verses in Romans 8:9-11 are very good with pinpointing what the nature of our true identity is  - our regenerated spirit now joined to His indwelling Spirit (see 1 Cor. 6:17).  So the flesh (which is not who we are now) is what produces the sin through us.

Quote

"However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.  If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness."

 

Edited December 22, 2022 by Vine Abider

[com7fy8]

On 12/11/2022 at 12:23 PM, Open7 said:

Hi all, been studying Matthew 24 this last week. In verses 42-51 Jesus talks about how we should be ready for his return and living out his will. But what if in the moment he comes, we are slipping up and currently sinning? 

Why would you keep feeding on that possibility? If we trust Jesus to make sure we are ready for Him . . . why would God fail?

Have you given attention to Hebrews 12:4-14, about how our Father is able to correct us?

Hebrews 12:8 says that every child of God has this correction succeeding in us. Our Father's correction is changing our character so we are and love like Jesus >

"Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness in the say of judgment; because as He is, so are we in this world." (1 John 4:17)

So - - - by the way . . . our assurance of being ready for Jesus and judgment is not only keeping our own selves from sinning when He comes. But our Biblical reason for "boldness in the day of judgment" is "because as He is, so are we in this world."

So > where does our attention need to be,  then? Just controlling ourselves to not sin does not work! We need to seek God for real correction and how our "Father of spirits" is able to succeed > Hebrews 12:9.

So, then, if we are trusting Jesus, why would we be considering any other possibility??