First Resurrection vs 2nd Resurrection - SUPER SIMPLE

[DeighAnn]

First Resurrection

26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in Me shall never die. Believest thou this?

Those who never descend into hell, never die, have come to life, the living 


2nd Resurrection is of the dead
7And when the thousand years are expired.....

12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.  AND IF NOT CAST INTO LOF, 2ND RESURRECTION

15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


If you are JUDGED by your FAITH you are of the FIRST RESURRECTION

If you are JUDGED by your WORKS (too late to come to faith, and having been buried in the grave because you were DEAD before your death)
you are going to have to work for it.


CAN anyone show me where THIS WOULDN'T COVER SOMEONE/EVERYONE under the New Covenant?

Because there have been PAGES AND PAGES AND PAGES of people who TRULY STUDY Gods words and are seeking His Truth, and THEY CAN'T REACH AN AGREEEMENT which if it were possible, WOULD HAVE led us to the conclusion ABOUT THE TIME AND PLACE

SO IT MUST BE OF A KIND.
 

Imagine how far FORWARD and/or BUILT UP if we be if we could resolve these issues THAT KEEP US IN THE SAME PLACE AS THE PAST 2 THOUSAND YEARS.



 

 

Edited January 7, 2023 by DeighAnn

[AdHoc]

3 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

First Resurrection

26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in Me shall never die. Believest thou this?

Those who never descend into hell, never die, have come to life, the living 


2nd Resurrection is of the dead
7And when the thousand years are expired.....

12And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.  AND IF NOT CAST INTO LOF, 2ND RESURRECTION

15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


If you are JUDGED by your FAITH you are of the FIRST RESURRECTION

If you are JUDGED by your WORKS (too late to come to faith, and having been buried in the grave because you were DEAD before your death)
you are going to have to work for it.


CAN anyone show me where THIS WOULDN'T COVER SOMEONE/EVERYONE under the New Covenant?

Because there have been PAGES AND PAGES AND PAGES of people who TRULY STUDY Gods words and are seeking His Truth, and THEY CAN'T REACH AN AGREEEMENT which if it were possible, WOULD HAVE led us to the conclusion ABOUT THE TIME AND PLACE

SO IT MUST BE OF A KIND.
 

Imagine how far FORWARD and/or BUILT UP if we be if we could resolve these issues THAT KEEP US IN THE SAME PLACE AS THE PAST 2 THOUSAND YEARS.



 

 

We've gone back and forth before, but here's a new try.

When God banned Adam from the Tree of Life, He gave the reason. In Genesis 3:22 "... and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:" The word "also" means "in addition to". It implies that Adam had not yet eaten of the Tree of Life. God, in no uncertain terms sealed our deaths. When we see the grief and suffering of loved ones around a grave, we at once think that God might have had a better solution than death. After all, He is the Savior. But in that very title lies the solution. The body corrupted by sin (singular) is called, by Paul, "our VILE body". In Romans 7 Paul calls it the "Body of this death". Unbelievable as it may seem, God did us a wonderful favor in letting us die. To condemn us to an eternity of this body would have been a terrible future.

God could afford to do this as not only is He Creator, but He is the "Life-Giver". By his breath He can animate a creature and He can also impart His divine Life. God, being the ALL-Mighty chose to display His exquisite power by (i) raising dead men to life, (ii) changing it from corruption to incorruption, (iii) forming a new body from the same elements outside of the womb, (iv) doing all this without violating His justice by having a worthy Man pay the price of sin (singular). In so doing He showed an inexplicable LOVE for His creature and a sense of responsibility unparalleled in the history of this universe.

If one reads through 1st Corinthians 15 carefully, the one single factor that stands out above all the rest is that though the body returns to the elements, "IT" is raised again. That is, you will return from the grave with YOUR BODY. In every case recorded in the Bible, especially the PREEMINENT ONE - Jesus, when someone was resurrected, they received their body back. It is the same body but has some CHANGES. 1st Corinthians 15:35 onward explain this. It is like a grain of corn. A gain of corn falls into the ground and breaks open. The form changes somewhat but the intrinsic character is the same. This is assured to us that my God's Law of KINDS in Genesis 1:11-12. A grain of corn can only bring forth corn and not a rose. The resulting ear of corn will have, as its content, a row of identical corn grains.

1st Corinthians Chapter 15 also deals with the order of resurrection. Vere 22 guarantees that Christ's death takes away the "sin" (singular) of the WORLD (Jn.1:29) and gives God the judicial right to raise every man. "Sin" (singular) is used in the Bible to denote (i) a special offense, and (ii) the nature we inherited from Adam (Rom.5:12-17). Since the Bible does not impute guilt to us for Adam's transgression, but we nevertheless suffer its consequences (Rom.6:23), God accepts the all-encompassing sacrifice of His Son Jesus as just compensation and He may, and will, raise every man from the grave. This does not mean that a man will not suffer retribution for TRESPASSES. It means that God may righteously overturn physical death. Even the people who go to the Lake of Fire do so in their living resurrected body (e.g. the Beast and the false Prophet). the order given is (i) Jesus first, then a pause (of about 2,000 years), (ii) the those "who are His at His COMING". The it says that Jesus must reign till God's enemies are subdued. What ever length this reign takes, it ENDS when all men are resurrected for death is the LAST ENEMY.

This is plainly said to be 1,000 years in Revelation 20. Even if the student of scripture ignores the fact that the thousand is mentioned SIX times, and in three of those times the article is implied, some sort of period passes by while the "rest of the dead" languish.

These both were cast ALIVE into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. (Re 19:20)

Now it is time to deal with John 11:26, as the OP is based on that verse. Like most scripture, the meaning is greatly helped by the immediate context. Here it is;

23 Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again. 24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day. 25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: 26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

The events surrounding the resurrection of Lazarus are well known. The Torah teaches that the dead will be resurrected. Martha was schooled in it. In her misery over Lazarus' death, she tells Jesus that "AT the last day" Lazarus will be raised from the dead. Our Lord Jesus the points out that the resurrection of men is not an issue of anything outside of God. Resurrection is an intrinsic quality of Himself - enduring and unending LIFE (Jn.5:26 etc.). Our Lord's next statement is STILL IN THE CONTEXT OF THE LAST DAY. Verse 25 says that even if a man has died, he will be raised. He is talking about then that BELIEVE. Then in verse 26, STILL IN CONTEXT OF THE LAST DAY, those who BELIEVE and are still alive will not die. They are mentioned in 1st Corinthians 15:50-54 and again in 1st Thessalonians 4:13-17. John 11:26 must be taken in context.

The last point that the OP addresses is the meaning of "FIRST" (resurrection). As we explain things we tend to use un-biblical language. This is allowed but it could confuse the issue. Scripture NEVER uses the term "the Second Resurrection"! It is misleading to the uttermost. Why? It is because the term the "FIRST" (resurrection) means THE FIRST IN IMPORTANCE. It can mean "first" in time, but it does not in this case. Why? BECAUSE THE REWARD OF REIGNING WITH JESUS IS ATTACHED TO IT! It is the DIVIDING event that separates diligent Christians and slothful Christians. ALL Christians will be resurrected "WHEN HE COMES" but not all will REIGN!

To summarize;

1. The resurrection is God's solution to a corrupted body. He lets it die and raises it up intrinsically changed.
2. The resurrection is there to give a man HIS body back in pristine condition.
3. The TIMING of the resurrection is Christ first, 2,000 years later the Jew and the Christian, and then 1,000 years later the REST
4. Because Jesus has LIFE intrinsically, He can prevent a man dying. This He has done (Elijah) and will do AT THE LAST DAY
5. Death is not the natural sate. His is grievous to all men. God allows it out of LOVE for His creature. The normal state is a man alive in his body, BUT THE BODY HAVING UNDERGONE A CHANGE to remove the corruption caused by Adam's transgression

[Dennis1209]

Well said @AdHoc

Yes, it was Grace and mercy that Adam & Eve lost immortality. It is unimaginable to live in sin and corruption for eternity, death was a blessing.

We are not told how long they lived in the Garden of Eden. We know how and why they ate from the tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

As we all know, the Lord kicked them out of Eden and blocked them from the Tree of Life. So serious it was that the Lord sent Cherubim with a flaming sword to guard access.

I believe both trees to be literal fruit trees, possibly with symbolic inferences. The question I have pondered is:

·         Why they never ate from the Tree of Life

[DeighAnn]

3 hours ago, AdHoc said:

The body corrupted by sin (singular) is called, by Paul, "our VILE body". In Romans 7 Paul calls it the "Body of this death". Unbelievable as it may seem, God did us a wonderful favor in letting us die. To condemn us to an eternity of this body would have been a terrible future.

Do let's see how this is going to go.  Wow, didn't even get through FIRST paragraph. Anyway, These bodies were awesome, UNTIL
 

5For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
 

Here come more changes to our bodies.  Up until then, NOT KNOWING evil, no one ever sinned or even knew about sin.  Didn't need the 'tree of life' yet and wouldn't have hurt to have eaten from it as they were already immortal. There had been not 'death' sentence yet.... Their lives were not relegated to a day.
But once the first change came about, the 'spiritual change' with the EYES OPENED, the desires of the flesh of the world set in and other changes were made

16Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

We also SEE changes taking place IN THE EARTH, not only have we become cursed, so has the home we live in.

17And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;

18Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;

now we will SWEAT for our food, work for it, the earth will no longer just 'produce' it perfectly

19In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
 

NOW WOULD be the time the TREE OF LIFE became necessary for immortality because THE DAY in which you eat of it has begun

22And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

 

3 hours ago, AdHoc said:

If one reads through 1st Corinthians 15 carefully, the one single factor that stands out above all the rest is that though the body returns to the elements, "IT" is raised again.

How I sure wish you would read it carefully.  IT goes back to dust from whence it came. 
19In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

But don't worry.  We have been given two bodies.  One for this death and one for the next should it come to that.  Or put another way one from this SEEN realm and one for the UNSEEN realm.  Flesh and blood can not inherit...so we know THIS body won't be raised up.  Once it dies, it is done. 
 
 Let's keep track
1. this body goes back to dust
2. we have two bodies
3. flesh and blood can NOT inherit the kingdom of God

Again, I wish you would read it carefully because you would see THAT written also. BUT it's that pre trib theory rearing its ugly head, DEMANDING you go from life in heaven to death in hell to be raised up with the dead so there can be that rapture thing happening. 

But it is written in black and white in a way in which no one can dispute it.  THE QUESTION of what body we are raised in was asked 2000 years ago and here is what Paul said

 

35But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?

36Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

37And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:

38But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.

 

I'll keep track as I think of things and as I put forth Scripture
1. this body goes back to dust
2. we have two bodies
3. flesh and blood can NOT inherit the kingdom of God
4. NOT the body that shall be BUT A SEED, GRAIN
5. born OF SEED uncorruptible when born from above
6. what comes from the corruption of the earth is DOES NOT receive immortality
7. ONLY THE DEAD go into the grave with their body, we follow Him

3 hours ago, AdHoc said:

That is, you will return from the grave with YOUR BODY. In every case recorded in the Bible, especially the PREEMINENT ONE - Jesus, when someone was resurrected, they received their body back. It is the same body but has some CHANGES.

CRAZYNESS.  None of those 'raised' up were raised up OUT FROM THE DEAD.  How do we know?  Because Jesus was THE FIRST begotten out from the dead

So all those 'resurrections' were done to show the POWER of God, but just like LAZARUS the 'one who laid 4 days and SHOULD HAVE stunk'  we are TOLD HE WASNT DEAD.

3Therefore his sisters sent unto him, saying, Lord, behold, he whom thou lovest is sick.

4When Jesus heard that, he said, This sickness is not unto death, but for the glory of God, that the Son of God might be glorified thereby.

So, you are basing your conclusion on faulty evidence and misunderstanding what is CLEARLY WRITTEN.


44It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
 

3 hours ago, AdHoc said:

That is, you will return from the grave with YOUR BODY.

We can't 'return from the grave' as the SAVED are saved FROM DEATH and destruction and so don't go down with the dead body but ASCEND in the spiritual body.  

And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

One went up, the other went down.  NOW EITHER this body 'comes back to life' in the grave so it can feel and talk or THE SPIRITUAL BODY comes to life wherever that 'soul' has gone.  The SAVED know the way and FOLLOW HIM.  The unsaved don't know the way and go to hell 

50Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.


23Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

24For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away:

25But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.

 

42So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

43It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

44It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.


If you give me a few minutes to eat dinner, I will get back to the rest of your response.  That way we wont get confused on where we are.  

 

[R. Hartono]

1 hour ago, Dennis1209 said:

Well said @AdHoc

Yes, it was Grace and mercy that Adam & Eve lost immortality. It is unimaginable to live in sin and corruption for eternity, death was a blessing.

We are not told how long they lived in the Garden of Eden. We know how and why they ate from the tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

As we all know, the Lord kicked them out of Eden and blocked them from the Tree of Life. So serious it was that the Lord sent Cherubim with a flaming sword to guard access.

I believe both trees to be literal fruit trees, possibly with symbolic inferences. The question I have pondered is:

·         Why they never ate from the Tree of Life

Imho The fruit from the tree of life needs to be eaten regularly thats why its found in the new Jerusalem to HEAL nations. 

So its no use for Adam to eat that once.

Edited January 8, 2023 by R. Hartono

[DeighAnn]

3 hours ago, AdHoc said:

It is like a grain of corn. A gain of corn falls into the ground and breaks open. The form changes somewhat but the intrinsic character is the same. This is assured to us that my God's Law of KINDS in Genesis 1:11-12. A grain of corn can only bring forth corn and not a rose. The resulting ear of corn will have, as its content, a row of identical corn grains.

This would be so much easier if PEOPLE would just believe Jesus but since people obviously DONT  we will continue on along this line.

DNA.  just a grain.  Our earthly body will be going back to dust aka DISSOLVED, but that's ok we HAVE 2 BODIES.  

 

We know for that if earthly of us house, the tent, should be destroyed, a building from God we have, a house not made with hands eternal in the heavens

And indeed in this we groan the dwelling of us which from heaven to be clothed with longing

If indeed also having been clothed, not naked we will be found
(God gives a body as HE sees fit some wheat, some other, some naked)

And for being in the tent we groan being burdened because that not we do wish to be unclothed but to be clothed that may be swallowed up the mortal by life. 



As for the last day, MARTHA said that, Not Jesus.  

 

24Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

25Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

26And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?



But so many Christians today DON'T BELIEVE HIM. 



LOOK AT the reply.  Is there ANYONE WHO HAS BEEN SAVED IN THE GRAVE?  AMONGST THE DEAD?  WAITING TO BE RESURRECTED OUT FROM THE DEAD ON A 'LAST DAY'?  

IF SO, then there is a serious lack of belief.   BECAUSE IF HE WAS BELIEVED, PEOPLE WOULD KNOW WE NEVER DIE.  WE LEAVE THIS DEAD FLESH AND ARE RAISED UP LIVING ON OUR LAST DAY, NOT THE LAST DAY OF THIS AGE.  

I THINK I MAY BE YELLING.  I am certainly typing really loud BUT that's ok as I am rebuking because 

I UNDERSTAND WHY JESUS WEPT.  

DYING and going into the grave EVEN THOUGH JESUS CLEARLY TELLS US IF WHILE WE ARE LIVING
AGAIN IF WHILE WE ARE LIVING


LIVING AS IN LIVING RIGHT NOW  RIGHT THIS SECOND

AND WE BELIEVE ON HIM

WILL NEVER DIE



He didn't say we WILL NEVER DIE AFTER DYING AND GOING TO BE WITH THE DEAD IN HELL

BUT NEVER.

NOT NEVER DIE AFTER HAVING BEEN DEAD 2000 YEARS




 

Are we or are we not SAVED FROM DEATH AND DESTRUCTION?   According to EVERYONE who says we DIE and go to hell

WE ARE NOT SAVED FROM DEATH AT ALL.  


 If they did BELIEVE IT, they would SAY WE never DIE AND GO TO HELL.


All who say we go into the ground SAME AS THOSE WHO HAVE NEVER BEEN SAVED AKA THE DEAD TO BE RESURRECTED OUT FROM THE DEAD 

DON'T BELIEVE WE NEVER DIE AT ALL

THEY BELIEVE WE DO DIE.  There is no explanation that changes that.  EITHER we believe we never die or we don't.  Can't believe we never die and then SAY BUT WE DO.  

I NO LONGER WONDER WHY THE CHURCH CAN'T BRING PEOPLE TO FAITH.

I was going to go back and fix this, make it all nice and pretty but instead I am going to leave it as a rebuke of teaching we die 



 

[DeighAnn]

4 hours ago, AdHoc said:

The TIMING of the resurrection is Christ first, 2,000 years later the Jew and the Christian, and then 1,000 years later the REST

For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:

17And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

18Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.

19If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.

20But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

21For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits;

SO STARTING WITH CHRIST WE HAVE THEM THAT SLEPT.  AKA THE GRAVES OPENED AND WHEN HE ASCENDED HE LED THE CAPTIVITY...JUST LIKE HE SAID WHEN READING THE ISAIAH SCROLL IN THE TEMPLE

SINCE THEN EVERY MAN IN HIS OWN ORDER  NOT ALL MEN AT THE SAME TIME



afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.  

THE ONLY ONES WHO ARE HERE ARE THE ALIVE AND REMAINING

UNLESS YOU DON'T THINK GOD ANSWERED HIS PRAY WHEN HE PRAYED WE BE WITH HIM WHERE HE IS.  





 

 

[DeighAnn]

4 hours ago, AdHoc said:

Because Jesus has LIFE intrinsically, He can prevent a man dying. This He has done (Elijah) and will do AT THE LAST DAY

Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.

last thing.  The last day came and went for those who are saved from death.  

Some day it would be SO NICE IF YOU WOULD GIVE SCRIPTURE for what you say because I would sure love to see it. But alas...

[DeighAnn]

2 hours ago, Dennis1209 said:

Why they never ate from the Tree of Life

They weren't dying.  They had no sin.  They were naked and no one cared.  They didn't need to UNTIL they sinned cause SIN is what causes DEATH.  SIN is why we die.  no sin no death.  Don't get me wrong, not saying 'the death of the flesh body' as in ADAM can be avoided, just being bound in hell because of it

BUT apparently Christians to day believe WE CAN BE UNDER THE GRACE OF GOD, receive the gift of salvation, be washed clean by the blood of the Lamb

AND STILL GO TO DEATH JUST LIKE ALL THOSE WHO DIDN'T, BE RAISED UP JUST LIKE ALL THOSE WHO DIDN'T, AND THEN BE JUDGED JUST LIKE ALL THOSE WHO DIDN'T.  I THINK BECAUSE I TRULY DON'T KNOW AS IT IS ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE BIG SECRETS THAT NO ONE HAS SCRIPTURE FOR BUT THEY ALL BELIEVE.  

I guess the WAGES for being saved IS  ALSO DEATH.  I wonder if this post will be found worthy.  



 

[JohnD]

First / second resurrection simply explained.

All raised from the dead prior to the cross of Christ were raised in the same state as they died in.

And they all had to die again (the exceptions to Hebrews 9:27). They died twice, then the judgment.

Messianic Rabbi Larry Feldman calls their raising from the dead a resuscitation from the dead since nothing (other than their having been dead) has changed about them.

Resurrection, according to the Rabbi, is the change described by the Apostle Paul:

• incorruptible  replacing corruption
• eternal life replacing temporal life
• bodily infusion with spirit versus spirit separation from the body

To date, only one true resurrection has taken place (the resurrection of Jesus Christ):

The Firstborn from the dead (Colossians 1:18).

All else who die in Christ are with him in heaven (2 Corinthians 5:8) until the general resurrection of all the dead (Revelation 20:11-15)

The dead in Christ will rise / be reunited with their changed resurrected bodies first (1 Thessalonians 4:13-18)

Then those who are alive will be changed into their eternal state (1 Corinthians 15:51-55).

We are living in the age of the first (one and only) resurrection (that of the Lord Jesus Christ).

Revelation 20:5–6 (KJV)
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Remember! Thousands (chillioi in the Greek) is plural: "...and shall reign with him for thousands of years."

Reminder, NOW are we the sons and daughters of God (1 John 3:2).

NOW are we kings and priests (a kingdom of priests) of God (Revelation 1:6 / Revelation 5:10 / 1 Peter 2:3-9).

The First Resurrection / Age of the Only Resurrection (of Jesus) is another way of saying Church Age / Christian (Messianic) Era which has been in place for nearly 2,000 years now.