Will the Day of the Lord come as a thief, or will there be signs first?

[iamlamad]

Is it possible that the Day of the Lord have signs preceding and still come as a thief? That does not seem possible.

Both Paul and Peter tell us the Day will come as a thief, so with no warning. Yet, Joel tells us the sun will turn dark and the moon into blood before that great and terrible day of the Lord.

This seems to be a contradiction. How do we solve this apparent contradiction?

[Keras]

2 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Is it possible that the Day of the Lord have signs preceding and still come as a thief? That does not seem possible.

Both Paul and Peter tell us the Day will come as a thief, so with no warning. Yet, Joel tells us the sun will turn dark and the moon into blood before that great and terrible day of the Lord.

This seems to be a contradiction. How do we solve this apparent contradiction?

There are Many Days of the Lord, when He took action in the past and yet to come in the future. 

The great and terrible Day of the Lord's vengeance and wrath, the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster; prophesied over 100 times, is the one that will come as a thief; unexpectedly, suddenly and shocking everyone. It will commence all the Prophesied end time events. 

The glorious Day of the Lord's Return will not be unexpected, it will be heralded by God's Trumpet blast and the sun darkened, Matthew 24:29-30, 1 Thess 4:16-17     Also, we are told there will be 1260 days between the day Satan sits in the Temple, to when Jesus Returns. Just count the days, and anyway even thinking Jesus will Return like a thief, is ridiculous!

[Selah7]

We may not know the hour, but we know the season.

1 Thessalonians 1:1
Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the LORD Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the LORD Jesus Christ.

1 Thessalonians 1:2
We give thanks to God always for you all, making mention of you in our prayers;

1 Thessalonians 1:3
Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our LORD Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father;

1 Thessalonians 1:4
Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.
 
So it’s noteworthy that this is written to God's Elect.
 
1 Thessalonians 1:10
And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

1 Thessalonians 5:1
But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
 
God's Elect should know the season when the Lord comes as a thief in the night.
 
1 Thessalonians 5:2
For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

1 Thessalonians 5:3
For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

“Sudden destruction” comes upon “they” and “them,” (those not watching), not on God’s Elect.

1 Thessalonians 5:4
But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

“Ye” are the Elect.

1 Thessalonians 5:5
Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.

Matthew 24:36
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
 
Matthew 24:42
Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

Mark 13:32
But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
 
Mark 13:33
Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.
 
No one knows the instant, but God's Elect know the season.

Daniel 12:9-10
And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

Revelation 3:2
Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: for I have not found thy works perfect before God.

Revelation 3:3
Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

Revelation 16:15
Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

[Vine Abider]

1 hour ago, iamlamad said:

Is it possible that the Day of the Lord have signs preceding and still come as a thief? That does not seem possible.

Both Paul and Peter tell us the Day will come as a thief, so with no warning. Yet, Joel tells us the sun will turn dark and the moon into blood before that great and terrible day of the Lord.

This seems to be a contradiction. How do we solve this apparent contradiction?

"Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him." Matt 24:42-44

"Be careful, or your hearts will be weighed down with carousing, drunkenness and the anxieties of life, and the day will close on you suddenly like a trap.  For it will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth.  Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.” Luke 21:34-36

If we look at these two passages, the main thought is to "be ready."  If we're careful, watch and pray, we may escape.  On the other hand, most of the earth will be surprised.  We are not to be those and are many, many times we are exhorted to "watch and pray."

(and also what @Selah7 said regarding knowing seasons)

Edited January 28, 2023 by Vine Abider

[Marathoner]

41 minutes ago, Vine Abider said:

"Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him." Matt 24:42-44

"Be careful, or your hearts will be weighed down with carousing, drunkenness and the anxieties of life, and the day will close on you suddenly like a trap.  For it will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth.  Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.” Luke 21:34-36

If we look at these two passages, the main thought is to "be ready."  If we're careful, watch and pray, we may escape.  On the other hand, most of the earth will be surprised.  We are not to be those and are many, many times we are exhorted to "watch and pray."

(and also what @Selah7 said regarding knowing seasons)

When we walk in the Spirit, we are always ready. 

I have likened walking in the Spirit to walking in the judgment of the Lord, which is not reserved for the age to come by any means. We walk in His judgment here and now, and by this we understand that we're not judged with the world. The apostle Paul instructed us regarding judgment to examine ourselves so we don't partake of the body and blood of our Lord Jesus in an unworthy manner. 

We wait upon the Lord. By waiting upon the Lord, we won't be shocked nor dismayed by His coming. It's not necessary to know the day nor hour of His return when we walk with Him, and He walks with us. 

Edited January 28, 2023 by Marathoner

[Vine Abider]

2 hours ago, Marathoner said:

When we walk in the Spirit, we are always ready. 

I have likened walking in the Spirit to walking in the judgment of the Lord, which is not reserved for the age to come by any means. We walk in His judgment here and now, and by this we understand that we're not judged with the world. The apostle Paul instructed us regarding judgment to examine ourselves so we don't partake of the body and blood of our Lord Jesus in an unworthy manner. 

We wait upon the Lord. By waiting upon the Lord, we won't be shocked nor dismayed by His coming. It's not necessary to know the day nor hour of His return when we walk with Him, and He walks with us. 

"Judgement begins at the house of God."  1 Peter 4:17  We are blessed to have it now, in the age of grace.

Edited January 29, 2023 by Vine Abider

[iamlamad]

Thanks all, but I did not see a specific answer to Joel 2: the signs in the sun and moon before the Day of the Lord.

I know there are many people who believe that the Rapture and the start of the Day of the Lord are back to back events: one moment it is church age, the next moment the rapture, and the next moment, the Day of the Lord.

[Marilyn C]

9 hours ago, iamlamad said:

Is it possible that the Day of the Lord have signs preceding and still come as a thief? That does not seem possible.

Both Paul and Peter tell us the Day will come as a thief, so with no warning. Yet, Joel tells us the sun will turn dark and the moon into blood before that great and terrible day of the Lord.

This seems to be a contradiction. How do we solve this apparent contradiction?

Hi iamlamad,

The problem lies in that people don`t realise that the word `day` refers to two things depending on the context.

Day - Hebrew. `yowm,` meaning a 24 hour day, and a season or space of time.

         Greek. `hemera,` meaning a 24 hour day, and a period of time.

 

Now God`s word says that the Day of the Lord (time period) will come to those in darkness as a thief but NOT to the believers who will be encouraging each other as they see the day approaching.

`But you, brethren, are not in darkness that this day should overtake you as a thief. ` (1 Thess. 5: 4)

`but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the day approaching.` (Heb. 10: 25)

Then there is the specific day of the Lord when the Lord returns in great power and glory.  with His angelic army. It is then that the sun and moon grow dark and there is a great earthquake. (Joel 3: 10 & 11)

 

 

[Marilyn C]

[Your closest friendnt]

2 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

Hi iamlamad,

The problem lies in that people don`t realise that the word `day` refers to two things depending on the context.

Day - Hebrew. `yowm,` meaning a 24 hour day, and a season or space of time.

         Greek. `hemera,` meaning a 24 hour day, and a period of time.

 

Now God`s word says that the Day of the Lord (time period) will come to those in darkness as a thief but NOT to the believers who will be encouraging each other as they see the day approaching.

`But you, brethren, are not in darkness that this day should overtake you as a thief. ` (1 Thess. 5: 4)

`but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the day approaching.` (Heb. 10: 25)

Then there is the specific day of the Lord when the Lord returns in great power and glory.  with His angelic army. It is then that the sun and moon grow dark and there is a great earthquake. (Joel 3: 10 & 11)

 

Hi Marilyn, 

To my understanding the "days of the Lord" are many..."the day of the Lord" is for something about the Lord...he is doing something or he has done something or he will do something. 

In revelation 3 the day of the Lord had come to Judge the churches...

Jesus had let the churches to the overseers of each church.

And each church had something that Jesus try to bring them to their attention. 

This is the first time that Jesus got involved in the affairs of the churches since his ascension. 

He had left the churches develop on their own...

Jesus was walking amongst their Lampstands, there he was getting ready to Judge them...

This time he used John and he gave them his instructions and his warning through him.

Also he informed them that he is going to do the same thing with the individual believers...

Judgment on the church Leaders and Judgment to the individual believers...and the rewards to those who pay heed to what he asked for them...

Jesus said that Abraham knew his day and he rejoice.

After his ascension we recorded only one time that Jesus came to earth and that for a very specific purpose for Paul on the road to Damascus. Which was like private appearance.

The first appearance of the Lord coming back to earth it was when he came to John in the Island of Patmos. 

This is why the disciples were saying "the spirit asked me to go in the dessert for Philip and for Peter...the Lord had left the Holy Spirit to guide them.

And this is the first time someone and this is John who said to the churches that the Lord appeared to me and asked me to write those letters and sent them to be read to the churches...

Jesus did the warnings through John....in this spectacular way...