Four questions for YECs - (and a little history of creationism vs evolution)

[Sparks]

8 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

I didn't focus on the word "replenish".  I focused on several key words in v.2 that are obviously translated differently in most of the other uses in the OT.  That is key.

Since no one has an "old timey" dictionary, we are stuck with what we have.  And how would one recognize a Hebrew/Greek lexicon as either old-fashioned or modern?

I refer to the KJV, written around 1611.  If you think that Earth existed before Genesis, I think you are looking a little too deeply into something that is not there.

[Sparks]

6 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

I see those 6 24 hr-hour days as a restoration of a wasted planet.  Not original creation.

Why didn't Genesis just say so, openly? 

7 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

So, the description of "the generations" of various people means they themselves wrote their own history?

Yeah.  Along with different writing styles.  Some say 'God.'  Some say the 'Lord God,' and different writing styles.

8 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Why wouldn't Moses be able to do all that under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit?  

I think Moses was an editor, but if everyone wrote a piece about their generation, why would Moses need to write for them?

[Sparks]

7 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Seems to suggest that inspiration by the Holy Spirit ain't enough then.  

God physically wrote Exodus 20 with his own finger, in stone.  Moses tossed those tables into the crowd because while he was away with God, the people had setup their own 'gods.'

9 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

So Moses "edited" what God wrote???

I think tablets were combined to make "Genesis," and Moses might have been the editor.

10 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

That would be only thing directly written by God.  By inspiration, I mean the Holy Spirit so directed the writing that it came out EXACTLY the way God intended.  And without any human error to corrupt any of it.

If you are talking about the NT, it was definitely inspired.  If you are talking about Exodus 20, God wrote the 10 Commandments with his own finger in stone.

[Sparks]

9 minutes ago, FreeGrace said:

Light-years IS a measurement, and of very great distances.  The speed of light IS measurable and given the speed per second, it is very easy to know the distance light travels in a year.  A very great distance indeed.

The methods used to measure great distances (14.6 billion light years) don't work. 

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, Sparks said:

I refer to the KJV, written around 1611.  If you think that Earth existed before Genesis, I think you are looking a little too deeply into something that is not there.

I am convinced by what v.2 really says.  I looked at how several key words in v.2 are translated elsewhere and saw the obvious.

Since you resist the idea of an old earth, are there any doctrines that become compromised by that?  

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, Sparks said:

FreeGrace said: 

I see those 6 24 hr-hour days as a restoration of a wasted planet.  Not original creation.

Why didn't Genesis just say so, openly?

I believe it did.  It's the translators that seem to have had the problem.  Seems they must have figured that since there was no detail given for such a time gap, there must not have been one.  I just don't buy that.

As to "restoration", the NT supports that idea.

Heb 11:3 - By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.

The Greek word "formed" is 'karartizo' and generally translated as restored in several verses.  And as "mended" in the gospels of the disciples and what they did to their nets.  In an ethical use, it is translated as complete.

1 hour ago, Sparks said:

I think Moses was an editor, but if everyone wrote a piece about their generation, why would Moses need to write for them?

I think the central question is why think that Moses was only the "editor"?  That means he would have included his own biases, etc.  Inspiration by the Holy Spirit removes any such idea.  

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, Sparks said:

God physically wrote Exodus 20 with his own finger, in stone.  Moses tossed those tables into the crowd because while he was away with God, the people had setup their own 'gods.'

I think tablets were combined to make "Genesis," and Moses might have been the editor.

What makes you think that?  The tablets were God's direct commands to His people.

1 hour ago, Sparks said:

  FreeGrace said: 

That would be only thing directly written by God.  By inspiration, I mean the Holy Spirit so directed the writing that it came out EXACTLY the way God intended.  And without any human error to corrupt any of it.

If you are talking about the NT, it was definitely inspired.  If you are talking about Exodus 20, God wrote the 10 Commandments with his own finger in stone.

Sounds as if you don't think the OT was "definitely inspired" then?

There should be no argument that the tablets Moses received were written directly by God's finger.  The Bible plainly says so.

As for me, I'm going with the fact that the Holy Spirit inspired ALL the human authors to write exactly what God wanted communicated.

2 Peter 1-

20 Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet’s own interpretation of things. 

21 For prophecy never had its origin in the human will, but prophets, though human, spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

[FreeGrace]

1 hour ago, Sparks said:

FreeGrace said: 

Light-years IS a measurement, and of very great distances.  The speed of light IS measurable and given the speed per second, it is very easy to know the distance light travels in a year.  A very great distance indeed.

The methods used to measure great distances (14.6 billion light years) don't work. 

Math doesn't work??!  Of course it works.

1 minute = 60 seconds

1 hour = 3600 seconds

1 day = 86,400 seconds

1 year - 31,536,000 seconds

Since light travels at 186,000 miles per second, just multiple 31,536,000 by 186,000 and there is the distance light travels in 1 year.

I can't do it on my portable calculator, since there isn't enough room for all the zeros.

So, what am I missing here?  My doctorate isn't in math or the physical sciences, but rather, the physiological sciences.

[FreeGrace]

Sparks,

I just realized I could google a light year.  It is 5.88 trillion miles.  And you were only talking about 14.6 billion light years.  Where is the difficulty?

Maybe the difficulty is simply the vast majority of calculators don't have enough space to record all those digits.

[teddyv]

Just now, FreeGrace said:

Sparks,

I just realized I could google a light year.  It is 5.88 trillion miles.  And you were only talking about 14.6 billion light years.  Where is the difficulty?

Maybe the difficulty is simply the vast majority of calculators don't have enough space to record all those digits.

I think he's talking about distance determination by use of Cepheid variables, red-shift and parallax. The latter is a simple trigonometric calculation, and with the use of the Gaia probe (and some others as well), which extended the baseline, we can measure stars out to about 10,000 light-years.