truth7t7 Posted March 9, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted March 9, 2023 26 minutes ago, kenny2212 said: I believe changing those who turn to God in the MK from mortal to immortal is a light thing to do for God who translated Enoch and Elijah. I don't believe God will tell us everything he's doing or about to do. Deuteronomy 29:29 (NKJV) - The secret things belong to the Lord our God, but those things which are revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may do all the words of this law. Your claim is purely assumption and imagination found no place in scripture 2 Timothy 3:16-17KJV 1 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted March 9, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted March 9, 2023 38 minutes ago, kenny2212 said: I believe changing those who turn to God in the MK from mortal to immortal is a light thing to do for God who translated Enoch and Elijah. I don't believe God will tell us everything he's doing or about to do. Deuteronomy 29:29 (NKJV) - The secret things belong to the Lord our God, but those things which are revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may do all the words of this law. There won't be a Millennial Kingdom on this earth as many claim, Jesus returns in fire and final judgement (The End) 1 Corinthians 3:13KJV 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. Luke 17:29-30KJV 29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. 2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV 7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; Malachi 3:2KJV 2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted March 9, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.22 Reputation: 9,763 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted March 9, 2023 41 minutes ago, FreeGrace said: If that verse is about the NHNE, then obviously I didn't realize that. But then, the bigger question is how are babies going to appear on the NE? Since all believers will be in their immortal glorified bodies, and "like the angels, neither marry or are given in marriage", as Jesus told some very sad U see's. They appear as they were, just with perfect bodies, is what I believe. Babies will still be babies and adults will remain adults. As for being like the angels, I don't have all the answers, but like John said in 1 John 3:2 "Beloved, now we are children of God; and it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. " 41 minutes ago, FreeGrace said: Isa 11 is clearly about the MK. But you have a big problem with Isa 65. It says those who "die at 100 will be considered a youth". So you have dead people on the NE. Please explain. I believe only immortal people will be on the NE. First, I don't have any problem with Isaiah 65, but it appears you do. We are given only glimpses of the future in prophesy. Prophesy is not all inclusive, which is why I always suggest we realize that not all questions can be answered through scripture. What you are asking is not addressed, so all we can do is "guess" at best. The truthful answer will have to wait until you can ask God. Remember, we see through a glass darkly, or in a mirror dimly. (1 Corinthians 13:11-12) With that, what do you think Jesus meant when John wrote about Him saying "Then He who sat on the throne said, “Behold, I make all things new.” And He said to me, “Write, for these words are true and faithful.”" (Revelation 21:5)? If He makes a completely new earth, will this be like the Garden of Eden again where everything was perfect? We are told by John a little further down in verses 24-27 "And the nations of those who are saved shall walk in its light, and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it. Its gates shall not be shut at all by day (there shall be no night there). And they shall bring the glory and the honor of the nations into it. But there shall by no means enter it anything that defiles, or causes an abomination or a lie, but only those who are written in the Lamb’s Book of Life." What does scripture mean that only those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life can enter the New Jerusalem? Will there be others alive whose names are not written in the Lamb's Book of Life? Will there be sin again in the New Earth? If not, then why even mention it? So many questions and not all the answers are available. That is the mystery of prophesy, it's details are lacking and only similarities are given, for the most part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenny2212 Posted March 9, 2023 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 49 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 359 Content Per Day: 0.13 Reputation: 101 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/27/2017 Status: Offline Author Share Posted March 9, 2023 22 minutes ago, truth7t7 said: Your claim is purely assumption and imagination found no place in scripture 2 Timothy 3:16-17KJV 1 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works. No comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted March 9, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,141 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,563 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted March 9, 2023 2 hours ago, FreeGrace said: Is there evidence for your statement? And if your claim is true, why wouldn't believers after the gathering be considered those who belong to Him? Please explain that. I already gave evidence why. As far as believers after the Parousia, either they will have come to faith after "the door was shut" (Mt. 25:10), or simply will have not yet even been born. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted March 9, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted March 9, 2023 1 hour ago, OneLight said: We are given only glimpses of the future in prophesy. Prophesy is not all inclusive, which is why I always suggest we realize that not all questions can be answered through scripture. Your claim is "False" God's words state otherwise 2 Timothy 3:16-17KJV 1 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted March 10, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.22 Reputation: 9,763 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted March 10, 2023 3 hours ago, truth7t7 said: Your claim is "False" God's words state otherwise 2 Timothy 3:16-17KJV 1 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works It is not false. I suggest you take all of scripture into consideration instead of only verses that support your personal theology. 2 Peter 1:19-21 And so we have the prophetic word confirmed, which you do well to heed as a light that shines in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts; knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation, for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. 1 Corinthians 13:12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted March 10, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted March 10, 2023 2 hours ago, OneLight said: It is not false. I suggest you take all of scripture into consideration instead of only verses that support your personal theology. 2 Peter 1:19-21 And so we have the prophetic word confirmed, which you do well to heed as a light that shines in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts; knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation, for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit. 1 Corinthians 13:12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known. I would give you the same suggestion There won't be a Millennial Kingdom on this earth as many claim, Jesus returns in fire and final judgement (The End) 1 Corinthians 3:13KJV 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. Luke 17:29-30KJV 29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. 2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV 7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; Malachi 3:2KJV 2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Light Posted March 10, 2023 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,078 Content Per Day: 1.10 Reputation: 202 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/17/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted March 10, 2023 14 hours ago, FreeGrace said: OK, now please explain each one of these, with Scripture. When did or will Jesus "come back" at these 4 harvests? I've never heard of any of that. I would like to know. The dead in Christ will rise 1st - The barley harvest 1 Thes 4 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: The alive believers will be caught up - The wheat harvest 1 Thes 4 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. The Lord returns for the first fruits of the fall fruit harvest. Revelation 14 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: 3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. 4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. The Lord returns for the fall fruit harvest. Revelation 14 14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. 15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. 16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped. 17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle. 18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe. 19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Light Posted March 10, 2023 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 2,078 Content Per Day: 1.10 Reputation: 202 Days Won: 0 Joined: 03/17/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted March 10, 2023 12 hours ago, FreeGrace said: No, sorry, the ONLY "firstfruits" in 1 Cor 15:23 is Jesus Christ, the FIRST human being to receive a glorified immortal body. What follows is "those who belong to Him", which cannot be anything LESS than all saved people. And all of them will be resurrected "when He comes", which is a reference to the Second Advent. 1 Corinthians 15 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. 1 Corinthians 15 20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. This is what I am talking about when I say read the word EXACTLY and then just use common sense. Christ is the firstfruits of those that slept. Is Jesus the 1st fruits of the fall fruit harvest. No, the 144,000, twelve thousand from each tribe, are the first fruits of the fall fruit harvest. Every man in his order. First fruits and then they that are Christs at His coming. Christ comes for the barley harvest. When Christ comes those that are the dead in Christ will rise and return to heaven. Christ will then come for the alive believers. This is the wheat harvest. Those that are alive when He comes will receive new bodies and meet both Jesus and those that are the dead in Christ that were raised in the barley harvest. Christ will bring them and we will meet them in the clouds. 1 Thes 4 13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. Then we have Christ returning for the 144,000 first fruits. Then the fall fruit harvest occurs. Those that are Christs at His coming will rise to meet Him in the air. This time the dead believers of this harvest and alive believers will be changed together in the twinkling of an eye. 1 Corinthians 15 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. This harvest is the gathering from heaven and earth. Mark 13 27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven. Who is gathered from heaven? Those in the barley harvest, the wheat harvest and the first fruits of the fall fruit harvest. These all return to heaven and are the great multitude that will attend the marriage supper. I know this is alot to take in, but that is what the Word says. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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