Just Coincidences? Or Time to Watch and be Ready?

[Selah7]

5 hours ago, The Light said:

Here is the mention of those flying away that you seem unable to locate.

Psalms 90

10 The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.

Of course, this is not the Church that is being talked about, but you won't understand that either.

22 hours ago, Selah7 said:

No, believers stay put, enduring until the end when their King of kings returns at the 7th trump.    s e l a h

You have absolutely no clue what you are talking about. The Lord is at the door getting ready to come for the His bride and you are totally unaware. It would be wise to get some lamp oil so you can see and will be ready for the soon coming of the Messiah. It is those that watch for Him that He will come for. We are warned over and over to watch and be ready.

@The Light  

In context …

For all our days are passed away in thy wrath: we spend our years as a tale that is told. The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away. Who knoweth the power of thine anger? even according to thy fear, so is thy wrath. So teach us to number our days, that we may apply our hearts unto wisdom.

- Psalm 90:9-12 (KJV)

Psalms 90:10 is not about a rapture. This verse speaks of how short our lives are and how we should devote our time to things that last forever. No mention of a rapture at the end of the world is made here.  Nope, none.

What do Christians do?  We watch for the return of our Savior at the 7th trump, and not before.   s e l a h

[other one]

7 hours ago, The Light said:

Why are the righteous harvested before the unrighteous in Revelation 14? Maybe you are missing something, or actually more than that.

What does that actually more than that mean????     How about we discuss the subject and not each other.

[The Light]

2 hours ago, Selah7 said:

@The Light  

In context …

For all our days are passed away in thy wrath: we spend our years as a tale that is told. The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away. Who knoweth the power of thine anger? even according to thy fear, so is thy wrath. So teach us to number our days, that we may apply our hearts unto wisdom.

- Psalm 90:9-12 (KJV)

Psalms 90:10 is not about a rapture.This verse speaks of how short our lives are and how we should devote our time to things that last forever. No mention of a rapture at the end of the world is made here.  Nope, none.

Psalms 90 is about a rapture. "and we fly away", is talking about a rapture. As I said, it is not the rapture of the Church. The Church is already in heaven before the seals are opened, see Rev 5. 

These verses are talking about the harvest at the 6th seal, which is the harvest at the end of Revelation 14, which is the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24. Jesus sends His angels to gather the elect from heaven and earth BEFORE WRATH. And yet you have the Church going through the wrath of God, when we are not appointed to wrath. 

Also, you were unable to address why the tares are gathered first in the verses you quoted in your previous post. I showed in Rev 14 that it is the righteous that are gathered first at that harvest. Why the difference?

 

2 hours ago, Selah7 said:

What do Christians do?  We watch for the return of our Savior at the 7th trump, and not before.   s e l a h

Why would we watch for Jesus at the 7th trump. That is when Jesus comes to set up His kingdom at the end of wrath.

How is it that you do not understand that Jesus comes for the dead in Christ first. Then Jesus comes for the alive believers, before the seals are opened. Then He comes for the 144,000 first fruits.

Rev 14

And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:

3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

Then Jesus for the harvest of Revelation 14.

Rev 14

14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

And yet you are waiting for Him to come for His Church at the end of wrath?

 

 

[The Light]

3 hours ago, Selah7 said:

@The Light  

In context …

For all our days are passed away in thy wrath: we spend our years as a tale that is told. The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away. Who knoweth the power of thine anger? even according to thy fear, so is thy wrath. So teach us to number our days, that we may apply our hearts unto wisdom.

- Psalm 90:9-12 (KJV)

 

Ok. Let's keep things in context.

Those that see the fig tree begin to put forth leaves will not pass away before ALL THESE THINGS are fulfilled.

Matthew 24

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

You need to read the chapter to see what all these things are.

Now back to Psalm 90. So teach us to number our days, that we may apply our hearts unto wisdom.

The Word is telling you that a generation in strength is 80 years. There is a lot of confusion among many Christians that understand that Jesus died in 30 AD, and after 2 days Jesus comes. That's 2000 years. The confusion is that how can Jesus come after 2000 years if a generation is 80 years. In other word if you add 80 years to 1948, when the fig tree puts forth leaves (Israel born as a nation) you get the year 2028, not 2030. To make this work, they attempt to move the birth of the nation of Israel to 1951 so it fits. But that's not the answer. The answer is Jesus would have to come in 2028 in addition to 2030. We can tell by the Word that the wrath of God is one year, and Jesus comes for a harvest 1 year before wrath and Jesus returns at the 7th trumpet after wrath.

Now about the days being cut off.............

Matthew 24

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Psalm 90

for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.

Except those days be shortened no flesh would be saved. That is not saying that if the days weren't shortened all mankind would be killed, it is saying that if the days were not shortened, NO ALIVE BELIEVERS WOULD BE CAUGHT UP, as all would be dead.

These verses are talking to the Jews and has nothing to do with the Church. The Church is already in heaven before these events happen. That's the context.

But these are just coincidences.................

Edited April 2, 2023 by The Light

[Selah7]

1 hour ago, The Light said:

Psalms 90 is about a rapture. "and we fly away", is talking about a rapture. As I said, it is not the rapture of the Church. The Church is already in heaven before the seals are opened, see Rev 5. 

These verses are talking about the harvest at the 6th seal, which is the harvest at the end of Revelation 14, which is the coming of Jesus in Matthew 24. Jesus sends His angels to gather the elect from heaven and earth BEFORE WRATH. And yet you have the Church going through the wrath of God, when we are not appointed to wrath. 

Also, you were unable to address why the tares are gathered first in the verses you quoted in your previous post. I showed in Rev 14 that it is the righteous that are gathered first at that harvest. Why the difference?

 

Why would we watch for Jesus at the 7th trump. That is when Jesus comes to set up His kingdom at the end of wrath.

How is it that you do not understand that Jesus comes for the dead in Christ first. Then Jesus comes for the alive believers, before the seals are opened. Then He comes for the 144,000 first fruits.

Rev 14

And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:

3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

Then Jesus for the harvest of Revelation 14.

Rev 14

14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

And yet you are waiting for Him to come for His Church at the end of wrath?

 

 

We disagree with each other; let’s leave it at that.

[Selah7]

41 minutes ago, The Light said:

Ok. Let's keep things in context.

Those that see the fig tree begin to put forth leaves will not pass away before ALL THESE THINGS are fulfilled.

Matthew 24

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

You need to read the chapter to see what all these things are.

Now back to Psalm 90. So teach us to number our days, that we may apply our hearts unto wisdom.

The Word is telling you that a generation in strength is 80 years. There is a lot of confusion among many Christians that understand that Jesus died in 30 AD, and after 2 days Jesus comes. That's 2000 years. The confusion is that how can Jesus come after 2000 years if a generation is 80 years. In other word if you add 80 years to 1948, when the fig tree puts forth leaves (Israel born as a nation) you get the year 2028, not 2030. To make this work, they attempt to move the birth of the nation of Israel to 1951 so it fits. But that's not the answer. The answer is Jesus would have to come in 2028 in addition to 2030. We can tell by the Word that the wrath of God is one year, and Jesus comes for a harvest 1 year before wrath and Jesus returns at the 7th trumpet after wrath.

Now about the days being cut off.............

Matthew 24

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Psalm 90

for it is soon cut off, and we fly away.

Except those days be shortened no flesh would be saved. That is not saying that if the days weren't shortened all mankind would be killed, it is saying that if the days were not shortened, NO ALIVE BELIEVERS WOULD BE CAUGHT UP, as all would be dead.

These verses are talking to the Jews and has nothing to do with the Church. The Church is already in heaven before these events happen. That's the context.

But these are just coincidences.................

We disagree.  No need to continue.

[The_Patriot21]

A day as a thousand years... probably the most misinterpreted verse in the Bible....the gap theorists use it to try and squeeze millions of years into the Bible, and end times theorists use it to attempt to predict Christs return.

Gap theories are of course, way off. The end time theorists are probably a little bit closer, as Peter is indeed talking about end times, however they stop reading there and ignore where it says Jesus will come as a thief in the night (verse 10). 

Peter is talking about how God is outside of time, how we can't expect Him to work on our time table, in a way we can understand. It wasn't a literal 6000 years. Not to say Jesus won't return this year, it could be tomorrow. It could be 100 years from now. We should be ready no matter what, which is the point of the passage.

As a side note, seeing a lot of reports on this thread. Please remember to debate the topic, not the person. Respond with grace, be slow to anger. If you have to talk down to someone to prove your point, perhaps re evaluate your beliefs on that point.

[other one]

2 hours ago, The Light said:

Will you still be sleeping through the coming earthquakes?

I usually do.  Will you still be requiring everyone to agree with you?

[ChristB4us]

On 3/26/2023 at 8:48 AM, Selah7 said:

Here it is, clearly foretold . . .

Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

- 2 Thessalonians 2:1-4 (KJV)

s e l a h

Could Paul be warning of 2 events where one is the pre great tribulation rapture event by which the falling away from the faith will proceed that coming of the Bridegroom for that abiding bride of Christ to receive to the Marriage Supper held in Heaven and then that revelation of that son perdition midway through the great tribulation which is to proceed His coming as the King of kings at the end of the great tribulation?

Paul spoke of the iniquity that will cause that falling away from the faith in that latter days as happening already in his days; with an interjection of the event at the end of the great tribulation in verse 8 before expounding on that iniquity in his day as happening in droves in the latter days before He appears as the Bridegroom.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Paul goes on to expose that lie by citing the tradition taught of us by reminding believers when they had received the sanctification of the Spirit & the belief of the truth at the calling of the gospel thus signifying that there is no other time that a saved believer will be receiving the Holy Spirit "again" for He will never leave us.

2 Thessalonians 2: 13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: 14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Compare this with Pauls' warning below that deviates from the traditions taught of us.

2 Corinthians 11:1 Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me. 2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. 3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

Paul goes on to talk about those saved believers that fell away from the faith in how they are still saved but missed out on the rapture event in how they are still brothers for us to not treat them as the enemy, but admonish them as brothers by withdrawing from them.

2 Thessalonians 3:1Finally, brethren, pray for us, that the word of the Lord may have free course, and be glorified, even as it is with you: 2 And that we may be delivered from unreasonable and wicked men: for all men have not faith. 3 But the Lord is faithful, who shall stablish you, and keep you from evil. 4 And we have confidence in the Lord touching you, that ye both do and will do the things which we command you. 5 And the Lord direct your hearts into the love of God, and into the patient waiting for Christ. 6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us. 7 For yourselves know how ye ought to follow us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you;.....

14 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed. 15 Yet count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother.

Of course some will say that those that fell away were never saved because they were damned as mentioned in 2 Thessalonians 2:12 but yet Paul says this above.  The only way the truth can align is to know that those saints and former believers that get left behind will be damned as vessels unto dishonor in His House for being found in iniquity, but thus still in His House. 

2 Timothy 2:11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: 12 If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: 13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. 21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

That is why the rapture event is when God will judge His House first. 

1 Peter 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

Once that door to the Marriage Supper in Heaven is shut, they can never be partakers of the firstfruits of the resurrection for why there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, thus damned forever as vessels unto dishonor in His House but they are still in His House to be resurrected after the great tribulation.

So what a believer builds on that foundation will be judged.

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Note physical death in verses 16-17 and yet the spirit is saved in verse 15 becase in spite of this prophesied falling away from the faith, He will lose none of all the Father has given Him.

John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

But which last day shall it be; as firstfruits of the resurrection or after the great tribulation?  This explains the prodigal son in that he spent his first inheritance for wild living and can never get it back, but he is still son.  Yet we should run that race by faith in Jesus Christ to help us lay aside every weight & sin daily to be ready.

Hebrews 12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, 2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

2 Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

Anyway, there is indication that Paul is writing about two events from your reference as aligned with other scriptures because obviously Jesus will not come as King of kings right away when the son of perdition reveals himself in that Holy of Holies but at the end of the great tribulation and so the Bridegroom will be coming to judge His House when that falling away from the faith occurs in droves in the latter days which after the rapture event is when the great tribulation comes.

That is why Jesus had the apostle John warned the 7 churches to be ready or else be cast into the bed of the coming great tribulation which is the direct warning below.

Revelation 2:18 And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write; These things saith the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire, and his feet are like fine brass; 19 I know thy works, and charity, and service, and faith, and thy patience, and thy works; and the last to be more than the first. 20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. 21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works. 24 But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden.

Since Asbury Revival and more like it is happening all across America and mayhap the world, is why I expect the Bridegroom will be coming soon to judge His House.

Best way to avoid the iniquity is to keep your eyes on the Son in worship. prayer, and fellowship in coming to God the Father because the indwelling Holy Spirit would always keep your focus on the Bridegroom but the spirits of the antichrist whereas antichrist means "instead of Christ" would mislead believers to keep their focus on what they say is the "Holy Spirit" when actually it is the spirits of the antichrist and their visitations in receiving them with signs & lying wonders.

John 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: 23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

John 10:1Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.... 7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me

Luke 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. 25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are: 26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets. 27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity. 28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God. 30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.

May God cause the increase.

[The Light]

Coincidence #4

The prophecy of Ezekiel Chapter 4

Ezekiel 4
1 Thou also, son of man, take thee a tile, and lay it before thee, and pourtray upon it the city, even Jerusalem:

2 And lay siege against it, and build a fort against it, and cast a mount against it; set the camp also against it, and set battering rams against it round about.

3 Moreover take thou unto thee an iron pan, and set it for a wall of iron between thee and the city: and set thy face against it, and it shall be besieged, and thou shalt lay siege against it. This shall be a sign to the house of Israel.

4 Lie thou also upon thy left side, and lay the iniquity of the house of Israel upon it: according to the number of the days that thou shalt lie upon it thou shalt bear their iniquity.

5 For I have laid upon thee the years of their iniquity, according to the number of the days, three hundred and ninety days: so shalt thou bear the iniquity of the house of Israel.

In approximately 701 BCE, Sennacherib, king of Assyria, attacked the fortified cities of Judah, laying siege on Jerusalem

It was determined in the prophecy of Ezekiel that the house of Israel would be under iniquity for 390 years.

But then we have this verse from Leviticus:

Leviticus 26
18 And if ye will not yet for all this hearken unto me, then I will punish you seven times more for your sins.

7 x 390 = 2730 years.

701 BC + 2730 years = 2030 AD

We get the exact same year 2030? Just another coincidence..................

Edited April 3, 2023 by The Light