What Do People See That Causes Them To Wonder?

[Shilohsfoal]

20 minutes ago, warrior12 said:

So, tell me, if the life of God entered them, to whom do they belong.  And where did they go. You may not choose to call them Christians, but surely they are the Lord CHOSEN servants. 

Brother, get serious or you need to study scripture for yourself. 

The adverb figuratively describes something symbolic, not actual.

 

 

Revelation 11

 

New International Version

 

 

 

¹¹ But after the three and a half days the breath^[b] of life from God entered them, and they stood on their feet, and terror struck those who saw them.  Then they heard a loud voice from heaven saying to them, “Come up here.” And they went up to heaven in a cloud, while their enemies looked on.

 

Scripture says "their Lord" was crucified.

They belong to "their Lord"and they will have to answer to "thier Lord".

 

They ascend up into the sky in a cloud before the last Trump sounds meaning they have not become immortal which is not a good thing for them.

I pay closer attention to scripture than most people think.

 

So why do you believe they are removed from Christs kingdom before it becomes his?

Are not the weeds gathered and removed first?

 

Edited June 12, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[warrior12]

51 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

 

Scripture says "their Lord" was crucified.

They belong to "their Lord"and they will have to answer to "thier Lord".

 

They ascend up into the sky in a cloud before the last Trump sounds meaning they have not become immortal which is not a good thing for them.

I pay closer attention to scripture than most people think.

 

So why do you believe they are removed from Christs kingdom before it becomes his?

Are not the weeds gathered and removed first?

 

Search the net for some bible commentaries and see what the commentators say about what you have concerns about and get back here with your findings, cause you want to make a statement but you are shy of doing so. 

[DeighAnn]

On 4/19/2023 at 1:52 PM, Last Daze said:

*  The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction. And those who live on the earth, whose names have not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was, and is not, and will come.   Rev 17:8-9

first CLUE:

WHOSE NAMES HAVE NOT BEEN WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE

second CLUE:

2296. thaumazó ►
Strong's Concordance
thaumazó: to marvel, wonder
Original Word: θαυμάζω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: thaumazó
Phonetic Spelling: (thou-mad'-zo)
Definition: to marvel, wonder
Usage: (a) intrans: I wonder, marvel, (b) trans: I wonder at, admire.
HELPS Word-studies
2296 thaumázō (from 2295 /thaúma, "a wonder, marvel") – properly, wonder at, be amazed (marvel), i.e. astonished out of one's senses; awestruck, "wondering very greatly" (Souter); to cause "wonder; . . . to regard with amazement, and with a suggestion of beginning to speculate on the matter" (WS, 225).


What do people of the world KNOW about the TRIB of Satan/the deception coming upon the world? 

The lying signs and wonders they are ABOUT TO SEE WITH THEIR OWN EYES.  SATAN TRANSFORMED INTO AN ANGEL OF LIGHT, and  SOON will be standing in the place he ought not, SHOWING HIMSELF that he is God.  CLAIMING TO BE GOD.  THE WHOLE WORLD DECEIVED.  SO GOOD AT LYING THAT THE TIME HAD TO BE SHORTENED OR ELSE NO FLESH WOULD BE SAVED....


BUT THE PEOPLE OF THE WORLD KNOW NOTHING of this so AGAIN, 


AREN'T THEY GOING TO BE AMAZED?  AREN'T THEY GOING TO WONDER WHAT IS GOING ON?   ONE SECOND IT SEEMS AS IF THE WORLD MIGHT END, THE NEXT EVERYTHING IS GETTING BETTER BY SOME SORT OF MIRACLE.  THE DEADLY WOUND HEALED, SATAN AND THE FALLEN ANGELS HAVING BEEN CAST TO THE EARTH, the image is set up, talking away, take the mark and PROSPER...  

then again, Christians barely seem to know what is going to be happening. 

third CLUE:

IF we get it into context, we are going to be able to discern the TIME and that always always always takes place how? 

PRECEPT ON PRECEPT, PRECEPT ON PRECEPT VERSE BY VERSE..........either follow that method and find the rest

or make fun of it and do it your own way and fall backwards, be snared and TAKEN.

BUILD UPON THE FOUNDATION LAID...RIGHTLY DIVIDE THE TIMES...


SO starting at the beginning of the Chapter AT THE VERY LEAST...
 

1And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:


WHAT HAS HAPPENED 'IN THE VISION' BEFORE THIS CONVERSATION TAKING PLACE? 

IT'S REALLY REALLY IMPORTANT especially since IT CONCERNS 'the beast which WAS

AND IS NOT....' SO,

if the ANGEL has taken John to the time PAST THE JUDGMENT being rendered, 

THEN when are we in time??

the BRIGHTNESS OF CHRIST DESTORYS the workings (beast) of SATAN and it is at THAT TIME he is bound and put INTO THE ABYSS and SEALED for a thousand years.  

 

back to 

2With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.

Now, 

3So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

(Remind you of anything?  Maybe something like a couple chapters back...
3And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads).
 

4And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:

5And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.

6And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

7And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns.

 

8The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition:

WHAT IS THE ANGELS TELLING US?  THE BEAST WAS, BUT NO LONGER IS 
because he is bound and sealed in the ABYSS for the Lords Day

...but THERE IS THE SHORT SEASON coming in which HE IS GOING TO BE RELEASED and that will be AT THE END OF the Lords Day...

but WHILE HE IS BOUND IN THE ABYSS

and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.



once judgment has taken place, Satan is bound, his time of 'IS NOT' is upon him, and he is not able to communicate, is not able to influence, is not able to 'blind', etc.  

BUT he will be loosed....

so he 'yet is'  






And when he is loosed, it will be 'and YET IS' season,

7And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

10And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.


 

1For the LORD will have mercy on Jacob, and will yet choose Israel, and set them in their own land: and the strangers shall be joined with them, and they shall cleave to the house of Jacob.

2And the people shall take them, and bring them to their place: and the house of Israel shall possess them in the land of the LORD for servants and handmaids: and they shall take them captives, whose captives they were; and they shall rule over their oppressors.

3And it shall come to pass in the day that the LORD shall give thee rest from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve,

4That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!

5The LORD hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers.

6He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth.

7The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing.

8Yea, the fir trees rejoice at thee, and the cedars of Lebanon, saying, Since thou art laid down, no feller is come up against us.

9Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.

10All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?

11Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee.

12How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

15Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.

16They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;

17That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners?

18All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house.

19But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.

20Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.

21Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.

22For I will rise up against them, saith the LORD of hosts, and cut off from Babylon the name, and remnant, and son, and nephew, saith the LORD.

23I will also make it a possession for the bittern, and pools of water: and I will sweep it with the besom of destruction, saith the LORD of hosts.

24The LORD of hosts hath sworn, saying, Surely as I have thought, so shall it come to pass; and as I have purposed, so shall it stand:

25That I will break the Assyrian in my land, and upon my mountains tread him under foot: then shall his yoke depart from off them, and his burden depart from off their shoulders.

26This is the purpose that is purposed upon the whole earth: and this is the hand that is stretched out upon all the nations.

27For the LORD of hosts hath purposed, and who shall disannul it? and his hand is stretched out, and who shall turn it back? Isa 14

Right? or no?

[Diaste]

20 hours ago, douggg said:

Because the little horn in Daniel 8:9 waxes exceedingly great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

...meaning that he is coming from a location northwest of Israel.    northwest of Israel is Greece.

Or....

[Shilohsfoal]

6 hours ago, warrior12 said:

Search the net for some bible commentaries and see what the commentators say about what you have concerns about and get back here with your findings, cause you want to make a statement but you are shy of doing so. 

Well,anyways.The Muslims will end up killing the two christians and their armed forces.

Muslims can celebrate the liberation of Jerusalem for a few days before their destruction comes from the north.

[Shilohsfoal]

On 6/11/2023 at 4:41 AM, douggg said:

Daniel 8:8 Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.

9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

The little horn does not come out of a king.    But instead out of either Ptolemy, Cassander, Lysimachus and Seleucus, kingdoms.

Cassander's ancient Greek Macedonia kingdom is the only one north and west of Israel.

It also happens to be the eastern boundary of the EU, the Roman empire of the end times

I am keeping an eye on Zelensky, a Jew, who the little horn to become the Antichrist, King of Israel, must be a Jew.   

 If Russia is Gog's main army, which it appears to be, then should the Russians decide to withdraw from their war on Ukraine and start bringing their forces back to Russia - it could be then Ezekiel 38:4 takes place of Russia being drawn back, but toward the middle east, into a conflict that develops of the muslim nations against Israel.

From the text of verse 4, it looks like Gog is going to be dragged into the Gog/Magog event, being turned back from whatever he is previously engaged in.

3 And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:

4 And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords:

Going to have to see if somehow Zelensky becomes the leader over 10 EU leaders or not.   That would be a big break through bible prophecy event, imo.  Ukraine is on a fast track to become a full-fledged EU member state.

The little horn arrived in the pleasant land from the north east by ship a long time ago.He formed a goverment in the pleasant land and declared his independence .He called himself Israel and today's governs the land of Israel.He has waxed great becoming a nuclear power even though he's still little.

[warrior12]

2 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Well,anyways.The Muslims will end up killing the two christians and their armed forces.

 

So, now you do believe the two witnesses of Christ are "Christians" .

Also, where do you see they are accompanied by "armed forces". Show this in scripture.

Your theology, is from something very weird.  Where are you getting all this stuff from ?.

Here, below, you can read a commentary of the whole chapter of revelation 11 and get picture of how Christians for the most part understand the scenes portrayed.  There are many other bible commentaries you can read online also. 

There are many who have their own independent view of the book of revelation and we can see it here as to the many disagreements here and t hat is fine, as long as scripture is shown as a reference to the points being made.

If you can point to any doctrines that you have about your theology of revelation 11, then we can have an understanding how you arrive at your interpretations or understanding of the chapter.

https://enduringword.com/bible-commentary/revelation-11/

b. And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified: The two witnesses are killed in the city of Jerusalem, which is described in three illustrative terms.

· As Sodom, speaking of immorality.

· As Egypt, speaking of oppression and slavery.

· As the great city, a term often applied to Babylon, the headquarters of Antichrist (Revelation 16:19, 17:18, 18:10, 18:16, 18:18, 18:19, 18:21).

i. If, during the first three and one-half years, Jerusalem’s leadership is in league with the Antichrist, it is easy to see how these titles apply. Any city in love with the Antichrist, or entering into a covenant with him, could be called Sodom, Egypt, and Babylon.

c. Those who dwell on the earth will rejoice over them, make merry, and send gifts to one another: The earth saw and rejoiced over the deaths of the two witnesses. The fact that this is seen by all people, tribes, tongues, and nations is perhaps an oblique prophecy of modern mass media.

i. It is amazing – and not far-fetched at all – to think of a live, worldwide broadcast on new channels and over the internet, “Live from Jerusalem,” and seeing the amazing scene described here taking place.

ii. The idea is also that the world treats these two witnesses in a humiliating manner. “To have his dead body lie in view of all was the worst humiliation a person could suffer from his enemies.” (Johnson)

iii. Make merry, and send gifts to one another: Donald Grey Barnhouse told of a Christmas card with Revelation 11:10 on its cover – a terrible misquoting of the Scriptures!

d. Because these two prophets tormented those who dwell on the earth: The preaching of these two witnesses and their call to repentance was a torment for many, because they could not stand to hear the truth while they loved their lie.

Edited June 12, 2023 by warrior12

[Shilohsfoal]

1 hour ago, warrior12 said:

So, now you do believe the two witnesses of Christ are "Christians" .

Also, where do you see they are accompanied by "armed forces". Show this in scripture.

Your theology, is from something very weird.  Where are you getting all this stuff from ?.

Here, below, you can read a commentary of the whole chapter of revelation 11 and get picture of how Christians for the most part understand the scenes portrayed.  There are many other bible commentaries you can read online also. 

There are many who have their own independent view of the book of revelation and we can see it here as to the many disagreements here and t hat is fine, as long as scripture is shown as a reference to the points being made.

If you can point to any doctrines that you have about your theology of revelation 11, then we can have an understanding how you arrive at your interpretations or understanding of the chapter.

https://enduringword.com/bible-commentary/revelation-11/

b. And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified: The two witnesses are killed in the city of Jerusalem, which is described in three illustrative terms.

· As Sodom, speaking of immorality.

· As Egypt, speaking of oppression and slavery.

· As the great city, a term often applied to Babylon, the headquarters of Antichrist (Revelation 16:19, 17:18, 18:10, 18:16, 18:18, 18:19, 18:21).

i. If, during the first three and one-half years, Jerusalem’s leadership is in league with the Antichrist, it is easy to see how these titles apply. Any city in love with the Antichrist, or entering into a covenant with him, could be called Sodom, Egypt, and Babylon.

c. Those who dwell on the earth will rejoice over them, make merry, and send gifts to one another: The earth saw and rejoiced over the deaths of the two witnesses. The fact that this is seen by all people, tribes, tongues, and nations is perhaps an oblique prophecy of modern mass media.

i. It is amazing – and not far-fetched at all – to think of a live, worldwide broadcast on new channels and over the internet, “Live from Jerusalem,” and seeing the amazing scene described here taking place.

ii. The idea is also that the world treats these two witnesses in a humiliating manner. “To have his dead body lie in view of all was the worst humiliation a person could suffer from his enemies.” (Johnson)

iii. Make merry, and send gifts to one another: Donald Grey Barnhouse told of a Christmas card with Revelation 11:10 on its cover – a terrible misquoting of the Scriptures!

d. Because these two prophets tormented those who dwell on the earth: The preaching of these two witnesses and their call to repentance was a torment for many, because they could not stand to hear the truth while they loved their lie.

Studying scripture we learn the gentiles occupy Jerusalem for 42 months while the two witnesses have the word"fire" procede from their mouths.

 

Revelation 11

² But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

³ And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

 

⁴ These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

⁵ And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.

 

In Daniel 11,we learn that those gentiles are  the armed forces of the north that will be occupying Jerusalem during that time.

 

Daniel 11:31

³¹ “His armed forces will rise up to desecrate the temple fortress and will abolish the daily sacrifice. Then they will set up the abomination that causes desolation.

 

In fact ,the word "fire" which procedes from the mouths of the two christians happens to be the same word that is used in the armed forces of the north to destroy their enemies.Maybe just a strange coincidence but then again,it is a prophecy.

 

Fire commands are oral orders issued by leaders to focus and distribute fires as required achieving decisive effects against the enemy. They allow leaders to rapidly and concisely articulate their firing instructions using a standard format (Refer to TC 3-20.31-4 for more information)

Edited June 12, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[warrior12]

13 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

³ And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

Here brother, you quoted what the two witnesses were assigned to do. They were given supernatural power from the living God to destroy anyone that attacked them. They did not need anyone else.  

You are forming your own theology based on some book or on some concepts that you many have formulated in your mind.  Satan love to plant seeds of confusion, so you have to be carefull of how you portray the written word. Pray for discernment, so that your mind would not be led down a rabbit hole.

[Last Daze]

14 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

You know, I was under the impression that the two witnesses were christians seeing that their lord was crucified in that city.

Revelation 11:8

Their bodies will lie in the public square of the great city—which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt—where also their Lord was crucified.

Don't you call the servants of Jesus Christ "christians "or do you call them something else?

Isn't Jesus Lord of the Old Testament saints too?   As well as Lord of the angels?

These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands that stand before the Lord of the earth.  Rev 11:4

Then he said, “These are the two anointed ones, who are standing by the Lord of the whole earth.”  Zechariah 4:14

I'd suggest re-reading Zechariah 4 for a more complete understanding of who these two witnesses are.