The Apocalypse may not happen the way men see it.

[Diaste]

18 hours ago, Vine Abider said:

@Stewardofthemystery I think you hit on some real good points here! Man (and the flesh) always tend to look at the outward.  And, as you mentioned, that's what Hollywood picks up on - the things that are seen.  That was one of my issues with the whole Left Behind series - all the outward events and not much regarding the Spirit or matters unseen (including the heart).  And movies tend to focus on the Roman Catholic Church, I think because that system of doing things is easily shown on film.

Planes falling from the sky because the pilot was raptured and utter pandemonium as all kinds of disasters occur, because suddenly believers were snatched away from taking care of all their normal, every day things - all outwardly spectacular things that are seen and easily depicted in movies.  

As you and @AdHoc point out, the Lord refers to Himself as a thief coming, which refers to a much more stealthy, off-the-radar sort of approach.  Many won't see this.

I must say that whenever the Lord has moved mightily in my life, there usually has not been huge, physical manifestations.  Oh, physical things were affected, but that wasn't His main modus operandi, at least in my experience. (He moved and spoke in my heart, and this then had a lot to do with how I handled various things)

The pretrib rapture is one of those things that people have been taught that isn't going to happen. 

How interesting this is posted as probably the single greatest deception of the western church.

What a crazy ol' world.

[Shilohsfoal]

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

Oh for sure! But that's because of personal weakness and lack of trust in the Lord Jesus Christ. 

Jesus speaks the truth, all others lie. imo.

lol. it's world wide. 

Haha. We'll know. 

If the wrath of God were to be upon all the world then Jesus would not have said it would be upon the inhabitants of Judea and warned the people outside of Israel not to enter during that time.

 

Luke 21:21

Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.

For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
 

 

Now if the mark of the beast were given to everyone all over the world,then everyone all over the world would know when Christ would come because everyone knows the beast continues 42 months and the it is destroyed by Christ at his coming.

Instead Jesus warns everyone outside of Israel not to enter while God's wrath is being poured out upon that people.

Edited June 14, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[Justin Adams]

2 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

flee to the mountains

This all happened just prior to 70 AD. Vespian gave them two years pause before Titus came and destroyed the place. The Christians fled to Pella. Not one was lost. The Darby rendition of end times is just wrong. The so-called Apocalypse has already happened to Israel for God's wrath was already poured out in 70 AD. 

We Christians might have another few thousands of years before the Lord's enemies are all put under His feet. Yeshua reigns supreme right now. He is Lord of Lord and King of Kings right now.

Forget the Darby ideas and all the pre-mil and pre-trib stuff. It is all fake, and detracts from our Lord's directive to go and save the nations.

[R. Hartono]

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

The pretrib rapture is one of those things that people have been taught that isn't going to happen. 

How interesting this is posted as probably the single greatest deception of the western church.

What a crazy ol' world.

The wise virgins are taken to the wedding but the foolish are left behind.

[R. Hartono]

On 6/12/2023 at 11:16 PM, Stewardofthemystery said:

Many people view the Apocalypse like a glorified Hollywood movie where the sky is falling and the world is in total pandemonium and chaos. But did you ever stop to think that prophecy may not happen the way men see it as happening? That is men view things more often than not based on outward appearances, but God views things differently.
 

For instance, what if many of the plagues and judgments prophesied have a deeper spiritual meaning? If something has a deeper spiritual meaning it does not mean it is not going to happen literally per say, it just means it may not be seen or understood in the natural sense of things.

Here is something you need to reconcile with the imagery you see in the Revelation along with other end time prophecy.
 

For instance we are told in 1 Thess. 5:3, For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction comes upon them…” The saying "Peace and safety”does not sound like total pandemonium and chaos is happening before the final “sudden destruction”.

Jesus compared His coming to the days of Noah and the days of Lot. And even though I'm sure Noah and Lot warned others of the coming sudden destruction, the people in their day didn’t have a care or a clue to the sudden destruction that was about to destroy them all.

Notice what Jesus says “But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day Noah entered the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.”

Jesus also said “Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; but the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be when the Son of man is revealed.”

What Jesus is describing above by themeating, drinking, buying, selling, planting and building, is everyday normal behavior.

So people may want to try to reconcile how there can be both all these judgments and plagues being poured out, but yet the world is not alarmed, nor does it have a clue as to what is happening, and is living life as it has always done for thousands of years.

Think about this, the apostles and Jesus said His coming would be like a thief in the night for those who did not watch and were ready. So clearly His coming is not going to obvious to the rest of the world.

Daniel was told that none of the wicked would understand, only the wise would understand.

Now I”m not saying there are not bad things happening, or will happen, but what I am saying is, prophecy may not happen the way many a man sees it as being fulfilled.

Prophecy is fulfilled in the way God sees it as being fulfilled, that is why we need to see things through the eyes of God and with the mind of Christ.

Peace

People will faint in terror of anticipating what next shall befall to the world in great tribulation.

Perhaps they shall be warned of the coming asteroid to strike the earth follow by the very long comet which will poison the earth.

[Shilohsfoal]

31 minutes ago, Justin Adams said:

This all happened just prior to 70 AD. Vespian gave them two years pause before Titus came and destroyed the place. The Christians fled to Pella. Not one was lost. The Darby rendition of end times is just wrong. The so-called Apocalypse has already happened to Israel for God's wrath was already poured out in 70 AD. 

We Christians might have another few thousands of years before the Lord's enemies are all put under His feet. Yeshua reigns supreme right now. He is Lord of Lord and King of Kings right now.

Forget the Darby ideas and all the pre-mil and pre-trib stuff. It is all fake, and detracts from our Lord's directive to go and save the nations.

I'm not preterist.I don't believe all things that are written were fulfilled in 70 ad as you do.I believe the time of God's vengeance is still to come after they have taken the mark of the beast.Not before.

 

Luke 21:20

For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

[Shilohsfoal]

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

The pretrib rapture is one of those things that people have been taught that isn't going to happen. 

How interesting this is posted as probably the single greatest deception of the western church.

What a crazy ol' world.

Your probably right about the single greatest deception.

I had a brother in law tell me once that he didn't need to read revelation because he wasn't going to be here.He said he  is going to be raptured before any of it takes place.

 

 

 

Edited June 14, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[FJK]

45 minutes ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Your probably right about the single greatest deception.

I had a brother in law tell me once that he didn't need to read revelation because he wasn't going to be here.He said he  is going to be raptured before any of it takes place.

 

 

 

Makes one wonder why Revelation is included in the Bible at all, doesn't it?

But I'm sure someone has a reason in answer, probably several different ones.

[George]

2 hours ago, FJK said:

Makes one wonder why Revelation is included in the Bible at all, doesn't it?

But I'm sure someone has a reason in answer, probably several different ones.

Another amazing thing is how people try to read the END of the book without genuinely understanding the BEGINNING of the book.

Isa 46:9  remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me, 

Isa 46:10  declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, ‘My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose,’ 

Isa 46:11  calling a bird of prey from the east, the man of my counsel from a far country. I have spoken, and I will bring it to pass; I have purposed, and I will do it. 

Isa 46:12  “Listen to me, you stubborn of heart, you who are far from righteousness: 

Isa 46:13  I bring near my righteousness; it is not far off, and my salvation will not delay; I will put salvation in Zion, for Israel my glory.”

[Vine Abider]

5 hours ago, Diaste said:

The pretrib rapture is one of those things that people have been taught that isn't going to happen. 

How interesting this is posted as probably the single greatest deception of the western church.

What a crazy ol' world.

One's own belief in a particular time for the rapture is something that seems to get very entrenched in believers. Honestly, I see verses for pre, mid and post trib raptures, so I doubt any of our understanding of this is 100% accurate.  In the end, Jesus is still Lord and lives in all of God's regenerated children - that's the main thing.