The Lords 2 anointed witnesses

[Sister]

2 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

The two witnesses are so wonderful to people for those 1260 days that the woman has to flee into the wilderness for those 1260 days.Cant say I blame her.

The two witnesses were not around back then.  All this happened after Jesus ascended.  We had the apostles for witnesses.  The truth was protected and preserved and preached.  Since then Satan has sent a flood after the woman doing everything in his power to destroy that truth and that truth is still with us today.

Revelation 12:17   And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

[Shilohsfoal]

9 hours ago, Sister said:

The two witnesses were not around back then.  All this happened after Jesus ascended.  We had the apostles for witnesses.  The truth was protected and preserved and preached.  Since then Satan has sent a flood after the woman doing everything in his power to destroy that truth and that truth is still with us today.

Revelation 12:17   And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Perhaps you just don't get it because the 1260 days the woman flees into the wilderness is the exact same 1260 days the two witnesses torment other people.

You made the claim in this thread that the following verses is about the two witnesses.

 

Daniel 12:7   And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

 

What you don't get, is for a time,times and a half while the two witnesses are killing and tormenting other people,the saints in Israel are being tormented and killed.

 

Daniel 11:33-34

Wise leaders will give instruction to many, but these teachers will die by fire and sword, or they will be jailed and robbed.

During these persecutions, little help will arrive, and many who join them will not be sincere.

 

while the saints are being jailed and robbed in Israel.,the two witnesses won't lift a finger to help them . The two witnesses are only interested in killing and tormenting other people .Where the saints in Daniel 11:33 are imprisoned and killed for instructing others,the two witnesses are killed after the 42 months because they tormented and killed other people.From where I come from that is called justice.

 

Two many people preach that it is good for christians like the two witnesses to kill and torment other people .If they were following the lamb,they would have been imprisoned and killed like the saints are killed for those 42 months.Insted they torture other people in the name of Jesus Christ.Christ did not teach anyone to do what these two witnesses do .Jesus taught the exact opposite of what they do.

Edited September 10, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[Sister]

19 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

Perhaps you just don't get it because the 1260 days the woman flees into the wilderness is the exact same 1260 days the two witnesses torment other people.

 

 

Shilohsfoal

The 1260 days is 3 1/2 years.  It's not speaking about the 3 1/2 years that is to come, but what already came.  History for us now.  The 'woman' was hid in the wilderness for 3 1/2 years after Jesus died and ascended.

Revelation 12:5   And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

(The ascension)

 

Revelation 12:6   And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

(This didn't happen over 2000 years later, but straight away after Christ rose)

Revelation 12:7   And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

(This war happened when Jesus ascended)

Revelation 12:8   And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

Revelation 12:9   And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

(Satan and his angels cast out of heaven that very same day Jesus ascended)

 

 Revelation 12:13   And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

  Revelation 12:14   And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

3.5 years.  God's 'doctrine' is 'nourished' ***for a time***by being kept alive through being taught to the apostles, preserved by the apostles and preached by the apostles. Letters written, copies made, testimonies given. Secret meetings.  Satan could not get access to the NT to corrupt it,...not for those 3.5 years. It had to be established first untainted. 

  Revelation 12:15   And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

Satan sends out the armies to kill these apostles in order to drown out the spoken word.

  Revelation 12:16   And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

All this in 3.5 years.  Apostles taught, given wisdom and understanding, and receiving spiritual gifts and power.  Satan could not stop this from happening no matter how hard he tried.  The earth hid these apostles from him.

  Revelation 12:17   And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

This goes on until today.

 

Quote

 

You made the claim in this thread that the following verses is about the two witnesses.

Daniel 12:7   And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

 

Yes, took me many years to finally understand this.  The two witnesses are the only ones full of power during the tribulation to send as many plagues as they wish,  and they are God's anointed meaning he has chosen them for this job, and they are holy and righteous, not wicked as you suggest.  This is judgement time when the world receives God's wrath and he has chosen these two to demonstrate not their own power but his.

 

Quote

What you don't get, is for a time,times and a half while the two witnesses are killing and tormenting other people,the saints in Israel are being tormented and killed.

What I get is that these two witnesses are very holy, and God is using them to punish Babylon just like he used Moses and Aaron to send the plagues and free his people.  I also understand that Babylon consists of the whole world and not just Israel, and the saints are spread throughout the whole earth.  The trouble only starts in Israel and then spreads throughout the whole earth. 

 

 

Quote

 

Daniel 11:33-34

Wise leaders will give instruction to many, but these teachers will die by fire and sword, or they will be jailed and robbed.

During these persecutions, little help will arrive, and many who join them will not be sincere.

 

Strange translation.  It's not 100% accurate.  Part of the flood.

 

 

[Shilohsfoal]

2 hours ago, Sister said:

Shilohsfoal

The 1260 days is 3 1/2 years.  It's not speaking about the 3 1/2 years that is to come, but what already came.  History for us now.  The 'woman' was hid in the wilderness for 3 1/2 years after Jesus died and ascended.

Revelation 12:5   And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

(The ascension)

 

Revelation 12:6   And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

(This didn't happen over 2000 years later, but straight away after Christ rose)

Revelation 12:7   And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

(This war happened when Jesus ascended)

Revelation 12:8   And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

Revelation 12:9   And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

(Satan and his angels cast out of heaven that very same day Jesus ascended)

 

 Revelation 12:13   And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

  Revelation 12:14   And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

3.5 years.  God's 'doctrine' is 'nourished' ***for a time***by being kept alive through being taught to the apostles, preserved by the apostles and preached by the apostles. Letters written, copies made, testimonies given. Secret meetings.  Satan could not get access to the NT to corrupt it,...not for those 3.5 years. It had to be established first untainted. 

  Revelation 12:15   And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

Satan sends out the armies to kill these apostles in order to drown out the spoken word.

  Revelation 12:16   And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

All this in 3.5 years.  Apostles taught, given wisdom and understanding, and receiving spiritual gifts and power.  Satan could not stop this from happening no matter how hard he tried.  The earth hid these apostles from him.

  Revelation 12:17   And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

This goes on until today.

 

Yes, took me many years to finally understand this.  The two witnesses are the only ones full of power during the tribulation to send as many plagues as they wish,  and they are God's anointed meaning he has chosen them for this job, and they are holy and righteous, not wicked as you suggest.  This is judgement time when the world receives God's wrath and he has chosen these two to demonstrate not their own power but his.

 

What I get is that these two witnesses are very holy, and God is using them to punish Babylon just like he used Moses and Aaron to send the plagues and free his people.  I also understand that Babylon consists of the whole world and not just Israel, and the saints are spread throughout the whole earth.  The trouble only starts in Israel and then spreads throughout the whole earth. 

 

 

Strange translation.  It's not 100% accurate.  Part of the flood.

 

 

So you believe people who kill and torment other people in Jesus name are good and holy.

God gave Pontius Pilate power during his stay in Israel as well.He also could kill or torment other people as he pleased.Does that mean he is good too or can you only kill and torment people in Jesus name and still be good?

 

John 19:11

Jesus answered, “You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin.”

 

And like Pontius Pilate,the two witnesses have authority over the armed forces of the north .They give commands just like him.

 

 

 

 

Edited September 11, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[Shilohsfoal]

11 hours ago, Sister said:

Shilohsfoal

The 1260 days is 3 1/2 years.  It's not speaking about the 3 1/2 years that is to come, but what already came.  History for us now.  The 'woman' was hid in the wilderness for 3 1/2 years after Jesus died and ascended.

Revelation 12:5   And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

(The ascension)

 

Revelation 12:6   And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

(This didn't happen over 2000 years later, but straight away after Christ rose)

Revelation 12:7   And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

(This war happened when Jesus ascended)

Revelation 12:8   And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

Revelation 12:9   And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

(Satan and his angels cast out of heaven that very same day Jesus ascended)

 

 Revelation 12:13   And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

  Revelation 12:14   And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

3.5 years.  God's 'doctrine' is 'nourished' ***for a time***by being kept alive through being taught to the apostles, preserved by the apostles and preached by the apostles. Letters written, copies made, testimonies given. Secret meetings.  Satan could not get access to the NT to corrupt it,...not for those 3.5 years. It had to be established first untainted. 

  Revelation 12:15   And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

Satan sends out the armies to kill these apostles in order to drown out the spoken word.

  Revelation 12:16   And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

All this in 3.5 years.  Apostles taught, given wisdom and understanding, and receiving spiritual gifts and power.  Satan could not stop this from happening no matter how hard he tried.  The earth hid these apostles from him.

  Revelation 12:17   And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

This goes on until today.

 

Yes, took me many years to finally understand this.  The two witnesses are the only ones full of power during the tribulation to send as many plagues as they wish,  and they are God's anointed meaning he has chosen them for this job, and they are holy and righteous, not wicked as you suggest.  This is judgement time when the world receives God's wrath and he has chosen these two to demonstrate not their own power but his.

 

What I get is that these two witnesses are very holy, and God is using them to punish Babylon just like he used Moses and Aaron to send the plagues and free his people.  I also understand that Babylon consists of the whole world and not just Israel, and the saints are spread throughout the whole earth.  The trouble only starts in Israel and then spreads throughout the whole earth. 

 

 

Strange translation.  It's not 100% accurate.  Part of the flood.

 

 

PS

The two witnesses are tormenting babylons enemies during those 3.5 years.You must keep in mind ,the beast that ascends out of the abyss which kills the two witnesses,hates the prostitute Babylon and attacks her.

Revelation 17:16

¹⁶ The beast and the ten horns you saw will hate the prostitute. They will bring her to ruin and leave her naked; they will eat her flesh and burn her with fire. 

 

The beast from the abyss attacks both Babylon and the two witnesses.The beast attacks both the city that sits on seven hills and the two witnesses.

Talk about killing two birds with one stone.

Edited September 11, 2023 by Shilohsfoal

[Shilohsfoal]

I sure would like for someone to show me where Jesus commanded his witnesses to kill and torment other people.

I keep looking through the gospel at the Lord's commands and I just can't find where he commands his witnesses to torment other people.

[Last Daze]

9 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

So you believe people who kill and torment other people in Jesus name are good and holy.

8 hours ago, Shilohsfoal said:

I sure would like for someone to show me where Jesus commanded his witnesses to kill and torment other people.

The two witnesses are plague bringers.  The plagues are righteous judgment.  It's the same two witnesses that stood before the Lord of the earth as He visited Abraham, the ones who rescued Lot and destroyed Sodom.

Then the third angel poured out his bowl into the rivers and the springs of waters; and they became blood.  And I heard the angel of the waters saying, “Righteous are You, the One who is and who was, O Holy One, because You judged these things; for they poured out the blood of saints and prophets, and You have given them blood to drink. They deserve it.”  And I heard the altar saying, “Yes, Lord God, the Almighty, true and righteous are Your judgments.”  Rev 16:4

[Shilohsfoal]

11 minutes ago, Last Daze said:

The two witnesses are plague bringers.  The plagues are righteous judgment.  It's the same two witnesses that stood before the Lord of the earth as He visited Abraham, the ones who rescued Lot and destroyed Sodom.

Then the third angel poured out his bowl into the rivers and the springs of waters; and they became blood.  And I heard the angel of the waters saying, “Righteous are You, the One who is and who was, O Holy One, because You judged these things; for they poured out the blood of saints and prophets, and You have given them blood to drink. They deserve it.”  And I heard the altar saying, “Yes, Lord God, the Almighty, true and righteous are Your judgments.”  Rev 16:4

None of the things you preach are written about the two witnesses.

The only thing is says they do is kill And torment other people.

God will not be mocked and they will reap what they sow.If they sow torment,then those two witnesses of Jesus will reap the same.

Their Lord was crucified in Jerusalem and that makes them christians.Jesus Christ is their Lord and he commands them and his commandments are with us in the gospel.

 

These two witnesses of Jesus are not angels.They are christians who kill in Jesus name.

Revelation 11:8

Their bodies will lie in the public square of the great city—which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt—where also their Lord was crucified.
 

Now show me with Jesus's own words where he commands his witnesses to kill and torment other people in his name.

 

Mathew 7:12

So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.

 

 

[Shilohsfoal]

It's easy to see how a falling away takes place when these two show up in Jerusalem

 

I recon I'm about the only one that has realized these two witnesses show up in Jerusalem the same time the son of perdition does.

[Shilohsfoal]

This is what takes place soon as the two witnesses show up in Jerusalem.

 

Daniel 11:33-35

“Wise leaders will give instruction to many, but these teachers will die by fire and sword, or they will be jailed and robbed.

During these persecutions, little help will arrive, and many who join them will not be sincere.

And some of the wise will fall victim to persecution. In this way, they will be refined and cleansed and made pure until the time of the end, for the appointed time is still to come.

 

 

 

This persecution begins after the two witnesses appear in Jerusalem and it continues untill they are put to death at the time of the end.

The problem with some people on this board is they can't tell the difference between doing good and doing evil.Some people on this board believe if your a christian who kills and torments other people in Jesus name,then your doing good.They completely ignore anything and everything Jesus teaches us in the gospel .