enoob57 Posted November 18, 2023 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,194 Content Per Day: 7.98 Reputation: 21,470 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted November 18, 2023 42 minutes ago, Your closest friendnt said: Then there is no need to preach the Gospel in the way "choose life or choose death. Yes -death in the Bible is separation from God not cessation of existence.... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marathoner Posted November 18, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 71 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 10,144 Content Per Day: 7.06 Reputation: 13,102 Days Won: 97 Joined: 05/24/2020 Status: Offline Share Posted November 18, 2023 We encounter issues with the presumption that all men and women live eternally. The issue is simple: if all men and women live eternally, then why does the Son of God reward those who love Him with eternal life? (John 10:27-28) If we already lived eternally, then this gift would be moot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted November 19, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,854 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,761 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2023 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Marathoner said: We encounter issues with the presumption that all men and women live eternally. The issue is simple: if all men and women live eternally, then why does the Son of God reward those who love Him with eternal life? (John 10:27-28) If we already lived eternally, then this gift would be moot. This question in one sided because it comes without the meaning of the context of the key words. Man is an eternal being and he is indestructible. From this statement we must understand that we are not talking about the physical Man the material one but we are referring to the Spiritual man after the destruction of his body. His body was and it's not and will never be again. But he will never be forgotten and we will know how he looked like and and his history without having ever seen his picture and without knowing nothing about him if we are in the same place after the Physical death. And this is because his Spiritual man is the exact replica of his physical man and they share the same identification and the same .memories or better the Spiritual man has all the memories of the physical man but when the physical man lived he could not have all the memories of the Spiritual man because he cannot see in the Spiritual world like the Spiritual man who can see both in the physical world and the spiritual world and could also do that while he yet lived with the physical man... With Jesus Christ we are partakers of his Spirit and he was in the Life with God from the beginning and he died while he was still in the Life of God and he is our eternal life because we are as he is Spiritually. He can never loose his Life as to disobey God and fall because God has made the Lord of everything and has given him all his Theotis and he is in charge of everything which it comes with the understanding that as a RULER he rules the Government is upon his shoulders. He can never risk to disobey God because God does not tell him what to do in the way before the Cross which included the risk of disobedience. And as we are also in his Atonement we are safe in him because he does not count our sins against his righteousness because we are having his righteousness the forgiveness of sins in his blood. Those who refused to believe in him they must live with the memory that they had been given the chance to believe in him or to have their sins forgiven in his blood but they did not believe in him that he was the one who through him the appointed one from God, the one God gave him the Heavens as his Inheritance and they must know why they are not in Heaven together with the believers and they are together with the unbelievers. -There has to be always their witnessing and the confession from them that they are rightfully away from God because they refused to believe in Jesus Christ till the time when they died physically.- All who did not believe in their lifetime they all believed after their death because they all kneel down before Jesus Christ the Judge of all who did not believe before they died they will believe after their death when they see Jesus Christ on his Throne and because they believed at that time after their death and that does not count because Jesus Christ he left with us the saying that "Bless are those who have not see me and believe". Jesus Christ said that knowing of that moment that everyone even those who did not believe in him will believe when they kneel down before him after their physical death. AMEN. There two Inheritances for man after his death the Heavenly Inheritance and the Inheritance in the heart of the earth where Jesus went after his death on the Cross as he said I have to descend to the very Low before I ascend to very High. Edited November 19, 2023 by Your closest friendnt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revelation Man Posted November 19, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 4,072 Content Per Day: 1.41 Reputation: 553 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/01/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted November 19, 2023 (edited) On 11/9/2023 at 12:37 PM, Vine Abider said: It's interesting how we as Christians use words that aren't actually in the bible . . . some I think are useful and some I think are not. And while the King James bible translation was remarkable, certain Old English words were substituted like "church" (a pet peeve of mine) and "hell" which I don't think are very good translations. Yet we continue to use these words today, 400 years later. Words morph, or get mistranslated and morph. Just like Departure being changed by the KJV bible to falling away. Its really APO (Away from) and Hestemi(Standing) so its away from a standing, and that standing is the church on earth, which departs or is gathered unto Christ. Likewise, here we see Hades (Grave) and other words references morphing into hell. I do not think, via bible verses, anyone goes straight to hell, or heaven after we die. I do not think Hell even exists yet, it only comes into existence, imho, when God sets this universe, and earth, on fire in Rev. 20. Then we go to the New Heaven and Earth (New Jerusalem) whilst this universe burns for eternity, I think Satan and all those who followed him will be trapped into a Universe with a Space Time Continuum that will not allow them to leave. Thus their hell, imho, listening to Peter describe how this universes atoms will melt, is this universe. These misconceptions is why people think people are already in heaven, when of course that's just not the case. Edited November 20, 2023 by Revelation Man 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vine Abider Posted November 19, 2023 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 6 Topic Count: 201 Topics Per Day: 0.36 Content Count: 3,431 Content Per Day: 6.23 Reputation: 2,284 Days Won: 3 Joined: 10/25/2022 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/01/2024 Author Share Posted November 19, 2023 18 hours ago, Revelation Man said: Words morph, or get mistranslated and morph. Just like Departure being changed by the KJV bible to falling away. Its really APO (Away from) and Hestemi(Standing) so its away from a standing, and that standing is the church in earth, which departs or is gathered unto Christ. Likewise, here we see Hades (Grave) and other words references morphing into hell. I do not think, via bible verses, anyone goes straight to hell, or heaven after we die. I do not think Hell even exists yet, it only comes into existence, imho, when God sets this universe, and earth, on fire in Rev. 20. Then we go to the New Heaven and Earth (New Jerusalem) whilst this universe burns for eternity, I think Satan and all those who followed hi will be trapped into a Universe with a Space Time Continuum that will not allow them to leave. Thus their hell, imho, listening to Peter describe how this universes atoms will melt, is this universe. These misconceptions is why people think people are already in heaven, when of course that's just not the case. Wouldn't that be interesting - if God says in essence: "You chose this, so you get to have it," and they remain in this universe, albeit on fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted November 20, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,854 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,761 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted November 20, 2023 19 hours ago, Revelation Man said: Words morph, or get mistranslated and morph. Just like Departure being changed by the KJV bible to falling away. Its really APO (Away from) and Hestemi(Standing) so its away from a standing, and that standing is the church in earth, which departs or is gathered unto Christ. Likewise, here we see Hades (Grave) and other words references morphing into hell. I do not think, via bible verses, anyone goes straight to hell, or heaven after we die. I do not think Hell even exists yet, it only comes into existence, imho, when God sets this universe, and earth, on fire in Rev. 20. Then we go to the New Heaven and Earth (New Jerusalem) whilst this universe burns for eternity, I think Satan and all those who followed hi will be trapped into a Universe with a Space Time Continuum that will not allow them to leave. Thus their hell, imho, listening to Peter describe how this universes atoms will melt, is this universe. These misconceptions is why people think people are already in heaven, when of course that's just not the case. I do not like what you posted about Peter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revelation Man Posted November 20, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 4,072 Content Per Day: 1.41 Reputation: 553 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/01/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted November 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Your closest friendnt said: I do not like what you posted about Peter. 2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. So, we know this will not happen until after Jesus; 1000 year rule via the Kingdom Age is over. So, the DOTL includes Jesus' 1000 year reign. It starts in the middle of the 70th week, God starts taking back the title deed to this earth from Satan who stole it from Adam, whom God originally gave dominion over the entire earth, and animals. It will continue through Jesus' reign on earth. Thus the DOTL will bring this destruction of our universe, as Rev. 20 shows us, the earth is set ablaze, bur Rev. 20 says the Old Earth, and Heaven has passed away, well there are three Heavens, one is God's Throne outside this Universe, then we get our Atmosphere, but the WHOLE Universe is the 2nd Heaven Satan lives in, and Rev. 21 seems to say the Earth and Heavens pass away. Rev. 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. 2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. I just add it all up my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revelation Man Posted November 20, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 12 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 4,072 Content Per Day: 1.41 Reputation: 553 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/01/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted November 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Vine Abider said: Wouldn't that be interesting - if God says in essence: "You chose this, so you get to have it," and they remain in this universe, albeit on fire. Yes, Satan wins his prize, but his powers will be clipped greatly, of course. They will say, look at this little man who wrought such evil (something to that effect). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willa Posted November 20, 2023 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 68 Topic Count: 186 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 14,244 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 16,658 Days Won: 30 Joined: 08/14/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted November 20, 2023 On 11/14/2023 at 12:25 PM, WilliamL said: The souls who die in Christ go to be with Him in heaven. I don"t believe in "soul sleeping" or being in the grave till the resurrection as the 7th Day Adventists believe. In several places Paul speaks of being immediately present with Jesus after he dies so he will always be with the Lord. The body is reunited with the soul upon the resurrection. I don't worry much about the fate of the wicked except to desire the repentance and salvation of the lost. However, the benefit of salvation to our present life, the joy and peace we now experience, are to me the greatest selling points of the Gospel. God's love was what won me, not threats of punishment. The Gospel is GOOD NEWS, after all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted November 20, 2023 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,854 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,761 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted November 20, 2023 2 hours ago, Revelation Man said: 2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. So, we know this will not happen until after Jesus; 1000 year rule via the Kingdom Age is over. So, the DOTL includes Jesus' 1000 year reign. It starts in the middle of the 70th week, God starts taking back the title deed to this earth from Satan who stole it from Adam, whom God originally gave dominion over the entire earth, and animals. It will continue through Jesus' reign on earth. Thus the DOTL will bring this destruction of our universe, as Rev. 20 shows us, the earth is set ablaze, bur Rev. 20 says the Old Earth, and Heaven has passed away, well there are three Heavens, one is God's Throne outside this Universe, then we get our Atmosphere, but the WHOLE Universe is the 2nd Heaven Satan lives in, and Rev. 21 seems to say the Earth and Heavens pass away. Rev. 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. 2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. I just add it all up my friend. In the scriptures we read that Jesus was raised from the place of the dead. That's what Jesus said that as Jonas spent three days in the in that great whale so the son of man will spend three days in the heart of the earth. Jesus also said that he has the Keys of Death and Hades and that he also has the key of David in Revelation. Jesus he told us where he went after his death on the Cross. If anyone wants to know where is Hades he must follow Jesus after his death on the Cross. Jesus also said that he descended in the lowest parts of the earth. Jesus died for all, for the forgiveness of sins of all people including those who had died before him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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