Paul prophesied the falling away of the end times church, is that happening ?

[R. Hartono]

https://harbingersdaily.com/be-on-guard-the-end-times-church-is-one-inundated-with-apostasy/ 

 

 

[Marilyn C]

1 minute ago, R. Hartono said:

https://harbingersdaily.com/be-on-guard-the-end-times-church-is-one-inundated-with-apostasy/ 

 

 

I agree that there is much error and false doctrine however it is in man`s organized system, and that is NOT the Church the Body of Christ. The Lord does not get a bad report card, but is doing an amazing work bringing His Body to maturity in Him before He catches it away. 

`...till we all come to the unity of the faith and the knowledge of the Son of God to a perfect (mature) man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; that we should no longer be children tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine...`(Eph. 4: 13 & 14)

[douggg]

The great falling away in 2Thessalonian2:3 will be Christians falling away from belief that Jesus is the messiah and switching to believing that the person who has just been anointed the King of Israel is the messiah instead.

Will not happen until right after the Gog/Magog event.

Edited December 4, 2023 by douggg

[R. Hartono]

3 hours ago, douggg said:

The great falling away in 2Thessalonian2:3 will be Christians falling away from belief that Jesus is the messiah and switching to believing that the person who has just been anointed the King of Israel is the messiah instead.

Will not happen until right after the Gog/Magog event.

Isnt 2 Thes 2:3 says falling away first then the man of sin is revealed after it ?

[tatwo]

11 hours ago, douggg said:

The great falling away in 2Thessalonian2:3 will be Christians falling away from belief that Jesus is the messiah

It would seem that John was addressing this very issue by definition in 1^st John 2:18-27 where he introduces the “antichrist.” He writes that “it”…this would be the spirit of antichrist…that had captured the minds of “they” the people who were “once among” (now the outer court) the family of God (the temple)…and “led them away” from the spiritual kingdom of God. This describes your statement rather well wouldn’t you agree?

[tatwo]

11 hours ago, douggg said:

and switching to believing that the person who has just been anointed the King of Israel is the messiah instead.

Now why would you go from stating that “apostasy” or “falling away”…is from belief that Yahshua is the messiah…who had then become a Spirit…the Holy Spirit to be specific…to a belief in a “person anointed as king of Israel” (natural)? Though you did describe a type of “falling away.”

However…with Yahshua no longer a “fleshly” reality in the earth…but spiritual…the “falling away” being described by Paul here would have to be “spiritual apostacy”…which is why he says “disturbed either by a spirit or a message or a letter as if from us” which is what John points out.

Apostasy here is a “spiritual falling away”…which means moving from worshipping God who is the Holy Spirit…to worshipping the “antichrist” who is an evil spirit or false Christ…as though he were God. This is the “antichrist” lie or deception that causes the “falling away” and it has been operational since at least when John wrote about it.

It should be understood that this “falling away” is a “process”…it “comes”…or starts…or begins with a scenario like Brother John wrote to us…and has been “on the increase” (like birth pangs on a woman) since that time.

Paul explains these things by telling us that the “day of Lord will not come” until “after the lawless one initiates the apostasy or lawlessness (powerful dark antichrist spirit which initiates and causes the delusion and a continuation of the falling away) has come”…which is the …”the man of lawlessness is revealed”…and…”he takes his seat in the temple of God displaying himself as God.”

In my limited experience with humanity on the earth over the last 60+ years…it is the concept of “temple of God” that seems blurred significantly. A right understanding of the “temple of God” here…would bring increased light to the “Truth” of the subject verses this continual leading to further darkened understanding…thus perpetuating the “apostasy.”

In Mar 14:58, Act 17:24, 2Co 5:1, Heb 9:11, Heb 9:24 we have an explicit declaration that the “temple of God” is not a manmade edifice.

So this lawless one in his deception is not going to be taking a seat in anything other than those with the “marked mindset” of fallen religious humanity…this fallen and “falling away” sect of delusional and deceived humanity. This is why Paul says “let know one in any way deceive you.”

This “lawless one who takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as God” is a manifestation of the spirit of the satanic antichrist or better written…false Christ”…possessing the minds and souls of deceived humanity who has been marked as such. This then is causing them to believe and live as though he…this “lawless one” is God…so that they will profess him as such. Not so much as in the outward way, though that does happen…it is the “mindset” that these apostates live from…that attempts through lies to present himself as the God and Father of creation.

Paul is reminding these Thessalonians of something he had already wrote to them prior…writing from his day in the first century…he will go on to say… “For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work;”…so in Paul’s mind this lawless one is presently active…coinciding with 1^st John 2.

“Already at work” surely denotes a process of some duration that has begun and further…that the “lawless one” will continue for a season…while being restrained by the Holy Spirit…the Holy Ghost has governed to a “lessening degree” the lawless ones effect and impact over time…until according to the plan of God from before ages…the Lord simply releases the “full impact – unrestrained” of this lawlessness upon the earth.

The “falling away” is a process that has begun and is increasing…one which begins in antiquity douggg…and is ongoing…today the earth is approaching a near total state of lawlessness. This lawlessness will continue until the appearing of the Lord in which time the lawless one will be consumed by the breath of His mouth…the “Word.”

Paul goes on to state that all those who have “not seen” or in other words “not received this revelation of” (revelation is how the living Lord communicates with His Holy Spirit filled Body)…this truth about the lawless one…will continue receiving from God…“upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false, in order that they all may be judged who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in wickedness.”

When you believe what is false…you are deceived and do not know it…this is the delusion that the Lord sends upon the wicked douggg. Let the wicked be wicked still.

Edited December 4, 2023 by tatwo
Correction

[tatwo]

11 hours ago, douggg said:

Will not happen until right after the Gog/Magog event.

In regards to the accuracy or Truth of this statement douggg…it comes from the same mind as your second statement in this post…there is a consistency.

[douggg]

5 hours ago, tatwo said:

It would seem that John was addressing this very issue by definition in 1^st John 2:18-27 where he introduces the “antichrist.” He writes that “it”…this would be the spirit of antichrist…that had captured the minds of “they” the people who were “once among” (now the outer court) the family of God (the temple)…and “led them away” from the spiritual kingdom of God. This describes your statement rather well wouldn’t you agree?

John was associating the great falling away with the arrival of the Antichrist.   To which, John noted there were persons already ( John wrote "even now") falling away.    But that is not the great falling away associated with the arrival of the Antichrist.

In 1John2:1818 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

The person who becomes the Antichrist does so by being the King of Israel thought to be messiah by the Jews.   He will be anointed the King of Israel by the false prophet.

The Jews will be the biggest advocates at that time to the rest of the world that the Antichrist is the real messiah and not Jesus.    They will be very convincing to many Christians, especially them who are not strong in the faith.

That person does not become the Antichrist until right after the Gog/Magog event because Ezekiel 39 provides the timeline framework for the 7 years leading up to Armageddon (in Ezekiel 39:17-20) and Jesus returned to this earth in Ezekiel 39:21-29. 

Edited December 4, 2023 by douggg

[tatwo]

1 hour ago, douggg said:

John was associating the great falling away with the arrival of the Antichrist.   To which, John noted there was  persons already ( John wrote "even now") falling away.    But that is not the great falling away associated with the arrival of the Antichrist.

Douggg if you look at your first sentence… “John was associating the great falling away with the arrival of the Antichrist.” Then you look at the third sentence which says…”But that is not the great falling away associated with the arrival of the Antichrist.” Ok…well I am sure you can see my point.

As you and so many others focus so intently upon the "natural...temporal...carnal...fleshly...creation" to understand or interpret the Spirit of God...The realm of the Holy Spirit led kingdom of God in heaven and on earth will simply roll right past all of you...and you will be clinging tightly to your personally worshipped version of the God you made in your own image...which is why it is rare that people agree on topics relative to the incessant "noise of division" that is perpetuated from this place. This is a place where every man "says" what is right in his own eyes.

[douggg]

14 hours ago, R. Hartono said:

Isnt 2 Thes 2:3 says falling away first then the man of sin is revealed after it ?

Yes, in 2Thessalonians2:3-4.

The person revealed as the man of sin is not because of the great falling away though, but because he commits the transgression of desolation act of going into the temple, sitting, claiming to have achieved God-hood.

He will also stop the daily sacrifice just prior to that.   Daniel 8:12-13.

1.  That person begins as the little horn, leader over a pact of ten EU leaders,

2.  then becomes the prince who shall come, following Gog/Magog

3.  then becomes the Antichrist, King of Israel, thought-to-be-messiah by the Jews.

falling away takes place among persons who consider themselves Christians

4.  then about 3 year after becoming the Antichrist, commits the transgression of desolation

5.  revealing himself to be the man of sin, and not the messiah after all.

6.  he is then killed for his audacious act ( the transgression of desolation).

7.   then he is brought back to life and becomes the beast-king, dictator over the EU, the kingdom of the ten EU leaders.

 

 

Edited December 4, 2023 by douggg