Enoch's DEATH is in Hebrews

[Serving]

 

If we can prove that Enoch died .. then the book of Enoch is proven a false heresy, a doctrine of demons .. something to be scorned and rejected by the followers of the Lord .. but only if we can prove Enoch did in fact DIE.

Now take note of these :

Hebrews 11:1-13

1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.

3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

11 Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised.

12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable.

And what happened to all of these above?

13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

=======

So Enoch died after all .. but the book of Enoch claims he did not die .. this means one thing and one thing only .. that the book of Enoch is a false testimony .. it is a LIE.

We can not dispute Hebrews 11, it is as plain as day .. no matter how much you like that book of Enoch, of whose doctrines you mixed with God's written word .. it is now incumbent on us all to fully reject that heretical book and any teachings we have mixed with God's written word .. and especially the ones mixed with God's prophecies .. we must purge them all away, we no longer have excuse to endorse such a writing .. so don't.

The book of Enoch lied .. 

There is no longer any excuse.

 

 

[Mr. M]

21 minutes ago, Serving said:

If we can prove that Enoch died .. then the book of Enoch is proven a false heresy, a doctrine of demons .. something to be scorned and rejected by the followers of the Lord .. but only if we can prove Enoch did in fact DIE.

Is there a particular commonly held doctrine of Christianity

that is supported solely by this book, which should be discredited and rejected?

To what is Jude making reference when he speaks of Enoch's prophecy?

Jude

14 Now Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men also,

saying, Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints,

15 to execute judgment on all, to convict all who are ungodly among them of all

their ungodly deeds which they have committed in an ungodly way,

and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.

[Mr. M]

38 minutes ago, Serving said:

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

Is it possible that the author places this statement between Enoch and Noah,

to establish that since Enoch, Noah, Abraham and Sarah all died?

Why are they distinguished from the rest of the list?

13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises,

but having seen them afar off were assured of them, embraced them 

and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. 

Was it not to establish them as having given promises for us,

but not receiving themselves?

39 And all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith,

did not receive the promise, 

40 God having provided something better for us,

that they should not be made perfect apart from us.

How does debunking Enoch's translation affect Elijah's testimony?

Edited December 17, 2023 by Mr. M

[Serving]

21 minutes ago, Mr. M said:

Is there a particular commonly held doctrine of Christianity

that is supported solely by this book, which should be discredited and rejected?

This post is about what is not supported.

To what is Jude making reference when he speaks of Enoch's prophecy?

Jude

14 Now Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about these men also,

saying, Behold, the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints,

15 to execute judgment on all, to convict all who are ungodly among them of all

their ungodly deeds which they have committed in an ungodly way,

and of all the harsh things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.

If the Satanic scriptures faithfully quote one of Jesus' quotes should we then accept the Satanic scriptures for doing so?

Even though it thereafter goes on to contradict God's word?

Well no, of course not.

Then lets use the same logic for the book of Enoch.

 

[tim_from_pa]

59 minutes ago, Serving said:

 

If we can prove that Enoch died .. then the book of Enoch is proven a false heresy, a doctrine of demons .. something to be scorned and rejected by the followers of the Lord .. but only if we can prove Enoch did in fact DIE.

Now take note of these :

Hebrews 11:1-13

1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.

3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

11 Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised.

12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable.

And what happened to all of these above?

13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

=======

So Enoch died after all .. but the book of Enoch claims he did not die .. this means one thing and one thing only .. that the book of Enoch is a false testimony .. it is a LIE.

We can not dispute Hebrews 11, it is as plain as day .. no matter how much you like that book of Enoch, of whose doctrines you mixed with God's written word .. it is now incumbent on us all to fully reject that heretical book and any teachings we have mixed with God's written word .. and especially the ones mixed with God's prophecies .. we must purge them all away, we no longer have excuse to endorse such a writing .. so don't.

The book of Enoch lied .. 

There is no longer any excuse.

 

 

I read the book of Enoch I think 2 or 3 times and find it fantastic reading (and maybe gives some insight to some of the beliefs ages ago) but never elevated it to scripture - some churches do.  But in all that time, and I skimmed it again, I do not find the fate of Enoch.  Can you point out where it said he never died?  Thanks.

[NConly]

If Jack and Jane and Sally and Bill asked there dad if they can go to the store and Jane says I want to go to the little shoe shop across the street from the store, dad says ok you can go.  Later mom comes in and says where are the kids and dad says they went to the store.

in the beginning of the story Enoch was separated from the all die.

 

[Serving]

14 minutes ago, tim_from_pa said:

I read the book of Enoch I think 2 or 3 times and find it fantastic reading (and maybe gives some insight to some of the beliefs ages ago) but never elevated it to scripture - some churches do.  But in all that time, and I skimmed it again, I do not find the fate of Enoch.  Can you point out where it said he never died?  Thanks.

Sure ..

2 Enoch

1a The story of Enoch: how the Lord took him to heaven.

 

[TrueFollowerOfChrist]

I think Genesis 5:24 & Hebrews 11:5 makes it clear that Enoch DIDN'T die but went to heaven alive. As far as the "book" of Enoch, I have looked at it myself and I don't understand why anyone would think it's true. The stories in it are very strange and fictional. It's clearly a false book with no basis in reality. 

[Serving]

2 hours ago, tim_from_pa said:

I read the book of Enoch I think 2 or 3 times and find it fantastic reading (and maybe gives some insight to some of the beliefs ages ago) but never elevated it to scripture - some churches do.  But in all that time, and I skimmed it again, I do not find the fate of Enoch.  Can you point out where it said he never died?  Thanks.

(sorry) .. And here :

36 |God commanded Enoch to live on the earth for 30 days, to impart knowledge to his sons and to his children’s children. After 30 days he was taken up to heaven once more. Word “32.”|

That was when Enoch was supposedly taken to heaven the 2nd time .. then he comes and goes again within the same chapter .. nowhere did he die during these processes nor anywhere else in the book of Enoch.

Edited December 17, 2023 by Serving
oops

[Mr. M]

39 minutes ago, Serving said:

 

Nice dodge. I have never read the book,

so I am quite certain that I hold no belief based on what is written therein.

I simply asked:

1 hour ago, Mr. M said:

Is there a particular commonly held doctrine of Christianity

that is supported solely by this book, which should be discredited and rejected?

For which you posted...

 

41 minutes ago, Serving said:

This post is about what is not supported.

Which is not an answer. 

What makes the book a heresy?

If your only point is to question whether or not 

Enoch died, you should begin with YOUR definition of:

"not seeing death", and "God translating him."

5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death;

and was not found, because God had translated him:

for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.