The Whole Scope And Scale Of Christianity

[Neighbor]

9 hours ago, NConly said:

You may be right but Ill hold my opinion that to be a son one must believe they only need Jesus and what he taught to be sons of God. If one feels they need the old law to supplement Jesus then imo they are servants still.

If one needs a supplement to Jesus is that complete acceptance ?

Hi, Interesting statement and question. One that made me think of the prodigal son, as well as the absolutely perfect obedience to His Father without flaw of The Son whom would be found at temple and participating in every required feast.

The covenant of Moses as well as the Abrahamic Covenant is vital to the grace of the New Covenant. Without the Law there would be no teacher no understanding  of sin  and sin could indeed abound under grace.

Christianity is not isolated from previous covenants, nor is it necessarily the final covenant of God.

[NConly]

3 hours ago, Neighbor said:

The covenant of Moses as well as the Abrahamic Covenant is vital to the grace of the New Covenant.

If this is tue then Gentiles can not be saved they were never under the law ever.

Rom 7

4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.

6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

I can not see one disregarding these verses and about 50 or 60 more that say the same thing.

[Neighbor]

37 minutes ago, NConly said:

If this is tue then Gentiles can not be saved they were never under the law ever.

Hi, I do not see that  as being so, for the grace of the New Covenant  recognizes the law of Moses Covenant that taught us of sin and it's penalty death. The New Covenant  provides Gentile and Jew alike with salvation from the just wrath of God the Father. The New Covenant bought and brought to fruition by the shed blood of God the Son Yeshua has no foundation to set upon without the previous reveal  of and by Abrahamic and Mosaic Covenants. There is nether Jew nor Gentile in the New Covenant.

[NConly]

1 hour ago, Neighbor said:

Hi, I do not see that  as being so, for the grace of the New Covenant  recognizes the law of Moses Covenant that taught us of sin and it's penalty death. The New Covenant  provides Gentile and Jew alike with salvation from the just wrath of God the Father. The New Covenant bought and brought to fruition by the shed blood of God the Son Yeshua has no foundation to set upon without the previous reveal  of and by Abrahamic and Mosaic Covenants. There is nether Jew nor Gentile in the New Covenant.

 The Abrahamic Covenant was about Faith so yes the new covenant was built after that fashion. The old covenant was not of faith and in many verses it is said to be replaced and done away with and abolished and growing old and fades away. mean it is not part of the New covenant that would not be like the one God made with the Fathers.

If you like I can post all the verses that say the old is done away. Of course it is plain in the

Rom 7

4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

In other words one can not be married to the new covenant and have an affair with

the old covenant.

[farouk]

2 minutes ago, NConly said:

 The Abrahamic Covenant was about Faith so yes the new covenant was built after that fashion. The old covenant was not of faith and in many verses it is said to be replaced and done away with and abolished and growing old and fades away. mean it is not part of the New covenant that would not be like the one God made with the Fathers.

If you like I can post all the verses that say the old is done away. Of course it is plain in the

Rom 7

4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

In other words one can not be married to the new covenant and have an affair with

the old covenant.

@NConly In line with your comments about the Old versus the New, the Epistle to the Hebrews shows in an outstanding and amazing way just how much better - a keyword - Christ is than anything that went before or indeed ever could be.

[NConly]

5 minutes ago, farouk said:

@NConly In line with your comments about the Old versus the New, the Epistle to the Hebrews shows in an outstanding and amazing way just how much better - a keyword - Christ is than anything that went before or indeed ever could be.

I agree like Heb 7:12

12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

Gal 4:9

9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

[farouk]

1 minute ago, NConly said:

I agree like Heb 7:12

12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

Gal 4:9

9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

@NConly Indeed; and it's amazing also how many ppl either don't grasp this or else - while professing NT doctrine - find themselves drawn back to a legalistic mindset.

[NConly]

2 minutes ago, farouk said:

@NConly Indeed; and it's amazing also how many ppl either don't grasp this or else - while professing NT doctrine - find themselves drawn back to a legalistic mindset.

It is laid out in the new testament if one wants to find it and it is pretty clear.

John 15:10

10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Hear and several other place in the new testament Jesus could have easily in 3 years

Have simply said keep the old Ten commandments But he Never said that even in John 15:10 it is clear. Jesus spoke all the commandments a new covenant believer needs to be saved.

[farouk]

19 minutes ago, NConly said:

It is laid out in the new testament if one wants to find it and it is pretty clear.

John 15:10

10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Hear and several other place in the new testament Jesus could have easily in 3 years

Have simply said keep the old Ten commandments But he Never said that even in John 15:10 it is clear. Jesus spoke all the commandments a new covenant believer needs to be saved.

@NConly Similarly in Romans Paul speaks of 'the obedience of faith' and 'obedience to the faith' that the true believer in Christ in principle follows.