Eating air leaves you empty.

[Starise]

45 minutes ago, NConly said:

There are a couple dozen verses that say the old law is done away with , not used , abolished. There are verses that state one must follow the whole law not a part they want to follow. And yet we have people saying they follow NC and the old law mixed.

I can not grasp how people want to mix the old and new law when I see not one verse that says to mix them and not one verse that says pick the part of the old law you want to follow no need to follow whole law anymore. just saying

Some of the things Paul wrote I need to read over several times to grok.

In essence, yes I agree. This is really a pretty deep discussion though, because it spills over into lots of things one person thinks are insignificant and the other think it is. Both say they have bible for it.

At the base, we are no longer under Mosaic law. But getting further into this, some (both denominations and individuals) are, to use this term loosely, legalistic.

They make a gift from Jesus into a set of do's and don'ts. 

Have you ever felt as if you were doing ok until someone comes along with a ruler telling everyone how off we all are? A legalist who likes to tell us there is one or more areas we need to specifically do a thing that's either no longer required or something they just made up.

 

[PATrobas]

Gal 2:16  Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

James 2:10  For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

These two verses pretty well sum it up for me.

[NConly]

1 hour ago, Starise said:

Some of the things Paul wrote I need to read over several times to grok.

In essence, yes I agree. This is really a pretty deep discussion though, because it spills over into lots of things one person thinks are insignificant and the other think it is. Both say they have bible for it.

At the base, we are no longer under Mosaic law. But getting further into this, some (both denominations and individuals) are, to use this term loosely, legalistic.

They make a gift from Jesus into a set of do's and don'ts. 

Have you ever felt as if you were doing ok until someone comes along with a ruler telling everyone how off we all are? A legalist who likes to tell us there is one or more areas we need to specifically do a thing that's either no longer required or something they just made up.

 

Stranger in a strange land was a very good sci-fi novel. I do not recall saying anyone has to change their beliefs I said I can not grasp How they believe it because in the several conversations I have had no one provided verses,  I have not seen verses for both sides. I would like some one to show verses that say

following only part of old law is ok

mix old and new law is ok

[Marathoner]

1 hour ago, Starise said:

Some of the things Paul wrote I need to read over several times to grok.

In essence, yes I agree. This is really a pretty deep discussion though, because it spills over into lots of things one person thinks are insignificant and the other think it is. Both say they have bible for it.

At the base, we are no longer under Mosaic law. But getting further into this, some (both denominations and individuals) are, to use this term loosely, legalistic.

They make a gift from Jesus into a set of do's and don'ts. 

Have you ever felt as if you were doing ok until someone comes along with a ruler telling everyone how off we all are? A legalist who likes to tell us there is one or more areas we need to specifically do a thing that's either no longer required or something they just made up.

 

I turned away from the "legalism" conceptualization because, in truth, what we are considering is a lack of faith in the Lord. The Son of God is not trusted to teach and correct His beloved (a promise that the Lord Himself has made), so man must rely upon a system of absolutes to direct his path. In the absence of such religion --- it assumes the appearance of godliness --- lawlessness surely must prevail! This is why one invariably comes along to rebuke any who fail to meet their lofty expectations. A wonderful example of this very thing was furnished to us in the 15th chapter of Acts. 

This might prove to be controversial, brother, but here's the truth: there is a defiled religion that functions as a cargo cult, and then there is that faith delivered to the saints by the Lord. The cargo cult clings to systems of absolutes and cannot fathom that liberty which accompanies the Spirit (the natural man is incapable of such a thing); those who cling to the Holy Spirit and trust in Jesus Christ are vexed by cargo cultists with their incessant demands and hollow displays of piety. The young in faith (and the vulnerable) are preyed upon by those who simply cannot trust in the Lord. There is a passage of scripture which describes the devotees of that cargo cult:

There is a kind of person who curses his father
And does not bless his mother.
There is a kind who is pure in his own eyes,
Yet is not washed from his filthiness.
There is a kind—oh how lofty are his eyes!
And his eyelids are raised in arrogance.
There is a kind of person whose teeth are like swords
And his jaw teeth like knives,
To devour the poor from the earth
And the needy from among mankind.
(Proverbs 30:11-14 NASB)

[Starise]

25 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

I turned away from the "legalism" conceptualization because, in truth, what we are considering is a lack of faith in the Lord. The Son of God is not trusted to teach and correct His beloved (a promise that the Lord Himself has made), so man must rely upon a system of absolutes to direct his path. In the absence of such religion --- it assumes the appearance of godliness --- lawlessness surely must prevail! This is why one invariably comes along to rebuke any who fail to meet their lofty expectations. A wonderful example of this very thing was furnished to us in the 15th chapter of Acts. 

This might prove to be controversial, brother, but here's the truth: there is a defiled religion that functions as a cargo cult, and then there is that faith delivered to the saints by the Lord. The cargo cult clings to systems of absolutes and cannot fathom that liberty which accompanies the Spirit (the natural man is incapable of such a thing); those who cling to the Holy Spirit and trust in Jesus Christ are vexed by cargo cultists with their incessant demands and hollow displays of piety. The young in faith (and the vulnerable) are preyed upon by those who simply cannot trust in the Lord. There is a passage of scripture which describes the devotees of that cargo cult:

There is a kind of person who curses his father
And does not bless his mother.
There is a kind who is pure in his own eyes,
Yet is not washed from his filthiness.
There is a kind—oh how lofty are his eyes!
And his eyelids are raised in arrogance.
There is a kind of person whose teeth are like swords
And his jaw teeth like knives,
To devour the poor from the earth
And the needy from among mankind.
(Proverbs 30:11-14 NASB)

Good words brother.

We are told to be holy as He is holy. I believe some read far more into that that the original intent.

[farouk]

35 minutes ago, NConly said:

Stranger in a strange land was a very good sci-fi novel. I do not recall saying anyone has to change their beliefs I said I can not grasp How they believe it because in the several conversations I have had no one provided verses,  I have not seen verses for both sides. I would like some one to show verses that say

following only part of old law is ok

mix old and new law is ok

@NConly I never read that one; was it good?

I'm kind of hesitating as to whether sci-fi is a book genre that I like.

(Mind you, Bunyan's The Pilgrim's Progress is rather allegorical..........)

[NConly]

31 minutes ago, farouk said:

@NConly I never read that one; was it good?

I'm kind of hesitating as to whether sci-fi is a book genre that I like.

(Mind you, Bunyan's The Pilgrim's Progress is rather allegorical..........)

I did like it however it is not what prefer. I am more of a Jack London, Louis L'Amour type

[farouk]

1 minute ago, NConly said:

I did like it however it is not what prefer. I am more of a Jack London, Louis L'Amour type

@NConly I never read 'The Call of the Wild;, though maybe I should...... It's more kind of realistic, I think, rather than other-wordly.........

[MelodyCat]

PATrobas, certainly that was food for thought.  Praise the Lord for providing us spiritual bread. 

You know I have met many people who believe in the Lord & even in Jesus & His finished work on the Cross.  I do not judge their salvation.  I have seen the Spirit of the Lord mature these people in Christ.  They get teaching BUT I have found they do not personally read the Bible.  Spoon fed Toddlers not those who can go & get a meal for themselves by reading His Word daily.

I am no Legalist but we eat bread or food daily.  I have tried to encourage them to pick up a bible & read, start with the gospels & go onto Acts, read a psalm.  Has not yet worked.  There is some blockage here & I just pray for them to be given the desire & ability by our Heavenly Father to pick up their bibles & read His word.  They are capable, they are literate.

Lord once gain I ask remove the hindrances to all who are Yours but do not read their bibles for themselves, give them a hunger for Your Spiritual Bread, amen.

 

[PATrobas]

4 hours ago, NConly said:

Stranger in a strange land was a very good sci-fi novel. I do not recall saying anyone has to change their beliefs I said I can not grasp How they believe it because in the several conversations I have had no one provided verses,  I have not seen verses for both sides. I would like some one to show verses that say

following only part of old law is ok

mix old and new law is ok

Besides the 2 verses I quoted above I'll add this:

Mrk 2:22  And no man putteth new wine into old bottles: else the new wine doth burst the bottles, and the wine is spilled, and the bottles will be marred: but new wine must be put into new bottles.

Speaking of mixing old with new. Blessings.