Tongues what do you think? (MERGED TOPIC)

[Mark777]

Everyone,

I have looked at Tah's list and this is what I can surmise from it:

1. The only description give in Scripture explaining what tongues are is that they are earthly languages.

2. Only some believers receive that gift.

3. It is a lesser gift.

Is there anything I am missing Scripturally or that anyone would like to point out?

Mark

[tah]

Did you read 1cor:13?

[Mark777]

Yes, Tah, I did.

I assume you are referring to, "though I speak with the tongues of men and angels..."

Paul is using a series of exaggerated actions to show how important love is. But I ask you

1. Can a man understand all mysteries and all knowledge?

2. Do you know anyone that has removed mountains with their faith?

3. Do you know anyone who has given all their goods to feed the poor?

4. Do you know anyone that has given their body to be burned?

The answers to these questions are usually "no".

Speaking with the tongues of angels isn't said to be possible. It is an exaggeration to prove the point that EVEN IF you could speak with the tongues of angels and did not have love what would it get you. And it is telling that such a thing is only ever mentioned in this passage.

Mark

[tah]

Sounds like you have a pretty solid opinion on it...

I am not the one to try convince you otherwise..

You know the scripture and your mind is set ...

Are you doubting what you believe about the gift of tongues?

[Mark777]

I just find it interesting. For me, something has to be proven biblically for me to see its value.

In my part of the country Pentecostal churches are common . So I have been presented with this issue many times. So, when given the opportunity, I always see what others say about it. You never know, someone else might show you something you have never seen before. I discuss it to spur that possibility. I learned a long time ago that I am nothing - God is everthing.

Mark

[tah]

Well then.

Col 1:9 For this cause we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to desire that ye might be filled with the knowledge of his will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding;

Col 1:10 That ye might walk worthy of the Lord unto all pleasing, being fruitful in every good work, and increasing in the knowledge of God;

Col 1:11 Strengthened with all might, according to his glorious power, unto all patience and longsuffering with joyfulness;

Col 1:12 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:

[Mark777]

Tah,

I understand these verses as referring to what is possible for believers while 1 Cor 13 is using exaggerations to prove a point. While it is true that believers can be"...filled with the knowledge of his will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding" that is different from understanding all mysteries and knowledge- as in Cor 13 - you would have to be God to do so.

The same for verse 9, it is possible to increase in knowlegde but not to have all knowlege. For instance, we can never know what it is like to be in two places at once but God can. Knowledge is infinite like God - it is an attribute of God's - we are finite creature.

Verse 11 - "all might" is not referring to "all of might". It is an expression of power but not meant to imply God's complete might.

Do you see how Paul is using, in Cor 13, a way of exaggeration. He is saying that EVEN IF you knew everything and had all knowledge and did not have love you wouldn't be anything? It would not be effective if he had said, "if you know something and have not love it doesn't matter". See the emphasis is because of the exaggeration.

Mark

Edited May 23, 2006 by Mark777

[tah]

Mark..do you believe Jesus was able to do these things?

I do..and I believe we have that same Holy Spirit in us that rose Christ Jesus from the dead..

all things are possible in Him...

[Mark777]

Tah,

It is not possible for a man - other than Jesus - to know all things.

It may be possible but very rare that any human could or would do the other things mentioned in 1Cor 13. But that is just the point. The high unlikeliness of these things give the juxtapostion that was intended.

It is like Paul saying,

"Even if I could jump tall buildings with a single bound and did not have love what would it profit me?"

or

"If I could beat Babe Ruth's home run record and did not have love what would it profit me?"

I might be able to, if I was talented enough, beat Babe's record but the high unlikeliness of it is the exaggeration that shows - no matter what you do or what you are if you do not have love it is nothing.

Speaking with the tongues of angels is an exaggeration along those lines. Its impossible or highly unlikely (IMHO.)

Mark

[tah]

And Mark, if that is what you believe then you believe it..

I differ in my opinion what God can do and does..