Latter Rain/MSOG heresies in our pews?

[anitarose]

River Revival I know that a lot of River imagry is used. We have a 'river image' that is part of the identity of our city. (Well all of Niagara is water-imaged to the max) This comes up a lot and I think is tied to the "in the river" theology of the "blessings movements". It is also often used for the cleansing imagery

I have a real problem with this one...I attend THE RIVER AT TAMPA BAY CHURCH......We strongly believe in the Bible and are working on planning tent REVIVALS all over the country....

I know that what you are talking about is different than the above but it is all Scriptural...if you have questions please reference www.revival.com.

I believe very strongly that the Former and Latter Rain is coming....and I hope that no one attacks my beliefs on this board...because I wouldn't DARE attack any one else's.....

Anita

[darski]

If you choose to believe that sin-filled man can indeed become as a god and save Jesus the trip to come and establish the Kingdom on earth - have at it.

I hear they are adding 8 new lanes to the "Wide Way"". 16 lanes, no waiting

[anitarose]

If you choose to believe that sin-filled man can indeed become as a god and save Jesus the trip to come and establish the Kingdom on earth - have at it.

I hear they are adding 8 new lanes to the "Wide Way"". 16 lanes, no waiting

Here's the thing: I DON'T believe that. I know what the Bible says about it. We don't receive glorified bodies until we are resurrected---either through Rapture or death.

Honestly I do believe that this is something that the Bible talks about in Matthew 24:10-14--"And then many shall be offended and shall betray one another and shall hate one another, (11) And many false prophets shall rise and shall deceive many. (12) And because iniquity(sin) shall abound the love of many shall wax cold. (13)But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. (14) And this gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come."

Here's the bottom line. If you think what you believe is wrong, ask God. He will be the one to tell you, NOT MAN. Our responsibility is to respond in love to everything---whether good or bad--- and I for one am not going to tell you what YOU should believe, nor do I expect YOU to tell ME what to believe. God is the ultimate arbitrator here. Don't trust in man's wisdom because it will defeat you in the end. Trust God and believe that He is and who He sends He will.

Hope I have made my position clear. GBU all....love you ALL in the Lord Jesus Christ who loves us all forever.

Anita

[nebula]

Matthew 24:10-14--"And then many shall be offended and shall betray one another and shall hate one another, . . . ."

Good point.

[LadyRaven]

As far as the website (revival.com), I haven't seen anything dangerous based on what is listed. I might disagree with the applications of some of it (i'm a modified cessationist for one thing), but that's fine at least at this point. What I'm concerned about is the attitude that nobody can tell you that you are wrong. What if something heretical WAS being taught (and as I say I've seen nothing to this point), why wouldn't you want it pointed out? I find that attitude very dangerous.

While we do need to "be kind" to each other, we are all still supposed to remain teachable and also remain accountable for what we believe. There are times where we can disagree on some things (like the method and mode of baptism or whether dispensationalism or covenantalism is the right way to see the NT) there are some times where we cannot allow disagreement because the doctrine has run aground into heresy. I do know that I personally would want to know if I was slipping into falsehood, and I'm sure everyone else who loves God does too.

What was listed as beliefs was also very small. What has been said on this thread about the water and rivers and whatnot has also been very limited. therefore I can't make a determination as to whether that particular aspect of that belief is heretical or not. As with WOF and MTG, there are things they teach which are not heretical. They usually have very biblical views on marriage, for example, and on Christian love, and on charity. This river thing could be one of those types of things, where the part is not a problem. The MSOG, however, does appear to be heretical as a whole system, just as the WOF and MGT systems are.

I hope for the sake of that church on revival.com that they are not completely sunk in to all of it, and that this river movement is just one of those non heretical things that was picked up out of the "trash" so to speak...

[darski]

There is a school of thought that says (from a sort of scriptural basis) take the good stuff and leave the bad behind.

So, I get a nice fresh glass of water and a packet of cyanide. I pour in the cyanide and stir it all together and offer you the glass to drink; telling you to take the good and leave the poison behind. Are you going to take the glass?

I mentioned at the beginning that each of these things seems innocent and even a good thing for Christians to be doing. the question arises as to whose agenda is being talked into being? Are people praying for God's blessing or are people praying that they will get a set-up in which they can assert power and authority? Where is this leading and so this is how innocent Christians get into this in the first place. I certainly did so and it was only because I take every question to God that I got information. Certian things did not add up and I prayed for understanding.

As a for instance, this was a big (citywide/clerical) deal and many churches were committed to bringing this to fruition. Then ministries just dropped away. People(groups) who made commitments didn't keep them...pastors got involved in the needs of their own congregations... the children's ministry fell apart... etc. God called me to a ministry of intercession but He did not give me permission to attend the daily Prayer vigils. There was also the oppressive presence at the Harp and Bowl service

This sort of thing could be ascribed to satanic attack but we prayed against that and that didn't seem like it was what was going on. Through a series of incidents, God led me from one square to the next to show me how it all came together. I believe that all the supports are falling away because God is withdrawing people from the heresy.

Again, no one thing is a problem. They are a problem when they group together under these nefarious umbrellas.

I noticed that the Revival site said very little at all. Little devotionals that don't inform or insult... Dr Mc Gee calls them sermonettes for Christianettes. I did not see a statement of beliefs posted - could you tell me what that might be called? Different people call things by different words

This is so bad of me but I have a warped sense of humour... When I saw the pictues of all the ministry teams at Revival, my mind is saying "Stepford"!!!

[Floatingaxe]

Very sad, indeed.

[anitarose]

I noticed that the Revival site said very little at all. Little devotionals that don't inform or insult... Dr Mc Gee calls them sermonettes for Christianettes. I did not see a statement of beliefs posted - could you tell me what that might be called? Different people call things by different words

This is so bad of me but I have a warped sense of humour... When I saw the pictues of all the ministry teams at Revival, my mind is saying "Stepford"!!!

You didn't look under the heading of "What We Believe", did you? It lists everything that we Biblically believe...our statement....look to the right by Pastor Rodney and Adonica's picture and you will find it...

Or is that too hard?

Anita

[darski]

Thank you kindly for your help. I found it thanks!

[Rebmilc]

As I understand it the Latter Rain movement (LR) and the Manifest Sons of God (MSG) were condemned as heresies about 50 years ago especially by the Assemblies of God worldwide.

Over the last couple of decades they have re-surfaced in the Church under different names and are now prevelant within mainstream christianity, but still teaching the same old heresy i.e The deification of man, the emergence of SUPER APOSTLES and SUPER PROPHETS in the last days, and the teaching that the church will take over the world (Dominionism) and that Jesus cannot return untill we do. Also the teaching of a worldwide super revival that will sweep millions into the kingdom of God which is in direct opposition to what the NT teaches.

Without Naming names you only have to watch the God channel on a daily basis to to see the success of the movement today. One famous tv evangelist with a worldwide following made the outrageous statement that in a one to one conversation with God, the Lord told him that he (the evangelist) could have atoned for the sin of the world.

God help us to see the (LR) and (MSG) movement for what it is (Heresy) and combat it before it's to late.