Worthy News: Haggard issues apology - Washington Times

[Guest shiloh357]

Well to refer back to my earlier response I made, I am saying that a hypocrite sees himself as an exception to the rules he sets for other people. If Ted Haggard saw nothing wrong with his actions, yet would hold someone else in contempt for doing the same thing, he would be a hypocrite.

Most Christians believe lusting is a sin. Committing lust in the full knowledge that lust is a sin, is not hypocrisy. The hypocrisy would be in feeling that it is not a sin for YOU to lust, while considering someone else a pervert for doing the same thing.

[nebula]

Here's the tricky thing - where do you draw the line between the weakness of sin and hypocracy?

[Guest shiloh357]

Here's the tricky thing - where do you draw the line between the weakness of sin and hypocracy?

Hypocrisy is a word that is thrown around so much, that people have lost sight of what it really means. Hypocrisy is not simply violoating your own moral code. It is not simply failing to live up to your own standards.

Hypocrisy is when sin is sin for everyone else but you. It is when the rules are different for you.

People confuse hypocrisy with being "two-faced," and that is not what it means.

Ted Haggard never claimed that what he did was okay, and he knew that what he did was wrong even when he did it. Hence the attempt to cover it up. If he had seen the rules as not applicable to himself, he would have erected an entire logical platform to justify his actions to explain why what he did was not really wrong, but still wrong if committed by someone else.

[Marnie]

Well, according to my trusty dictionary, a hypocrite:

1. a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess, esp. a person whose actions belie stated beliefs.

2. a person who feigns some desirable or publicly approved attitude, esp. one whose private life, opinions, or statements belie his or her public statements.

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[Origin: 1175

[Guest shiloh357]

Well, according to my trusty dictionary, a hypocrite:

1. a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess, esp. a person whose actions belie stated beliefs.

2. a person who feigns some desirable or publicly approved attitude, esp. one whose private life, opinions, or statements belie his or her public statements.

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[Origin: 1175

[Marnie]

Hypocrisy works manifests itself, not as merely falling into a sin one previously decried, but amounts a pretentious form self-righteousness. Hypocrisy causes me to ignore in myself, the very things I might condemn in you.

Well, you are proving my point! Here's a man who preached one way and lived another; the very definition of a hypocrite.

[nebula]

So let's take this to the next step.

Paul admitted to doing things he knew were wrong (Romans 7). So did that make him a hypocrite?

[ajesuschrist_mathetes]

Does no one understand and/or have experiential knowledge of the indescribably vicious spiritual war we are in?

I think I have a hint of it.

I've had threads locked on christian sites for confessing my sin.

I've known people who were so confused and mixed up as to sing amazing grace on sunday, but sacrifice animals to the devil on monday.

So yeah, I think its somewhat forming a picture of what christians face.

In the "having problems/need advice" forum, people are usually condemned and chased right out of the thread when they come in there seeking prayer and advice, and according to some, if someone has a sinful habit, it MUST be because they "aren't trying hard enough' or "don't have enough faith".

From the Scriptures, the devil/Satan/unclean spirits/spirits of antichrist... have feelings,wills,fear,... Can they or can they not repent? Will the devil allow lower-level spirits to repent? Hope that if anyone is seriously interested in the Ted Haggard issue they carefully read his and his wife's words in the beliefnet article I posted.

Get Peck's "Glimpses of the Devil" as a starter, but time sure seems to me way too late for looking into these things. A book published in 2005-"A Fractured Mind:my life with multiple personality disorder" by Robert B. Oxnam. Under psychiatric care for many years [he is world famous, brilliant]-did not know he had 11 different personalities. Each of the personalities has a personality. Efforts to "fuse" the personalities. He tried suicide in 2004-whatever "he" means.

To me, way too much evil for humanity to have to endure. I personally am suffering demonic attack pretty much 24/7-had intensified several years ago. So close to giving up [actually did give up several years ago and The Lord Jesus Christ is keeping "me" going] when all my suffering has me lash out at my brothers and sisters in Christ.

http://www.beliefnet.com/story/42/story_4278_1.html

...

During that exorcism, the priest said, the demon mocked the pope, saying, "Not even your [church] head can send me away."

"This is a case where the possession is very, very strong," said Father Amorth, founder and president of the International Association of Exorcists.

"From what can be foreseen by us exorcists, it will take years of exorcisms" for the girl to be fully cured, he said.

...

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What if the enemy refuses to obey? What if the enemy refuses to obey God?

Edited November 9, 2006 by ajesuschrist_mathetes

[Guest shiloh357]

Hypocrisy works manifests itself, not as merely falling into a sin one previously decried, but amounts a pretentious form self-righteousness. Hypocrisy causes me to ignore in myself, the very things I might condemn in you.

Well, you are proving my point! Here's a man who preached one way and lived another; the very definition of a hypocrite.

No, because you are failing to account for the rest of it. The definition the dictionary offers is not wholly incorrect; it simply does not go far enough. I said he lived in pretentious self-righteousness that feigns a form of "righteousness" that only applies to himeself.

The dictionary definition is not without merit, but Jesus used the word differently. He used the word to describe the person who was more concerned about someone'e else's sin while ignoring his own sin.

Haggard is a disgrace, he is a sinner, he is a really bad role model, but that does not make him a hypocrite. Haggard says he knew when he was sinning that it was sin. That by itself disqualifies him as a hypocrite.

[Guest shiloh357]

So let's take this to the next step.

Paul admitted to doing things he knew were wrong (Romans 7). So did that make him a hypocrite?

No, a hypocrite is someone who does not see the sin he commits, as sin. A hypocrite would see it as sin for YOU, but not for him. He sees himself as the exception to the rules he sets for others. He ignores in his life, the very things that he would condemn in you.