Uncleanness of Childbirth

[Openly Curious]

The midwives who did not kill the male children born to the "Hebrew" woman as Pharaoh had instructed them to do in the book of Exodus. Whenever Pharaoh had called them to him to inquire why hadn't they been killing the male children off when they gave birth. The midwives said because the Hebrew women are not like us but they are "lively" woman and before we can even get in their to them ere they already done delivered their babies. And because these woman feared God and didn't kill the Hebrew's male children at birth God gave them favor and houses were given to them to dwell in. This is found in Exodus 1:15-21 (vs19)

OC

[Spunky]

The midwives who did not kill the male children born to the "Hebrew" woman as Pharaoh had instructed them to do in the book of Exodus. Whenever Pharaoh had called them to him to inquire why hadn't they been killing the male children off when they gave birth. The midwives said because the Hebrew women are not like us but they are "lively" woman and before we can even get in their to them ere they already done delivered their babies. And because these woman feared God and didn't kill the Hebrew's male children at birth God gave them favor and houses were given to them to dwell in. This is found in Exodus 1:15-21 (vs19)

OC

Yes however Exodus 1:17 shows us the midwives feared God so they did not

do as the King of Egypt told them to do, it does not say that the hebrew women

that were giving birth actualy were having quick and painless births, they just

gave that as the excuse as to why they had not been killing the Hebrew male

babies they were ordered to.

Atleast thats how I read it!

God Bless!

but still doesn't answer my original question

[Openly Curious]

Over in Leviticus 15:19-33 it gives good insight about all the seperation of the woman with and issue of blood.

In verses 31

"Thus shall ye separate the children of Israel from their uncleanness that they die not in their uncleanness when they defile my tabernacle that is among them."

Well I think the "why" is in this verse here. And that why is because as long as a woman was having an issue of blood of any kind it most defiantly was unsanitary as Candi770 brought up earlier and certainly this text in Leviticus 15-19-33 show that for sure when you read it. And if these woman went into the tabernacle during these times of uncleanness in them touching the things in the tabernacle then all those things in which they touched would be contaminated and made unclean as well.

The tabernacle was Holy and where the blood sacrifices were made for the atonement of the people at the place where the Spirit of the Lord dwelt in the Holy of holies behind the veil. It was God's house and he did not want his tabernacle to be defiled by those that were unclean. So all that had things within them that made them unclean had to go through times of seperation according to the laws that God set for them and according to the amount of time God set for them to go through until their uncleanness in their flesh was gone and they could return to temple worship once again as the priest would then make atonement for them.

God knew how long each uncleanness would take and He in his wisdom set those time limits up not just for the uncleannesses of the woman but all other kinds of uncleannes as well. And when they time of seperation was up the priest made atonement and they could return to the tabernacle to worship God and fellowship with others in the outer court and all that went on at the tabernacle.

So it was really all about God's house the tabernacle and not letting the uncleanness of the people contaiminate His Holy tabernacle and defile it. Cause they would die in their uncleanness if they did not go through the time of seperation that was appointed by God till your uncleanness in flesh was gone. God's house his tabernacle was to be reverenced and not defiled or contaminated by the uncleanness of man's flesh.

Well I must say I have been tremendously enlightened and blessed by this thread tonight. It started out as a head scratcher for sure now it is bursting with reverence to a Holy God who is so much wiser than we ourselves. Thank God for his blood that washed away all our uncleannesses and sins.

OC

[Spunky]

Okay I totaly understand the being unclean and not being

allowed to enter the tabernacle and all, and the fact that there

are laws set for the unclean period what I'm looking for is why

the difference in the unclean period given for having a male

child vs having a female child. Is there any where in the Bible

that gives the explanation as to the difference.

Like the woman is unclean for double the time with a female

child than a male because___________.

Like for example if the blood flow were to actualy last longer after

having a female child I would totaly understand the difference.

God Bless!

[Openly Curious]

According to Leviticus 12:2-4

If the woman gave birth to a male child the woman was unclean for seven days. which this was the normal monthly menustral cycle a woman goes through it varies from usually 1 to 7 days but God allowed seven days for this uncleanness (Leviticus 15:19).

On the eighth day the male child was to be circumcised as his foreskin had to be cut off as this was a sign showing a distinction or difference between the Jewish people from all the other nations in the earth a sign of cleanness. And those whom are circumcised are in reality more cleaner than those who are not circumcised. But this was to be done to the male children on the 8th day as a sign.

After this the woman then had to continue in the blood of her purifying that lasted for 33 days because her issue went beyond the normal seven days according to Leviticus 15:25.

A woman during this time also would have other fluid flowing from her body such as breast milk. As it mentioned or said it like this in Leviticus 15:19a "And if a woman have an issue, "and" her issue in her flesh be blood" this indicates that other running issues could also be a factor in being in this time of uncleanness as well besides the issue of blood.

It could be this time was shorter for the male child because of the circumcision of their flesh that had to be done as a sign of seperation to God to show a distinction on the 8th day.

According to Leviticus 12:5 if the child was a girl then the woman was unclean for two weeks not just seven days for her normal menustral cycle but it is doubled 2 weeks to cover her daughter which ties into 1 Corinthians 7:14b that talks about our children being sanctified or holy because of the believing parents. So the time was doubled because of the daughter to be a covering for the girl child so she could be holy through this purification process. Because the girl child once again could not be circumcised in the flesh and made clean except through this time of seperation given by God.

The believing parents then would obey God and circumcise the male child and it would be made holy it would be sanctified and the woman would for the daughter would go through double time of seperation in order to sanctify or make holy the daughter as the girl child once again could not be made clean through circumcision.

that is why

loving blessings

OC

[darski]

Yeah, what Spunky said.

I agree with God's goodness being shown by His care of us in even little matters but it doesn't explain the male and female thing.

Let's try the opposite side of my original supposition. It was to be through the seed of the woman that Satan would be crushed. This extra call to cleansing could be a foreshadowing of that as well as a looking back to Eve's sin. There is that strange bit about salvation and childbirth.

I think this continues to be a headscratcher unless someone can find one place where God's will is clearly presented for this issue (issue... issue of blood )

[Openly Curious]

Yeah, what Spunky said.

I agree with God's goodness being shown by His care of us in even little matters but it doesn't explain the male and female thing.

Let's try the opposite side of my original supposition. It was to be through the seed of the woman that Satan would be crushed. This extra call to cleansing could be a foreshadowing of that as well as a looking back to Eve's sin. There is that strange bit about salvation and childbirth.

I think this continues to be a headscratcher unless someone can find one place where God's will is clearly presented for this issue (issue... issue of blood )

Not when you understand that Jesus was the Saviour of the world. And recieving him into our hearts and lives we are as you know "Born again" hence the new birth. We also know that it was that awful "issue of blood" that made it possible for us to be born again birthed into the family of God.

Circumcision as I tried to point out under the law could only be done to the male children and how they were made clean "outwardly in the flesh" a work of their hands they were required by God to do under the law and yes this was a "Sign" as I also said. (Romans 2:25-3:8 hope you read)

Again the extra call as you call it was "because" a woman could not outwardly be circumcised in the flesh under the "law" wasn't possible. So the mother had to purify her daughter in order to make her clean under the law by carrying our her purification for her cause the child could not do it on their own. That was God's provision for the girl child under the law.

Note God made provision for both male and female at birth in order to make them clean so they could enter the tabernacle to worship God.

Even Mary and Joseph took Jesus to be circumcised at the temple on the eighth day in

Luke 2:21-35 which is a very good read in light of the discussion. But they was a man at the temple that day called Simeon and it said he was waiting on the consolation of Israel and the Spirit came on him. As the Lord made it known to him that he wouldn't see death until he had seen the Lord Jesus Christ.

And the Spirit then lead Simeon into the temple just when Mary and Joseph was bringing Jesus to be circumcised on the eighth day to do according to the custom of the law. And he took Jesus in his arms and blessed God saying Lord now lettest thy servant depart in peace according to thy word for mine eyes have seen thy salvation which thou hast prepared before the face of all people a light to lighten the Gentiles and the "glory" of thy people Israel.

It took the cross to bring salvation to the world and now the circumsion is by the work of God through the work that He sent His only begotten Son into the world to do. That circumcision is still being done to hearts to day. As Christ has made provision for men and women to be circumcised in the flesh. For it is a circumcision of the foreskins of our hearts as he takes our stony hearts away and gives us a heart of flesh that can feel and be conscious towards God. And on that fleshly heart he writes his laws in our hearts no longer in tablets of stone.

That "issue of blood" that ran down on Golgotha's hill made both men and women clean as our hearts were circumcised inwardly by God himself and not by the works of the law where they had to take a literal knife and cut that foreskin of the males away in order to be clean a work of their hands. But it was that issue of blood that washed away our sins and made us a new creature in Christ as the foreskins of the hearts of men and woman today can be cut away and done away with making them clean the work of our Saviour not made with hands.

I don't know what else to say on this subject but i have been blessed thus far. I just know our purification now is through the cross and not through the provisions of the law now. And it's the cross I glory in as a woman because what couldn't be done as a woman under the law has been done to me through the work of my Lord Jesus Christ as he circumcised me cut away the foreskin of my heart and give me a heart of flesh with his laws written on it. This is a blessing when you realize that as a woman under the law it was not possible for us to be circumcised in the flesh to have the foreskin cut off. But through our Lord woman and men can be circumcised inwardly that of the heart.

i hope ya'll ain't picking on a po ole lonely woman

loving blessings

OC

[darski]

I am thinking that as a woman myself I can make theological jokes about 'women's stuff'.

The fact that Jesus paid the atoning Blood Sacrifice still doesn't explain this difference. You can know that you are forgiven and still not understand why it was "more unclean?" to have a female child. We do know that God has a good reason for all that He does. It would have been nice it this had been explained somewhere.

[Spunky]

OC,

I do find your previous post very compelling and I thank you for

taking time to contimplate the matter seriously. Just as in the Old

Testiment they sacraficed animals to God, but because of Jesus's

sacrafice and His blood shed for us we are nolonger required to

sacrafice animals to God because Jesus's blood is enough. Using

this line of thought helps me grasp what your previous reply implies.

God Bless!

[Openly Curious]

I am thinking that as a woman myself I can make theological jokes about 'women's stuff'.

The fact that Jesus paid the atoning Blood Sacrifice still doesn't explain this difference. You can know that you are forgiven and still not understand why it was "more unclean?" to have a female child. We do know that God has a good reason for all that He does. It would have been nice it this had been explained somewhere.

I encourage a good sense of humor the world would be dull with out it for sure. As for me I have never had children of my own so I can't really relate to the stuff concerning childbirth as those that have had the actual experience of it as I'm sure they can see even more humor to use and have regarding these things while I might not get the inside joke not having gone through it.

I don't really think that it was "more unclean" to have a female child. I think that is more of your preception of it you actually are thinking and believing it was. Nowhere in scriptures do we read that it was more unclean to have a female child. God does not look down on a woman as less of a person than a male. This purification and seperation time was not a punishment of any kind it was a time of cleansing the uncleanness outwardly of the flesh. There were according to your uncleanness different amounts and length of time set until the said uncleanness was passed in your flesh. Some took longer than others to get rid of.

Especially things like leprosy their time of seperation was pretty long time and sometimes in this uncleanness in their flesh wasn't cleared up they would have to be put permanently out of the camp in order to protect others from being contaminated by the uncleanness of leprosy. That was not a punishment to be mean or look down on those who had the uncleanness of leprosy but they had to be quaranteen in order to keep it from spreading.

All that I have said may not satisfy your mind on the why but the mother of the female child did her purification time for her uncleanness in the flesh. But also did her own daughter's purification and time of seperation time for her as again a woman could not be made "clean" in the flesh "outwardly" for it was "not" possible because women cannot be circumcised in their flesh isn't possibe. So that is why the 66 days regarding a female child it was not a punishment of any kind whatsoever nor a slight on women making them any less than a male child.

But the little girl child was covered those extra 33 days was for the girl child because a girl child once again could not be "circumcised" in the flesh outwardly for it was not possible so other means for the girl child to be make clean outwardly was this 66 days of purifiaction and seperation that made the mother and girl child clean outwardly in the flesh once this time was over. Not punishment but provision.

Take comfort in these words "Women shall be saved "through" child bearing."

But don't just look naturally but spiritually as apostle Paul is using natural things to explain the spiritual things hence the new birth that comes through Christ who bore us.

OC