Questions about healing

[St. John]

St. John:

Reinhard Bonnke, apostle to Africa, raised up by God to confirm His Word with signs following! I love those pictures of the masses who are saved, healed, and delivered (wholeness) and filled with the Spirit of God.

The theology (so-called) that says healing passed with the first century are missing the river of God. However, some extremes in the faith-healing movement are destroying credibility in biblical, divine healing for our non-charismatic brethern.

This thread is about Tatie. Let us persist with her to see Jehovah-rapha (the Lord who heals) bring peace and healing into her life. Let us resist the works of the enemy. Perhaps those who are against healing for today could start a debate elsewhere. I want to build her faith up, not undermine it with a preconceived theology.

I agree with you. I never wanted this to be a debate. I don't understand why anyone would come in here and try to talk a person out of their healing. Tatie needs blessing and uplifting words of love and encouragement.

Tatie, if there were no other words in the bible for which you could believe that God wants to heal you, but this one verse, it would be enough. That verse is "Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth." Mark 9:23

All things are possible. Well that would include healing, would it not? If you can believe? Well, of course we can believe. Believing is not a hard thing to do. Especially when it comes to our God. Do we ever have any good reason to doubt Him. No. The devil is the author of doubt, and when those words of doubt and fear enter your head, don't let then take seed in your heart. The bible says to cast down imaginations and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God. And bring every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ.

In other words when worries and fears pop into your head and it is contrary to the word of God, then you know it is of the devil. Then you cast them down and out of your head. Don't let them take root in your heart. And then replace those thought with God's thoughts. Renew your mind by the word of God.

... whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.Philippians 4:8.

Just a simple "No devil you are a liar. Lord Jesus, I bring those thoughts into captivity, and I replace them with your word. Thank you Jesus "your word says 'by whose stripes we were healed'" "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me. And no matter what, I believe your word, O God, and I will worship you with all the love in my heart.

[wordsower]

Thank you again, wordsower! But what about these verses:

1Co 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

1Co 11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.

1Co 11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

1Co 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

Tatie,

I'm so sorry I have been away all week, I am working 50 hours a week right now and I am exhausted when I get home so forgive me, I should have tracked the topic and responded to you.

I want you to study and get the revelation for yourself. I believe the Lord is healing you for His glory as a witness to all on this board and everywhere.

Healing resulting from:

intercession: Num. 12:10-15

repentance: 1 Kin. 13:1-6

Prayer: James 5:14,15

Faith: Mat. 9:20-22, John 4:46-53

God's Word: Ps. 107:20

Power of Healing belongs to God Gen. 20:17,18

Possesed by Jesus Matt. 4:24, Matt. 8:16

Given to Apostles Matt. 10:1-8

Given as a gift 1 Cor. 12:9

Eternal in heaven Rev. 22:2

Source of Healing only God Jer. 17:14

Through Christ Is. 53:5

Through the Gospel Ezek. 47:8-11

Provided for:

Heartbroken Ps. 147:3

Repentant 2Chr. 7:14

Faithful Mal. 4:2

Necessary because of man's

Sin--Ps. 41:4

Backsliding--Jer. 3:22

Spiritual sickness--Is. 6:10

Moral looseness Prov. 7:22-27

Wickedness Ps. 55:23

Disease 1 Sam. 5:6-12

Injury Luke 10:30

Debauchery Titus 1:12

Print these out and study. There are a lot of verses stating that sickness is caused by our own sin. Not saying that applies to you, don't get me wrong, but that is what examining ourselves is about. There may be some hidden source that you haven't dealt with from your childhood that you are not over and subconsciously it is still there and pain-mental or otherwise is damaging to the immune system. How is your diet? I heard a report the other day of a man with cancer given 1 year to live and he changed his diet to all natural, organic fruits and vegetables and was completely healed with no trace of cancer. Juicing is good to remove toxins from our bodies, and also green tea has been proven to prevent cancer.

Tatie, I am believing and praying for you sister, bless you, just believe that you are healed! Jesus was beaten 39 times and they say all diseases originate from 39 basic diseases. God knew what He was doing! He has plans to bless you!! Be encouraged!

[The Journey]

St.John,

I guess all those verses I posted were not the Word of God.

I know how you think and feel because I was one time in a Church that actively practiced all the gifts of the Spirit. I remember telling a friend in another religion I knew my religion was right because I saw all these miracles and healing, etc etc. But down inside I had my doubts. Many of those "healed" died. Many of those "healed" received surgery and chemoTX and radiationTX and now were cancer free. They were repeatidly held up as examples that the gift of healing was still in force today. I began to look around and realize that I wasn't seeing the type of organic diseases being healed that the Master could heal. Mainly what I saw was people with problems of daily living being healed and re-healed. I didn't se any of the other miracles like a person being raised from the dead. This and other things (like continuing revelation and prophesies that were continually not fulfilled or that contradicted each other) finally led me to freedom from all that garbage.

Here is the bottom line. In order for you to continue to believe that God heals everyone you must shut your eyes to reality. Inside you know that believers around you get sick and die. You may even get a disease that is never healed. But you will continue to hold onto a few verses that taken out of context seem to prove divine health. You will hold onto Old Covenant promises made to Israel about divine health and the law. But inside you will know the Truth. I pray that one day you have the strength and integrity to to a stand for the complete Word of God, open your eyes and walk free in the sunshine of Truth and reality.

Till then, Peace Brother.

- Steve

[The Journey]

How is your diet? I heard a report the other day of a man with cancer given 1 year to live and he changed his diet to all natural, organic fruits and vegetables and was completely healed with no trace of cancer. Juicing is good to remove toxins from our bodies, and also green tea has been proven to prevent cancer.

Jesus was beaten 39 times and they say all diseases originate from 39 basic diseases.

Outstanding post!!!

Absolutely right regarding vegetables, juicing and green teas!!!

Hmmm I have never heard the 39 disease thing. I will have to spend some time pondering pathophysiology and see how many basic etilogies that I can come up with. Just off the top of my head I would say most disease orginate from multiple break downs in body physiology and that there is usually not one inciting event. Even getting the FLU takes multiple body system failures before that virus can take hold.

Very nice post. I will "steal" all those healing Scriptures to use in an upcoming lesson.

- Steve

[St. John]

St.John,

I guess all those verses I posted were not the Word of God.

I know how you think and feel because I was one time in a Church that actively practiced all the gifts of the Spirit.  I remember telling a friend in another religion I knew my religion was right because I saw all these miracles and healing, etc etc.  But down inside I had my doubts.  Many of those "healed" died.  Many of those "healed" received surgery and chemoTX and radiationTX and now were cancer free.  They were repeatidly held up as examples that the gift of healing was still in force today.  I began to look around and realize that I wasn't seeing the type of organic diseases being healed that the Master could heal.  Mainly what I saw was people with problems of daily living being healed and re-healed.  I didn't se any of the other miracles like a person being raised from the dead.  This and other things (like continuing revelation and prophesies that were continually not fulfilled or that contradicted each other)  finally led me to freedom from all that garbage.

Here is the bottom line.  In order for you to continue to believe that God heals everyone you must shut your eyes to reality.  Inside you know that believers around you get sick and die.  You may even get a disease that is never healed.  But you will continue to hold onto a few verses that taken out of context seem to prove divine health.  You will hold onto Old Covenant promises made to Israel about divine health and the law.  But inside you will know the Truth.  I pray that one day you have the strength and integrity to to a stand for the complete Word of God, open your eyes and walk free in the sunshine of Truth and reality.

Till then, Peace Brother.

- Steve

I did not say God heals everyone. I said that it is God's will that all are healed. There is a difference. Remember in Jesus home town. He went there with the same healing power in which He healed ALL who were sick and diseased, but He COULDN"T do it there, because of THEIR UNBELIEF. Yes there are roadblocks to healing, but you know what? None of them are God's fault. He is the healer. We have access to that healing. We are either healed or not, but it is never God's fault. Jesus already did it. Now it is up to us.

And you falsely assume that I shut my eyes to reality. I don't bu t I do walk by faith and not by sight. Maybe you have forgotten how to do that, but I have not. And healing verses are not taken out of context. You could do yourself a favor and look at healing in the context of the whole bible, from Genisis to Revelation. Then you can come and tell me where someone went to God, with faith and was not healed. Ok?

[His son]

St.John,

I guess all those verses I posted were not the Word of God.

I know how you think and feel because I was one time in a Church that actively practiced all the gifts of the Spirit. I remember telling a friend in another religion I knew my religion was right because I saw all these miracles and healing, etc etc. But down inside I had my doubts. Many of those "healed" died. Many of those "healed" received surgery and chemoTX and radiationTX and now were cancer free. They were repeatidly held up as examples that the gift of healing was still in force today. I began to look around and realize that I wasn't seeing the type of organic diseases being healed that the Master could heal. Mainly what I saw was people with problems of daily living being healed and re-healed. I didn't se any of the other miracles like a person being raised from the dead. This and other things (like continuing revelation and prophesies that were continually not fulfilled or that contradicted each other) finally led me to freedom from all that garbage.

Here is the bottom line. In order for you to continue to believe that God heals everyone you must shut your eyes to reality. Inside you know that believers around you get sick and die. You may even get a disease that is never healed. But you will continue to hold onto a few verses that taken out of context seem to prove divine health. You will hold onto Old Covenant promises made to Israel about divine health and the law. But inside you will know the Truth. I pray that one day you have the strength and integrity to to a stand for the complete Word of God, open your eyes and walk free in the sunshine of Truth and reality.

Till then, Peace Brother.

- Steve

This is pretty sad, by his/her own admission they began to doubt. I have had instant healing in my body, and then let doubt set in and I lost it. I have had three others that because of the other I didn't let satan get to first base whith the doubt, so this man would call that garbage, well I tell you for sure it is very real, and I would be dilighted to stand in front of The Lord Jesus with anyone who says it isn't. I have also been prayed for for things that aren't healed yet, but The Holy Spirit told me they would be a proccess.

Tatie don't let anyone tell you that God will, not, nor can not heal you. You seek His answer on this, He will tell you one way or another, but by all means don't take the word of any of us, until it agrees whith what God tells you.

[godrulz]

I absolutely believe in divine healing. Word-Faith type teachings reduce it to formulas, rather than relationship. The warfare we are in is complex, not simple. God's sovereignty and will are a factor along with man's free will and demonic free agency. To indict God's will is simplistic; to shift the blame on the sick lacks compassion and does not properly exegete the Word. We are in a fallen world and will not fully experience freedom from this war zone until we are in His presence with glorified bodies. In the mean time, He can and does touch us physically, emotionally, and spiritually (wholeness).

Seek the Healer and search your heart. Job's 'comforters' were rebuked by God for assuming things were from the hand of God when they were not, and blaming Job for his sinfulness when God said He was righteous and not to blame for his misfortune (yet was corrected on some of his thinking). Let us love the sick and not foist guilt or questionable theological extremes on them.

[IslandRose]

Wow. Amen, Godrulz!

IR :t:

[Guest glorytothelord]

Last Sunday, when I printed my email lesson from my pastor which I have been receiving regularly now for about 3 years, I got a shock when he told us he had cancer, and the lessons would probably be ceasing at the end of December. He asked for prayer, which he natually received, from people all over the world, who take part in his lessons. He was to have more tests this week. To the praise of God, his bone scan was clear and there is no evidence that that the cancer has spread.

In this week's lesson, the last sentence was " before you go to sleep, turn your problems over to God, He's going to be up all night"

Blessings to you all,

Glory.

[Tatie]

Hi, everybody, I managed to fly home yesterday in the blizzard! It was a miracle. I loved the hospital where I was, they are really great, I will be flying there for treatements every month, and take some medicine while I am at home. I thank God for this cancer center, it is a blessing to have found it.

As for the question if God heals everybody, I believe the simple answer is yes. Obviously not everyone is healed. Why? that's the 64,000 question to which we should seek the answer to. But I don't think it's God saying I will not cure this one. I believe in "ask and you shall receive".

The sick need that hope and belief that God heals all sick. Maybe we are too hung up on physical healing? I do tend to believe that all healing is spiritual first. Can we say God doesn't heal ALL spiritually? No. So maybe we should seek the spiritual healing first, and then the phisical will come? I don't know, I don't have the answers, I am only searching for them. All I know, that the people I saw in the hospital, that's all they have - the prayer for healing and faith that God will heal them. I wouldn't take it away from them. You have to be there to see those people who were told by more that one hospital "there is nothing to be done for them any more". All they have is hope that this hospital has something that others didn't and faith that God will heal them.