150,000 People are Dying Every Day...

[Believers Battlecry]

Jesus Counsels the Rich Young Ruler (Matt 19:16-22)NKJV

16 Now behold, one came and said to Him,

[Kabowd]

Mate, we don't feed the poor, disciple, or do any of these other things as a means for reaching a goal - we do them because they are good in and of themselves.

Actually, shouldn't we do these things because we love?

(1 Cor. 13)

Of course, they are expressions of love. His point was that we don't do them in order to reach a goal or get anything in return. We should be motivated to do these things because we love God and love others. Not because we are trying to to manipulate them or gain something. God gets the glory when we do these things, whether they ever come to faith in Christ or not.

Does it concern you Kabowd that someone you know personally may die and go to Hell and you didn't talk to them about it because you didn't it was your job to speak to them out of love about their never-dying soul?

Does it concern you that approximately 40 million people are infected with HIV, and 5 people die from AIDS every minute? Does it concern you that approximately 15 million Americans can be classified as living below poverty level? We are not only called to care about those who are dying and their souls, but also those who are living and the quality of their living conditions.

I can't cure AIDS in the world, but we can teach abstinence. Most of the spread of AIDS is through illicit sex and IV drug use. We dont have the cure for AIDS, but we do have the cure for sin...the blood of Jesus Christ!!!

First, there are millions upon millions of people who contract AIDS by no direct fault of their own (for instance mother's who pass it to their children in utero). Secondly, however they contracted it..are they not suffering? Should we not seek to ease their suffering? Even if they contracted the disease via "illicit sex or drug use", does this mean we turn a deaf ear to their needs and leave them to die? Your response reveals a dualistic mindset that is sickening to those who are lost, and rightly so. They hear us "preach the gospel", tell them "God loves them" and judge them for their sinful behavior. But they don't see us living the gospel, loving them even in their depravity, and seeking to bring them hope and comfort. And we wonder why they get angry when we try to "evangelize" them?

[Believers Battlecry]

Who has said anything about "screaming at people to follow the word of God and repent " We must follow the direction of the Holy Spirit and bypass their intellect and speak directly to the conscience by using Gods Law. Dont categorize speaking to someone about Hell and their eternal soul with some fanatical dooms day prophet. I dont think you are being fair.

I follow this directive. As someone else pointed out, we are all called on to witness, we are not all called on to be evangelists, that is a special gift. Witnessing to someone without being led by the Holy Spirit does more harm than good, and you run the risk of building up a wall that may never come down for anyone else that trys to witness. I don't think anyone has said that you advocate screaming and yelling at people, but you are coming across as someone who thinks we should just go up to someone cold and start witnessing to them no matter what. You can't do that. In most cases, people will brand you as a nut, and again, you do damage that might be irreversible. Just telling someone you'll pray for them or some other polite statement will go more to plant a seed, and perhaps result in a sprout for someone else than anything else you can do. We try and take on too much sometimes thinking we are the be-all, end-all and forgetting that maybe we are just starting something that God is going to have someone else finish. . .

What if that person that you did not walk up to cold would get hit by a car and die in the next 5 minutes. Kowing that would you put off your fear and approach that person and share the love of Christ. Paul said we are to be instant in season and out of season.

[Kabowd]

Jesus Counsels the Rich Young Ruler (Matt 19:16-22)NKJV

16 Now behold, one came and said to Him,

[Kabowd]

Who has said anything about "screaming at people to follow the word of God and repent " We must follow the direction of the Holy Spirit and bypass their intellect and speak directly to the conscience by using Gods Law. Dont categorize speaking to someone about Hell and their eternal soul with some fanatical dooms day prophet. I dont think you are being fair.

I follow this directive. As someone else pointed out, we are all called on to witness, we are not all called on to be evangelists, that is a special gift. Witnessing to someone without being led by the Holy Spirit does more harm than good, and you run the risk of building up a wall that may never come down for anyone else that trys to witness. I don't think anyone has said that you advocate screaming and yelling at people, but you are coming across as someone who thinks we should just go up to someone cold and start witnessing to them no matter what. You can't do that. In most cases, people will brand you as a nut, and again, you do damage that might be irreversible. Just telling someone you'll pray for them or some other polite statement will go more to plant a seed, and perhaps result in a sprout for someone else than anything else you can do. We try and take on too much sometimes thinking we are the be-all, end-all and forgetting that maybe we are just starting something that God is going to have someone else finish. . .

What if that person that you did not walk up to cold would get hit by a car and die in the next 5 minutes. Kowing that would you put off your fear and approach that person and share the love of Christ. Paul said we are to be instant in season and out of season.

So God needs us to save people? He is completely dependent upon whether or not we evangelize?

[Believers Battlecry]

Who has said anything about "screaming at people to follow the word of God and repent " We must follow the direction of the Holy Spirit and bypass their intellect and speak directly to the conscience by using Gods Law. Dont categorize speaking to someone about Hell and their eternal soul with some fanatical dooms day prophet. I dont think you are being fair.

I follow this directive. As someone else pointed out, we are all called on to witness, we are not all called on to be evangelists, that is a special gift. Witnessing to someone without being led by the Holy Spirit does more harm than good, and you run the risk of building up a wall that may never come down for anyone else that trys to witness. I don't think anyone has said that you advocate screaming and yelling at people, but you are coming across as someone who thinks we should just go up to someone cold and start witnessing to them no matter what. You can't do that. In most cases, people will brand you as a nut, and again, you do damage that might be irreversible. Just telling someone you'll pray for them or some other polite statement will go more to plant a seed, and perhaps result in a sprout for someone else than anything else you can do. We try and take on too much sometimes thinking we are the be-all, end-all and forgetting that maybe we are just starting something that God is going to have someone else finish. . .

What if that person that you did not walk up to cold would get hit by a car and die in the next 5 minutes. Kowing that would you put off your fear and approach that person and share the love of Christ. Paul said we are to be instant in season and out of season.

So God needs us to save people? He is completely dependent upon whether or not we evangelize?

Jesus told his disciples to go into all the world and preach the gospel. We are His servants.

[eric]

I haven't read all of this thread yet but I am kinda getting the gist. I will just ask one question before I read the rest. Knowing full well the percntage of aids is almost out of control, and that there are thousands of people who are trying to help solve the problem and comfort those who have past the point of no return and combatting the spread to others.

Which is the most important, giving comfort to them from a humanitarian point of view or preaching the gospel so that they have a chance of learning the saving grace of our Lord. Is is better for them to die of aids and get new bodies free from sickness or cure them so they can aquire good health here on earth and finish up damned for all eternity.

Jesus said go into the world and preach the gospel not go and heal the physically or clinically sick. Okay I know, through the media, there are a lot of compassionate people who are working their butts of trying to help, and maybe God will bless them for their efforts, if they are doing it to give the glory to Him, and not to their own achievements.

I haven't posted this to try and be smart or out of any piety. Time marches on and and there are a lot of souls to be added to the kingdom and to me.......who hasn't done much, that only the spiritually healthy will see eternal life with Him.

Ponder before you jump on me.

[Oh Hamburgers!]

eric, I agree with your standing, it makes sense.

Naturally it would be better to have a bad earthly life but go to heaven, than to have a good earthly life but go to hell.

I guess the way I see it, is the best way to convert someone is to first try to help them in their current strife. If they are sick and dying on earth today, it would be a hard sell to get them to believe that there is a God out there who loves them. But if people attempt to heal them, and make their earthly lives more comfortable, they will be greatful, and will want to know what inspired us to go out of our way to help them. That is when you explain that you are doing it because of God's love for all people, and when they see that God's love inspired you to save them, they will be more inclined to believe and follow this loving God through your caring actions. Merely proclaiming the gospel won't necessarily mean people will listen or believe, you have to show them the good of God through actions in order to help them believe.

[apothanein kerdos]

Mate, we don't feed the poor, disciple, or do any of these other things as a means for reaching a goal - we do them because they are good in and of themselves.

Actually, shouldn't we do these things because we love?

(1 Cor. 13)

Eh, tomato tomahto.

We do these things out of love because they are good in and of themselves...I probably should have qualified that. I see where you're coming from though - too often we can fall into Plato's trap of doing something for its own sake without being able to justify such a belief, without being selfish at least.

Does it concern you Kabowd that someone you know personally may die and go to Hell and you didn't talk to them about it because you didn't it was your job to speak to them out of love about their never-dying soul?

Where did she say that? Where has anyone said we shouldn't witness?

I can't cure AIDS in the world, but we can teach abstinence. Most of the spread of AIDS is through illicit sex and IV drug use. We dont have the cure for AIDS, but we do have the cure for sin...the blood of Jesus Christ!!!

Actually, in Africa, the leading cause for HIV infection will soon be birth and rape.

Jesus told his disciples to go into all the world and preach the gospel. We are His servants.

He told us to also help the poor and the unwanted...and in that same command you are quoting, He put more emphasis on discipleship.

[nebula]

What is your suggesting for getting someone to lay down their pride?

Taking them through the 10 commandments.

I've heard of this approach. Although I do highly applaud this approach, please understand it is not a guarantee to break through someone's heart. (Just spend some time in the "Outer Court" section of the Board.) Then again, it also takes someone who is quick on their toes and creative in their words to break through other people's excuses. Not everyone is like this.

Truly, there is no "magic key" method for witnessing and evangelizing. Only the seed that is scattered on good soil will germinate and take root. So, you can, if you desire, throw your seed anywhere and everywhere hoping that the seed you scatter will fall on good soil. Or, you can learn to be sensitive to the leading of the Spirit, and under His leading surgically plant the seed in the good soil He shows you.

Do you understand?