When you are born again

[Phil.2:12]

Does a born-again believer in Jesus (many Christians are not born-again) retain his original sin nature (just a sinner saved by grace) or does he acquire the sinless nature of God, such as Adam had when he was created. What is your position and why do you believe in it.

[firehill]

Does a born-again believer in Jesus (many Christians are not born-again) retain his original sin nature (just a sinner saved by grace) or does he acquire the sinless nature of God, such as Adam had when he was created. What is your position and why do you believe in it.

At this point I don't believe in the doctrine of 'original sin.' There was an interesting thread here regarding the topic. I'm still working my understanding out and what I believe to be thus far, my 'indoctrination' of 'original sin.' The flesh is weak and Adam & Eve even needed Christ as anybody else to overcome the flesh. I understand though that we inherited death and the knowledge of good and evil.

[Millene]

To the topic of original sin: I think the Word is pretty clear ( see verses below). We are born dead in sin because of Adams sin. When we receive Christ, we receive the incorruptible seed, and our spirit comes alive. (1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.) We can then commune with God. He can begin to convict us of our sins and transform our lives, if we allow and if we listen. Some receive the incorruptible seed, but it lands on poor soil and never germinates (read the parable of the sower). As we allow God to work in us, our new man (our spirit which contains the incorruptible seed), grows and get's bigger than the old man (Adam - our flesh and our soul). We either eat from the Tree of Life which feeds our spirit, our we continue to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, which leads to death. So, I guess my answer would be yes, we do still have our Adam nature, but we should be crucifying him daily, in order that our new nature may thrive, and have an impact on this world.

(Rom 5:12) Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

(Rom 5:14) Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

(Rom 5:15) But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

(Rom 5:16) And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.

(Rom 5:17) For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)

(Rom 5:18) Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

(Rom 5:19) For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

(Rom 5:21) That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

[Millene]

We get a pretty good idea of how alive our sin nature is within us, when we practice spiritual disciplines such as fasting, praying, studying the Word, etc. Our sin nature will say to us "I don't feel like it." Being disciplined and crucifying our old nature, means doing it anyway, even when we don't "feel" like it. Eventually, "Adam" will quiet down within us and stop whining, when he realizes he is not going to get his own way, and we are not going to give in to our flesh.

[gypc]

Romans 8:1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

2For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

3For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

4That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

5For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

6For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

7Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

8So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

9But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

10And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

11But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

12Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.

13For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

14For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

First thing we've got to understand is our bodies are not born again that's why we crucify the flesh and bring it unto submission. Our spirit is born again and because we have the same Spirit in us that raised Christ from the dead we are now able to be led by the Spirit instead of the flesh. However for this to be accomplished we must have our faith totally on Christ and him crucified. What has happened over the years is a moving away from the cross of Christ and a leaning towards other methods of living right which actually makes the cross of Christ of none effect in our lives. These methods include our trusting and recieving psychology teachings of mans wisdom rather than the truth of God's word. Adding to or taking away from the Word of God creates an environment of losing the power of God in our lives. Many of us are finally coming to realize the simplicity of walking in the power of God.

1 Cor 1:17For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.

18For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

Once we get back to the cross, we will again have the power through the Holy Spirit that dwells in us to crucify the flesh and overcome sin. But that doesn't mean we will be without sin because we are still in this body and in need of denying ourselves and picking up our cross daily.

[Phil.2:12]

These posts are informative, but they are begging the question. I did not ask if man has a sinful nature, for (in Scripture) that is a given. What I'm looking for is the exchange of spiritual natures that is sometimes taught happens at the moment of conversion when one actually accepts Jesus as their Savior. After conversion, does one possess the sinless nature of God as Adam did (before the fall) or is the old sin nature still there making one "just a sinner saved by grace". You cannot be a "sinner" without the presence of the sin nature but you can sin when possessing the sinless nature of God (as Adam did). So, again, which nature do we have after accepting Jesus, the sin nature we got from Adam or the sinless nature of God.

Please do not look at this thread as a rehash of the "sin nature" arguement. It is asking a completely different question.

[gypc]

Gal 6:8(NIV)The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.

The KJV says flesh instead of sinful nature but the greek word here is Sarx which means human nature or sinful nature. Now Paul says "to please his sinful nature"......the word his in the greek is heh-ow-too....it is a word that claims ownership of whatever it is before.......so "his sinful nature" obviously means that nature still belongs to that person and must continually be dealt with.

[Openly Curious]

Does a born-again believer in Jesus (many Christians are not born-again) retain his original sin nature (just a sinner saved by grace) or does he acquire the sinless nature of God, such as Adam had when he was created. What is your position and why do you believe in it.

When one becomes born again they become set free from the old nature of sin as no longer a slave to the old nature and become made a partaker of the divine nature of God. But the thing is God does not make us a slave to His divine nature He imparted to us like Satan did in the beginning to the sin nature with all were born a slave to in bondage. But what God did was set us free from the sin nature. And with this freedom we have to freely choose which nature we want to serve the old man being our sin nature we were born with or the new man created in Christ Jesus the new creature. This is known as the war between the flesh and the Spirit that goes on within a believers life in Galatians 5.

We as born again believers still live in our fleshly bodies that is prone to sin as our fleshly sin nature likes sin and lusts after it that is why it is a fight and war but one day we will rid this old body of ours for a new one that is no longer subject to it.

But we have both natures living within us now being born again as many do not understand that we are a total new creature we are no longer the same creation as we were when we were born into this world within a fallen nature. But now we have the divine nature dwelling within us and we have a choose to yield ourselves to the Spirit and follow the things of God willingly by our own choice or we can willingly choose to follow the old sin nature we were born with.

But these two natures fight against one another within us as Satan is the Father of our old nature of sin as we inherited it because of what he did in the garden. But our Heavenly Father is the Father of the imparted divine nature within us the regenerated inner man so the battle is over your will in whom will you yield yourself unto as again God did not make us a slave to Him for we must choose Him willingly and freely of our own freewill as God set us free through His Son Jesus in order for us to make up our own minds in whom we want to serve the father of lies being Satan or the Father of all Truth in whom in no lies or shadow of turning in Him for He is the same yesterday today and forever.

That is why we are told in we walk in the Spirit we will not fulfill the lust of the flesh and if we walk in the Spirit there is no curse of the law.

If one yields to the flesh being the old sin nature we were born with that like sin then they snuff out the Spirit when doing so and this is going back up under the law because the sin nature cause us to be in bondage to it thus the law stands. But if we yield to the Spirit of God refusing the temptations of the old sin nature then the fruit of the Spirit will be brought forth in our lives and we are walking in freedom and their is no curse of the law as a result. Some of the sins of the sin nature are mentioned in the word for example fits of rage and if I resist these temptations to go off in a tantrum and yield to the Spirit then instead of the work of Satan being done in my life and people being hurt in my fit of rage then the fruit of the Spirit will be present if I resist and don't do the devil's will there will be love instead of hate patience instead of a short fuse there will be temperance and joy all the peaceable fruits of righteousness which are the fruits of the Spirit the divine imparted nature in us coming forth and there is no law or curse the law only comes into play when we live according to the old man the old nature of sin still in us that satan is the father of and we do not want to do the will of satan in our lives but to walk in the Spirit so that we will have fruit unto everlasting life instead of have the unfruitful works of darkness which is fruit unto death. We got to be a good tree and bear the fruits of the Spirit instead of being a bad tree and bearing the fruit unto death.

So yes we have two natures within us

oc

[gypc]

So yes we have two natures within us

oc

Yep

[EricH]

So yes we have two natures within us

oc

Yep

Agreed. Sanctification is an ongoing process