Adam's Responsibility?

[firehill]

Well it looks like we can conclude that Adam had no stated responsiblity toward Eve. . . other than to love her.

Don't you folks get it. When God called out in the garden after they fell from grace He called out for Adam not Eve. He ask Adam what He had done first not Eve and it was only after Adam tried to sherk the blame that God turned to the woman. Adam alone was responsible for keeping order in the garden. Gen 3:17 And unto Adam He said "Because you have listoned to the voice to of your wife and have eaten of the tree of which I commanded you saying,' You shall not eat of it.- There is not one shread of biblical evidance that God ever commanded Eve personally not to eat the fruit. Which makes Adam responsible.

Hey, where did God say to Adam, 'You shall not eat it'? God said, He said, (Eve said, God said too...) so show me where the event is recorded.

WHOAPS! Sorry Ovedya, God told Adam 4 times, and Eve at least twice that we know of.

[Ovedya]

He told Adam ALONE first. Then after He told Adam alone, He told them together, 1;29, and Eve's testimony.

...

He told Adam first, then both of them, and then both of them again.

Now He told them three times??!!

Genesis 1:29 is not the commandment!

You are beginning to frustrate me.

1. Three times to Adam.

2. Twice to Eve.

3. You're understanding what I'm, saying. Hurray. Now what are you saying?

4. No one said that 1:29 is the commandment. We've been saying and have numerous times that the prohibiton not to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil is encompassed in 1:29, what they could eat because if what they could eat had seed then what they couldn't eat couldn't of had seed.

5. I don't need to know that I'm beginning to frustrate you. Respectfuly, please, take that up with yourself. And next time you get frustrated with me and feel the need to let me know or that's it's necessary that I know then at least pm me in private. There's no need to publicly display your feelings of frustration over me.

This is precisely the source of my frustration, firehill. You and others here are adding to the Word of God something that simply is not there, in order to support a deconstructionist view of the Bible. God told Adam three times and Eve twice. Not only is that unsupported by any Scriptural evidence, it is completely absurd. Your argument had gone so far off into left field simply to support an inconsequential point, that it's ventured into the realm of ridiculousness. Honestly I can hardly take this conversation seriously anymore.

So I'm just going to leave this thread, and you to the delusion which you've constructed for yourself.

[firehill]

This is precisely the source of my frustration, firehill. You and others here are adding to the Word of God something that simply is not there, in order to support a deconstructionist view of the Bible. God told Adam three times and Eve twice. Not only is that unsupported by any Scriptural evidence, it is completely absurd. Your argument had gone so far off into left field simply to support an inconsequential point, that it's ventured into the realm of ridiculousness. Honestly I can hardly take this conversation seriously anymore.

So I'm just going to leave this thread, and you to the delusion which you've constructed for yourself.

What's actualy absurd is taking scripture (Eve's testimony) and just throwing it out the window. That is where the argument begins and you know it.

Thanks for joining though.

[OopsMartin]

One area that has not been researched is the account of Ananias and Sapphira. If the man was responsible because he was male, then Sapphira would have never even been questioned. Yet, she was and she was punished for agreeing together with her husband. Each was responsible.

This follows along with all the teaching throughout Scripture where each individual is responsible for their own sins, for the consequences of their own beliefs. We cannot say soandso told me to do it so it's his/her fault. We cannot say that the pastor/leader/father/husband/etc. told me to do it so they bear the responsibility and I get off the hook. If we do it then we agree with them even if we think we are obeying an authority who is responsible. Even believing that alone won't get anyone off the hook for doing wrong.

Bottom line, we have no reason anywhere in Scripture that directs us to believe that a husband is responsible for the good or bad actions of his wife, including Adam.

[methinkshe]

One area that has not been researched is the account of Ananias and Sapphira. If the man was responsible because he was male, then Sapphira would have never even been questioned. Yet, she was and she was punished for agreeing together with her husband. Each was responsible.

This follows along with all the teaching throughout Scripture where each individual is responsible for their own sins, for the consequences of their own beliefs. We cannot say soandso told me to do it so it's his/her fault. We cannot say that the pastor/leader/father/husband/etc. told me to do it so they bear the responsibility and I get off the hook. If we do it then we agree with them even if we think we are obeying an authority who is responsible. Even believing that alone won't get anyone off the hook for doing wrong.

Bottom line, we have no reason anywhere in Scripture that directs us to believe that a husband is responsible for the good or bad actions of his wife, including Adam.

I don't think that anyone has argued that a husband is responsible for his wife's actions. He is responsible for her welfare, both physical and spiritual. That is a different matter entirely. I, as a mother, am responsible for my children's welfare, to keep them fed and clothed and with a roof over their head, for their education in the Lord, for their spiritual welfare, but I am not responsible for their actions. They answer to God for those.

Ruth

[OopsMartin]

One area that has not been researched is the account of Ananias and Sapphira. If the man was responsible because he was male, then Sapphira would have never even been questioned. Yet, she was and she was punished for agreeing together with her husband. Each was responsible.

This follows along with all the teaching throughout Scripture where each individual is responsible for their own sins, for the consequences of their own beliefs. We cannot say soandso told me to do it so it's his/her fault. We cannot say that the pastor/leader/father/husband/etc. told me to do it so they bear the responsibility and I get off the hook. If we do it then we agree with them even if we think we are obeying an authority who is responsible. Even believing that alone won't get anyone off the hook for doing wrong.

Bottom line, we have no reason anywhere in Scripture that directs us to believe that a husband is responsible for the good or bad actions of his wife, including Adam.

I don't think that anyone has argued that a husband is responsible for his wife's actions. He is responsible for her welfare, both physical and spiritual. That is a different matter entirely. I, as a mother, am responsible for my children's welfare, to keep them fed and clothed and with a roof over their head, for their education in the Lord, for their spiritual welfare, but I am not responsible for their actions. They answer to God for those.

Ruth

I agree with you Ruth that a husband is responsible for a wifes welfare; physical but not spiritual. God is responsible via the Holy Spirit for everyones spiritual welfare. Husbands are responsible to display godly actions and attitudes, as are wives.

Back to the thread's title. Arguing that Adam is responsible for Eve's sin is indeed arguing that Adam was supposedly responsible for Eve's actions. And as you can see, it isn't true. No one can be responsible for another's choices. We can be responsible for our own choices, including if they influence another. But each person will reap the effects of their choices no matter how they come to them, even if deceived.

[methinkshe]

One area that has not been researched is the account of Ananias and Sapphira. If the man was responsible because he was male, then Sapphira would have never even been questioned. Yet, she was and she was punished for agreeing together with her husband. Each was responsible.

This follows along with all the teaching throughout Scripture where each individual is responsible for their own sins, for the consequences of their own beliefs. We cannot say soandso told me to do it so it's his/her fault. We cannot say that the pastor/leader/father/husband/etc. told me to do it so they bear the responsibility and I get off the hook. If we do it then we agree with them even if we think we are obeying an authority who is responsible. Even believing that alone won't get anyone off the hook for doing wrong.

Bottom line, we have no reason anywhere in Scripture that directs us to believe that a husband is responsible for the good or bad actions of his wife, including Adam.

I don't think that anyone has argued that a husband is responsible for his wife's actions. He is responsible for her welfare, both physical and spiritual. That is a different matter entirely. I, as a mother, am responsible for my children's welfare, to keep them fed and clothed and with a roof over their head, for their education in the Lord, for their spiritual welfare, but I am not responsible for their actions. They answer to God for those.

Ruth

I agree with you Ruth that a husband is responsible for a wifes welfare; physical but not spiritual. God is responsible via the Holy Spirit for everyones spiritual welfare. Husbands are responsible to display godly actions and attitudes, as are wives.

Back to the thread's title. Arguing that Adam is responsible for Eve's sin is indeed arguing that Adam was supposedly responsible for Eve's actions. And as you can see, it isn't true. No one can be responsible for another's choices. We can be responsible for our own choices, including if they influence another. But each person will reap the effects of their choices no matter how they come to them, even if deceived.

Perhaps I have missed something, or perhaps you have read something that was never there, but I have not heard anyone on this thread attempt to argue that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin, if indeed Eve sinned. As far as I can tell, at the moment of judgment, sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve - she was deceived - but that is a different matter entirely from suggesting that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin - she didn't sin, she was deceived. Where on earth did you get the idea that anyone is arguing that Adam was reponsible for Eve's sin? According to the Bible she didn't sin - she was decieved, so how could Adam be responsible for that which she is not accused of?

Ruth

[OopsMartin]

Perhaps I have missed something, or perhaps you have read something that was never there, but I have not heard anyone on this thread attempt to argue that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin, if indeed Eve sinned. As far as I can tell, at the moment of judgment, sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve - she was deceived - but that is a different matter entirely from suggesting that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin - she didn't sin, she was deceived. Where on earth did you get the idea that anyone is arguing that Adam was reponsible for Eve's sin? According to the Bible she didn't sin - she was decieved, so how could Adam be responsible for that which she is not accused of?

Ruth

What was she deceived into doing?

[methinkshe]

Perhaps I have missed something, or perhaps you have read something that was never there, but I have not heard anyone on this thread attempt to argue that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin, if indeed Eve sinned. As far as I can tell, at the moment of judgment, sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve - she was deceived - but that is a different matter entirely from suggesting that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin - she didn't sin, she was deceived. Where on earth did you get the idea that anyone is arguing that Adam was reponsible for Eve's sin? According to the Bible she didn't sin - she was decieved, so how could Adam be responsible for that which she is not accused of?

Ruth

What was she deceived into doing?

You tell me. The Bible is pretty clear and I am sure you can read.

Ruth

[EricH]

One area that has not been researched is the account of Ananias and Sapphira. If the man was responsible because he was male, then Sapphira would have never even been questioned. Yet, she was and she was punished for agreeing together with her husband. Each was responsible.

This follows along with all the teaching throughout Scripture where each individual is responsible for their own sins, for the consequences of their own beliefs. We cannot say soandso told me to do it so it's his/her fault. We cannot say that the pastor/leader/father/husband/etc. told me to do it so they bear the responsibility and I get off the hook. If we do it then we agree with them even if we think we are obeying an authority who is responsible. Even believing that alone won't get anyone off the hook for doing wrong.

Bottom line, we have no reason anywhere in Scripture that directs us to believe that a husband is responsible for the good or bad actions of his wife, including Adam.

I don't think that anyone has argued that a husband is responsible for his wife's actions. He is responsible for her welfare, both physical and spiritual. That is a different matter entirely. I, as a mother, am responsible for my children's welfare, to keep them fed and clothed and with a roof over their head, for their education in the Lord, for their spiritual welfare, but I am not responsible for their actions. They answer to God for those.

Ruth

I agree with you Ruth that a husband is responsible for a wifes welfare; physical but not spiritual. God is responsible via the Holy Spirit for everyones spiritual welfare. Husbands are responsible to display godly actions and attitudes, as are wives.

Back to the thread's title. Arguing that Adam is responsible for Eve's sin is indeed arguing that Adam was supposedly responsible for Eve's actions. And as you can see, it isn't true. No one can be responsible for another's choices. We can be responsible for our own choices, including if they influence another. But each person will reap the effects of their choices no matter how they come to them, even if deceived.

Perhaps I have missed something, or perhaps you have read something that was never there, but I have not heard anyone on this thread attempt to argue that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin, if indeed Eve sinned. As far as I can tell, at the moment of judgment, sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve - she was deceived - but that is a different matter entirely from suggesting that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin - she didn't sin, she was deceived. Where on earth did you get the idea that anyone is arguing that Adam was reponsible for Eve's sin? According to the Bible she didn't sin - she was decieved, so how could Adam be responsible for that which she is not accused of?

Ruth

Actually Eve did both. She was deceived and fell into sin.

And Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and transgressed.

1 Timothy 2:14 HCSB

God held her personally responsible for both