Adam's Responsibility?

[OopsMartin]

Actually Eve did both. She was deceived and fell into sin.

And Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and transgressed.

1 Timothy 2:14 HCSB

God held her personally responsible for both

Yep....

[methinkshe]

One area that has not been researched is the account of Ananias and Sapphira. If the man was responsible because he was male, then Sapphira would have never even been questioned. Yet, she was and she was punished for agreeing together with her husband. Each was responsible.

This follows along with all the teaching throughout Scripture where each individual is responsible for their own sins, for the consequences of their own beliefs. We cannot say soandso told me to do it so it's his/her fault. We cannot say that the pastor/leader/father/husband/etc. told me to do it so they bear the responsibility and I get off the hook. If we do it then we agree with them even if we think we are obeying an authority who is responsible. Even believing that alone won't get anyone off the hook for doing wrong.

Bottom line, we have no reason anywhere in Scripture that directs us to believe that a husband is responsible for the good or bad actions of his wife, including Adam.

I don't think that anyone has argued that a husband is responsible for his wife's actions. He is responsible for her welfare, both physical and spiritual. That is a different matter entirely. I, as a mother, am responsible for my children's welfare, to keep them fed and clothed and with a roof over their head, for their education in the Lord, for their spiritual welfare, but I am not responsible for their actions. They answer to God for those.

Ruth

I agree with you Ruth that a husband is responsible for a wifes welfare; physical but not spiritual. God is responsible via the Holy Spirit for everyones spiritual welfare. Husbands are responsible to display godly actions and attitudes, as are wives.

Back to the thread's title. Arguing that Adam is responsible for Eve's sin is indeed arguing that Adam was supposedly responsible for Eve's actions. And as you can see, it isn't true. No one can be responsible for another's choices. We can be responsible for our own choices, including if they influence another. But each person will reap the effects of their choices no matter how they come to them, even if deceived.

Perhaps I have missed something, or perhaps you have read something that was never there, but I have not heard anyone on this thread attempt to argue that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin, if indeed Eve sinned. As far as I can tell, at the moment of judgment, sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve - she was deceived - but that is a different matter entirely from suggesting that Adam was responsible for Eve's sin - she didn't sin, she was deceived. Where on earth did you get the idea that anyone is arguing that Adam was reponsible for Eve's sin? According to the Bible she didn't sin - she was decieved, so how could Adam be responsible for that which she is not accused of?

Ruth

Actually Eve did both. She was deceived and fell into sin.

And Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and transgressed.

1 Timothy 2:14 HCSB

God held her personally responsible for both

Exactly so! But because deception came first in Eve's case, the first sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve.

Ruth

[OopsMartin]

Exactly so! But because deception came first in Eve's case, the first sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve.

Ruth

If that were so Eve wouldn't have suffered the consequences of her sin. But she did. Adam was responsible for sin entering into the rest of humanity because he sinned deliberately and knowingly.

[methinkshe]

Exactly so! But because deception came first in Eve's case, the first sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve.

Ruth

If that were so Eve wouldn't have suffered the consequences of her sin. But she did. Adam was responsible for sin entering into the rest of humanity because he sinned deliberately and knowingly.

How do you arrive at that conclusion? Eve was deceived and THEN sinned. Adam KNEW and then sinned. Both suffered the consequences of sin. The order and how sin occurred is important as Paul confirms in the NT verses that give you so much difficulty.

Ruth

[OopsMartin]

Exactly so! But because deception came first in Eve's case, the first sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve.

Ruth

If that were so Eve wouldn't have suffered the consequences of her sin. But she did. Adam was responsible for sin entering into the rest of humanity because he sinned deliberately and knowingly.

How do you arrive at that conclusion? Eve was deceived and THEN sinned. Adam KNEW and then sinned. Both suffered the consequences of sin. The order and how sin occurred is important as Paul confirms in the NT verses that give you so much difficulty.

Ruth

impute

[inhistime]

Exactly so! But because deception came first in Eve's case, the first sin was imputed to Adam and not to Eve.

Ruth

If that were so Eve wouldn't have suffered the consequences of her sin. But she did. Adam was responsible for sin entering into the rest of humanity because he sinned deliberately and knowingly.

How do you arrive at that conclusion? Eve was deceived and THEN sinned. Adam KNEW and then sinned. Both suffered the consequences of sin. The order and how sin occurred is important as Paul confirms in the NT verses that give you so much difficulty.

Ruth

Eve didn't bring rebellion into the world because she sinned in a deceived state. She was thoroughly deceived and believed at the time and no longer believed God that they would die if they ate of the fruit.

Adam on the other hand sinned in rebellion and his sin is the only sin that was brought into the world. We inherit rebellion from Adam and not Eve because only Adam ate of the fruit with the full knowledge that what God said was the truth. He knew the truth and ate anyway.

Eve died for her sin but she didn't bring rebellion because she didn't sin in rebellion. God has shown us through his word that he judges motives and there are degrees of punishment. God judged Adam's sin as more serious than Eve's because of Adam's knowledge. We know for certain that Adam was not deceived because God's word tells us that. We also know that God knew Adam's heart. If God said that Adam's sin brought sin into the world, we just need to believe that God judged his motives and God pronounced the sad judgment that was passed on to all of us.

The next thing that we need to know is that God can bring mercy for those who sin ignorantly and in unbelief. Paul claimed that mercy because he sinned ignorantly (1 Timothy 1). Eve received that mercy and through her came the Messiah. We can praise God everyday that he gives us mercy to those who don't deserve it. Jesus died for us and he is the righteous judge who judges the motives and the intent of each heart. All we can do is praise God that he is fair and a just judge.