Women pastors

[Smalcald]

Just passing on information. I have no intentions of trying to sway someones opinion about this issue. I doubt I have the power, only God through the Holy Spirit can reveal the true meaning of His word to those that are open.

Peace,

Amanda

Yep. As long as the Holy Spirit reveals what you want him to reveal everything is cool. Let's just not bother with that bad old sexist Bible since it really doesn't conform to your agenda. After all, the "true meaning" of His word has been revealed to you. Isn't that sort of like Manicheism?

sw

The bible isn't sexist. It doesn't say what you claim it does. Male domination is the agenda. So relax, sw. Tradition is an argument from nothing.

Of course it says what worm says it does, simply read what it says about who should be a Deacon, elder or Bishop and about the teaching authority of women. It says this NOT just in one passage, which if that was the case I would certainly look toward context, but it is a general theme expounded several times.

Like it or not Christianity is Patriarch in nature. God is spoken of as a male, Jesus is His Son, all of the Apostles are male, all of the prophets were male, Jewish society was patriarch, and was ordered by God to be so. There is just no way around it.

Of course scripture also says that men and women are equal in the eyes of God, that we are one in Him.

[HAZARD]

Being a teacher does not make one in authority over the one being taught.

If the preacher/teacher is female, and she is married, she will love and respect and obey her husband as he will her. He will love, guide, protect and praise her name and thank God for her for ever more! She may know more than her husband, as my wife or anothers may know more than we do, but she will not, and does not userp her husbands authority over her or their houshold. Another example;

If, lets say I am a divisional manager of a large corperation, As manager, know everything about the company business, and I am sent to the company organized yearly convention to be updated on the latest stratergy plan, and the speaker is a woman? sent by the corporate director of the said company, to teach me and others on what was required. As my teacher in this matter, would that give her authority over me a divisional manager?? No! All she knows is the latest stragerty of the company, and she is to pass that information on. And neither would she want authority over me and take on all my responsobilities. All she would be doing is tell me, preach to me, teach me and others of what is required and expected of me by the BOSS!

Put God in the bosses position, God sends who He will, and many are women, as Scripture shows in another thread on this board, which some men cannot come to grips with, to teach, preach, as is recorded in Scripture, DOES NOT MAKE THEM IN ANY WAY, IN AUTHORITY OVER MEN! God does not say they are in authority does He? GOD, through the apostles say women are not to be in authority, and neither do they want to be. If they can, and do teach men of the things of God, what is wrong with that, especially if God empowers them to do this?

[st. Worm]

Being a teacher does not make one in authority over the one being taught.

If the preacher/teacher is female, and she is married, she will love and respect and obey her husband as he will her. He will love, guide, protect and praise her name and thank God for her for ever more! She may know more than her husband, as my wife or anothers may know more than we do, but she will not, and does not userp her husbands authority over her or their houshold. Another example;

If, lets say I am a divisional manager of a large corperation, As manager, know everything about the company business, and I am sent to the company organized yearly convention to be updated on the latest stratergy plan, and the speaker is a woman? sent by the corporate director of the said company, to teach me and others on what was required. As my teacher in this matter, would that give her authority over me a divisional manager?? No! All she knows is the latest stragerty of the company, and she is to pass that information on. And neither would she want authority over me and take on all my responsobilities. All she would be doing is tell me, preach to me, teach me and others of what is required and expected of me by the BOSS!

Put God in the bosses position, God sends who He will, and many are women, as Scripture shows in another thread on this board, which some men cannot come to grips with, to teach, preach, as is recorded in Scripture, DOES NOT MAKE THEM IN ANY WAY, IN AUTHORITY OVER MEN! God does not say they are in authority does He? GOD, through the apostles say women are not to be in authority, and neither do they want to be. If they can, and do teach men of the things of God, what is wrong with that, especially if God empowers them to do this?

Its not much of a stretch to say teaching implies authority and teaching God's Word certainly acknowledges real authority. I just don't understand the pragmatic reasoning in this thread. Sure there are lots of women who are exercising authority within the church by teaching and they are not going away but that does not make what they are doing biblical either. There is no way you can divorce teaching from authority.

sw

[HAZARD]

Being a teacher does not make one in authority over the one being taught.

If the preacher/teacher is female, and she is married, she will love and respect and obey her husband as he will her. He will love, guide, protect and praise her name and thank God for her for ever more! She may know more than her husband, as my wife or anothers may know more than we do, but she will not, and does not userp her husbands authority over her or their houshold. Another example;

If, lets say I am a divisional manager of a large corperation, As manager, know everything about the company business, and I am sent to the company organized yearly convention to be updated on the latest stratergy plan, and the speaker is a woman? sent by the corporate director of the said company, to teach me and others on what was required. As my teacher in this matter, would that give her authority over me a divisional manager?? No! All she knows is the latest stragerty of the company, and she is to pass that information on. And neither would she want authority over me and take on all my responsobilities. All she would be doing is tell me, preach to me, teach me and others of what is required and expected of me by the BOSS!

Put God in the bosses position, God sends who He will, and many are women, as Scripture shows in another thread on this board, which some men cannot come to grips with, to teach, preach, as is recorded in Scripture, DOES NOT MAKE THEM IN ANY WAY, IN AUTHORITY OVER MEN! God does not say they are in authority does He? GOD, through the apostles say women are not to be in authority, and neither do they want to be. If they can, and do teach men of the things of God, what is wrong with that, especially if God empowers them to do this?

Its not much of a stretch to say teaching implies authority and teaching God's Word certainly acknowledges real authority. I just don't understand the pragmatic reasoning in this thread. Sure there are lots of women who are exercising authority within the church by teaching and they are not going away but that does not make what they are doing biblical either. There is no way you can divorce teaching from authority.

sw

Hi "Sw"

In Romans 16 we have Phebe, Priscilla, Mary Junia, Tryphosa, Persis, all female names, women mentioned as laborers in the gospel.

In Phil. 4:2-3 we have Euodias and Syntyche, two women who are mentioned as leaders in the local church at Philippi. They are refered to as "those WOMEN which labored with me in the Gospel."

Paul himself states many times these women laboured in the gospel with him. These women were teachers as was Paul, they taught along side Paul. Teachers, but there is never any mention of them ever being in authority over any men, or over Paul.

Being able to teach a man who knows nothing about God, all about God, does not give the teacher any authority over the man being taught.

If I were a Bible expert, male or female, and a King, or President of a powerful nation asked me to teach him about God, would that give me the authority to tell him what he can, should, or should not do?

[st. Worm]

Being a teacher does not make one in authority over the one being taught.

If the preacher/teacher is female, and she is married, she will love and respect and obey her husband as he will her. He will love, guide, protect and praise her name and thank God for her for ever more! She may know more than her husband, as my wife or anothers may know more than we do, but she will not, and does not userp her husbands authority over her or their houshold. Another example;

If, lets say I am a divisional manager of a large corperation, As manager, know everything about the company business, and I am sent to the company organized yearly convention to be updated on the latest stratergy plan, and the speaker is a woman? sent by the corporate director of the said company, to teach me and others on what was required. As my teacher in this matter, would that give her authority over me a divisional manager?? No! All she knows is the latest stragerty of the company, and she is to pass that information on. And neither would she want authority over me and take on all my responsobilities. All she would be doing is tell me, preach to me, teach me and others of what is required and expected of me by the BOSS!

Put God in the bosses position, God sends who He will, and many are women, as Scripture shows in another thread on this board, which some men cannot come to grips with, to teach, preach, as is recorded in Scripture, DOES NOT MAKE THEM IN ANY WAY, IN AUTHORITY OVER MEN! God does not say they are in authority does He? GOD, through the apostles say women are not to be in authority, and neither do they want to be. If they can, and do teach men of the things of God, what is wrong with that, especially if God empowers them to do this?

Its not much of a stretch to say teaching implies authority and teaching God's Word certainly acknowledges real authority. I just don't understand the pragmatic reasoning in this thread. Sure there are lots of women who are exercising authority within the church by teaching and they are not going away but that does not make what they are doing biblical either. There is no way you can divorce teaching from authority.

sw

Hi "Sw"

In Romans 16 we have Phebe, Priscilla, Mary Junia, Tryphosa, Persis, all female names, women mentioned as laborers in the gospel.

In Phil. 4:2-3 we have Euodias and Syntyche, two women who are mentioned as leaders in the local church at Philippi. They are refered to as "those WOMEN which labored with me in the Gospel."

Paul himself states many times these women laboured in the gospel with him. These women were teachers as was Paul, they taught along side Paul. Teachers, but there is never any mention of them ever being in authority over any men, or over Paul.

Being able to teach a man who knows nothing about God, all about God, does not give the teacher any authority over the man being taught.

If I were a Bible expert, male or female, and a King, or President of a powerful nation asked me to teach him about God, would that give me the authority to tell him what he can, should, or should not do?

Labored does not mean to teach.

sw

[rtwo]

Being a teacher does not make one in authority over the one being taught.

If the preacher/teacher is female, and she is married, she will love and respect and obey her husband as he will her. He will love, guide, protect and praise her name and thank God for her for ever more! She may know more than her husband, as my wife or anothers may know more than we do, but she will not, and does not userp her husbands authority over her or their houshold. Another example;

If, lets say I am a divisional manager of a large corperation, As manager, know everything about the company business, and I am sent to the company organized yearly convention to be updated on the latest stratergy plan, and the speaker is a woman? sent by the corporate director of the said company, to teach me and others on what was required. As my teacher in this matter, would that give her authority over me a divisional manager?? No! All she knows is the latest stragerty of the company, and she is to pass that information on. And neither would she want authority over me and take on all my responsobilities. All she would be doing is tell me, preach to me, teach me and others of what is required and expected of me by the BOSS!

Put God in the bosses position, God sends who He will, and many are women, as Scripture shows in another thread on this board, which some men cannot come to grips with, to teach, preach, as is recorded in Scripture, DOES NOT MAKE THEM IN ANY WAY, IN AUTHORITY OVER MEN! God does not say they are in authority does He? GOD, through the apostles say women are not to be in authority, and neither do they want to be. If they can, and do teach men of the things of God, what is wrong with that, especially if God empowers them to do this?

Its not much of a stretch to say teaching implies authority and teaching God's Word certainly acknowledges real authority. I just don't understand the pragmatic reasoning in this thread. Sure there are lots of women who are exercising authority within the church by teaching and they are not going away but that does not make what they are doing biblical either. There is no way you can divorce teaching from authority.

sw

Hi "Sw"

In Romans 16 we have Phebe, Priscilla, Mary Junia, Tryphosa, Persis, all female names, women mentioned as laborers in the gospel.

In Phil. 4:2-3 we have Euodias and Syntyche, two women who are mentioned as leaders in the local church at Philippi. They are refered to as "those WOMEN which labored with me in the Gospel."

Paul himself states many times these women laboured in the gospel with him. These women were teachers as was Paul, they taught along side Paul. Teachers, but there is never any mention of them ever being in authority over any men, or over Paul.

Being able to teach a man who knows nothing about God, all about God, does not give the teacher any authority over the man being taught.

If I were a Bible expert, male or female, and a King, or President of a powerful nation asked me to teach him about God, would that give me the authority to tell him what he can, should, or should not do?

Labored does not mean to teach.

sw

It's an interesting point... what does "labored" mean, in this context, in your opinion?

[st. Worm]

Being a teacher does not make one in authority over the one being taught.

If the preacher/teacher is female, and she is married, she will love and respect and obey her husband as he will her. He will love, guide, protect and praise her name and thank God for her for ever more! She may know more than her husband, as my wife or anothers may know more than we do, but she will not, and does not userp her husbands authority over her or their houshold. Another example;

If, lets say I am a divisional manager of a large corperation, As manager, know everything about the company business, and I am sent to the company organized yearly convention to be updated on the latest stratergy plan, and the speaker is a woman? sent by the corporate director of the said company, to teach me and others on what was required. As my teacher in this matter, would that give her authority over me a divisional manager?? No! All she knows is the latest stragerty of the company, and she is to pass that information on. And neither would she want authority over me and take on all my responsobilities. All she would be doing is tell me, preach to me, teach me and others of what is required and expected of me by the BOSS!

Put God in the bosses position, God sends who He will, and many are women, as Scripture shows in another thread on this board, which some men cannot come to grips with, to teach, preach, as is recorded in Scripture, DOES NOT MAKE THEM IN ANY WAY, IN AUTHORITY OVER MEN! God does not say they are in authority does He? GOD, through the apostles say women are not to be in authority, and neither do they want to be. If they can, and do teach men of the things of God, what is wrong with that, especially if God empowers them to do this?

Its not much of a stretch to say teaching implies authority and teaching God's Word certainly acknowledges real authority. I just don't understand the pragmatic reasoning in this thread. Sure there are lots of women who are exercising authority within the church by teaching and they are not going away but that does not make what they are doing biblical either. There is no way you can divorce teaching from authority.

sw

Hi "Sw"

In Romans 16 we have Phebe, Priscilla, Mary Junia, Tryphosa, Persis, all female names, women mentioned as laborers in the gospel.

In Phil. 4:2-3 we have Euodias and Syntyche, two women who are mentioned as leaders in the local church at Philippi. They are refered to as "those WOMEN which labored with me in the Gospel."

Paul himself states many times these women laboured in the gospel with him. These women were teachers as was Paul, they taught along side Paul. Teachers, but there is never any mention of them ever being in authority over any men, or over Paul.

Being able to teach a man who knows nothing about God, all about God, does not give the teacher any authority over the man being taught.

If I were a Bible expert, male or female, and a King, or President of a powerful nation asked me to teach him about God, would that give me the authority to tell him what he can, should, or should not do?

Labored does not mean to teach.

sw

It's an interesting point... what does "labored" mean, in this context, in your opinion?

Paul obviously thought very highly of them so we can assume they were dedicated to assisting him in his ministry in some way. Perhaps they taught other women or even children. Perhaps they performed other tasks of service and labor. Its just speculation since we are not really told.

sw

[patricia1]

Being a teacher does not make one in authority over the one being taught.

If the preacher/teacher is female, and she is married, she will love and respect and obey her husband as he will her. He will love, guide, protect and praise her name and thank God for her for ever more! She may know more than her husband, as my wife or anothers may know more than we do, but she will not, and does not userp her husbands authority over her or their houshold. Another example;

If, lets say I am a divisional manager of a large corperation, As manager, know everything about the company business, and I am sent to the company organized yearly convention to be updated on the latest stratergy plan, and the speaker is a woman? sent by the corporate director of the said company, to teach me and others on what was required. As my teacher in this matter, would that give her authority over me a divisional manager?? No! All she knows is the latest stragerty of the company, and she is to pass that information on. And neither would she want authority over me and take on all my responsobilities. All she would be doing is tell me, preach to me, teach me and others of what is required and expected of me by the BOSS!

Put God in the bosses position, God sends who He will, and many are women, as Scripture shows in another thread on this board, which some men cannot come to grips with, to teach, preach, as is recorded in Scripture, DOES NOT MAKE THEM IN ANY WAY, IN AUTHORITY OVER MEN! God does not say they are in authority does He? GOD, through the apostles say women are not to be in authority, and neither do they want to be. If they can, and do teach men of the things of God, what is wrong with that, especially if God empowers them to do this?

Its not much of a stretch to say teaching implies authority and teaching God's Word certainly acknowledges real authority. I just don't understand the pragmatic reasoning in this thread. Sure there are lots of women who are exercising authority within the church by teaching and they are not going away but that does not make what they are doing biblical either. There is no way you can divorce teaching from authority.

sw

Hi "Sw"

In Romans 16 we have Phebe, Priscilla, Mary Junia, Tryphosa, Persis, all female names, women mentioned as laborers in the gospel.

In Phil. 4:2-3 we have Euodias and Syntyche, two women who are mentioned as leaders in the local church at Philippi. They are refered to as "those WOMEN which labored with me in the Gospel."

Paul himself states many times these women laboured in the gospel with him. These women were teachers as was Paul, they taught along side Paul. Teachers, but there is never any mention of them ever being in authority over any men, or over Paul.

Being able to teach a man who knows nothing about God, all about God, does not give the teacher any authority over the man being taught.

If I were a Bible expert, male or female, and a King, or President of a powerful nation asked me to teach him about God, would that give me the authority to tell him what he can, should, or should not do?

Labored does not mean to teach.

sw

It's an interesting point... what does "labored" mean, in this context, in your opinion?

they certainly weren't sewing tents or gleaning

[rtwo]

Being a teacher does not make one in authority over the one being taught.

If the preacher/teacher is female, and she is married, she will love and respect and obey her husband as he will her. He will love, guide, protect and praise her name and thank God for her for ever more! She may know more than her husband, as my wife or anothers may know more than we do, but she will not, and does not userp her husbands authority over her or their houshold. Another example;

If, lets say I am a divisional manager of a large corperation, As manager, know everything about the company business, and I am sent to the company organized yearly convention to be updated on the latest stratergy plan, and the speaker is a woman? sent by the corporate director of the said company, to teach me and others on what was required. As my teacher in this matter, would that give her authority over me a divisional manager?? No! All she knows is the latest stragerty of the company, and she is to pass that information on. And neither would she want authority over me and take on all my responsobilities. All she would be doing is tell me, preach to me, teach me and others of what is required and expected of me by the BOSS!

Put God in the bosses position, God sends who He will, and many are women, as Scripture shows in another thread on this board, which some men cannot come to grips with, to teach, preach, as is recorded in Scripture, DOES NOT MAKE THEM IN ANY WAY, IN AUTHORITY OVER MEN! God does not say they are in authority does He? GOD, through the apostles say women are not to be in authority, and neither do they want to be. If they can, and do teach men of the things of God, what is wrong with that, especially if God empowers them to do this?

Its not much of a stretch to say teaching implies authority and teaching God's Word certainly acknowledges real authority. I just don't understand the pragmatic reasoning in this thread. Sure there are lots of women who are exercising authority within the church by teaching and they are not going away but that does not make what they are doing biblical either. There is no way you can divorce teaching from authority.

sw

Hi "Sw"

In Romans 16 we have Phebe, Priscilla, Mary Junia, Tryphosa, Persis, all female names, women mentioned as laborers in the gospel.

In Phil. 4:2-3 we have Euodias and Syntyche, two women who are mentioned as leaders in the local church at Philippi. They are refered to as "those WOMEN which labored with me in the Gospel."

Paul himself states many times these women laboured in the gospel with him. These women were teachers as was Paul, they taught along side Paul. Teachers, but there is never any mention of them ever being in authority over any men, or over Paul.

Being able to teach a man who knows nothing about God, all about God, does not give the teacher any authority over the man being taught.

If I were a Bible expert, male or female, and a King, or President of a powerful nation asked me to teach him about God, would that give me the authority to tell him what he can, should, or should not do?

Labored does not mean to teach.

sw

It's an interesting point... what does "labored" mean, in this context, in your opinion?

Paul obviously thought very highly of them so we can assume they were dedicated to assisting him in his ministry in some way. Perhaps they taught other women or even children. Perhaps they performed other tasks of service and labor. Its just speculation since we are not really told.

sw

So, in fairness, then, your assertion that "labored does not mean to teach", no matter how strongly worded, is also speculation, yes?

[st. Worm]

Being a teacher does not make one in authority over the one being taught.

If the preacher/teacher is female, and she is married, she will love and respect and obey her husband as he will her. He will love, guide, protect and praise her name and thank God for her for ever more! She may know more than her husband, as my wife or anothers may know more than we do, but she will not, and does not userp her husbands authority over her or their houshold. Another example;

If, lets say I am a divisional manager of a large corperation, As manager, know everything about the company business, and I am sent to the company organized yearly convention to be updated on the latest stratergy plan, and the speaker is a woman? sent by the corporate director of the said company, to teach me and others on what was required. As my teacher in this matter, would that give her authority over me a divisional manager?? No! All she knows is the latest stragerty of the company, and she is to pass that information on. And neither would she want authority over me and take on all my responsobilities. All she would be doing is tell me, preach to me, teach me and others of what is required and expected of me by the BOSS!

Put God in the bosses position, God sends who He will, and many are women, as Scripture shows in another thread on this board, which some men cannot come to grips with, to teach, preach, as is recorded in Scripture, DOES NOT MAKE THEM IN ANY WAY, IN AUTHORITY OVER MEN! God does not say they are in authority does He? GOD, through the apostles say women are not to be in authority, and neither do they want to be. If they can, and do teach men of the things of God, what is wrong with that, especially if God empowers them to do this?

Its not much of a stretch to say teaching implies authority and teaching God's Word certainly acknowledges real authority. I just don't understand the pragmatic reasoning in this thread. Sure there are lots of women who are exercising authority within the church by teaching and they are not going away but that does not make what they are doing biblical either. There is no way you can divorce teaching from authority.

sw

Hi "Sw"

In Romans 16 we have Phebe, Priscilla, Mary Junia, Tryphosa, Persis, all female names, women mentioned as laborers in the gospel.

In Phil. 4:2-3 we have Euodias and Syntyche, two women who are mentioned as leaders in the local church at Philippi. They are refered to as "those WOMEN which labored with me in the Gospel."

Paul himself states many times these women laboured in the gospel with him. These women were teachers as was Paul, they taught along side Paul. Teachers, but there is never any mention of them ever being in authority over any men, or over Paul.

Being able to teach a man who knows nothing about God, all about God, does not give the teacher any authority over the man being taught.

If I were a Bible expert, male or female, and a King, or President of a powerful nation asked me to teach him about God, would that give me the authority to tell him what he can, should, or should not do?

Labored does not mean to teach.

sw

It's an interesting point... what does "labored" mean, in this context, in your opinion?

they certainly weren't sewing tents or gleaning

Actually they may well have been doing that. Or perhaps they were baking cookies.