Naming the Name of Christ

[st. Worm]

2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless, God's solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: "The Lord knows those who are his," and, "Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness." 20 In a large house there are articles not only of gold and silver, but also of wood and clay; some are for noble purposes and some for ignoble. 21 If a man cleanses himself from the latter, he will be an instrument for noble purposes, made holy, useful to the Master and prepared to do any good work.

22 Flee the evil desires of youth, and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, along with those who call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

In His Love,

Suzanne

But, what about being "Born Again"? And a "new creation" in Christ Jesus?

Mark 2:22 And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins, and both the wine and the wineskins will be ruined. No, he pours new wine into new wineskins."

Romans 6:4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

Ro 7:6 -

But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

1Co 5:7 -

Get rid of the old yeast that you may be a new batch without yeast--as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed.

2 Cor. 5:17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!

Ga 6:15 -

Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is a new creation.

In His Love,

Suzanne

I am merely pointing out Scripture.

Which seems obvious in It's meaning.

Ga 6:15 -

Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is a new creation.

It is a circumcision of the heart.

Eph. 2:11 In him you were also circumcised, in the putting off of the sinful nature, not with a circumcision done by the hands of men but with the circumcision done by Christ,

In His Love,

Suzanne

In His Love,

Suzanne

Romans 1:27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. 28 Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31 they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.

Matthew 15:19 For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander.

Galatians 5:19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery;

Eph 5:3 But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God's holy people.

Jude 1:7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.

Hebrews 4:14 Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has gone through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. 15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are--yet was without sin. 16 Let us then approach the throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.

1 Cor. 10:13 No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it.

In His Love,

Suzanne

John 3:19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God."

In His Love,

Suzanne

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. 12 It teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, 13 while we wait for the blessed hope--the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.

15 These, then, are the things you should teach. Encourage and rebuke with all authority. Do not let anyone despise you.

In His Love,

Suzanne

So, is the general consensus that you do not believe the Scriptures? I always find it interesting when the majority would rather walk in gray than the obvious. Why do you not encourage/promote/teach what is written?

In His Love,

Suzanne

Perhaps it would be helpful if you would address who you are asking your question to. I would hate to answer a question you aren't asking.

sw

[Guest Biblicist]

I guess you could use the same question for every sin.

Can a liar be a Christian?

Can an adulterer be a Christian?

Can a fornicator be a Christian?

Can I be a Christian?

Homosexuality is no worse than any other sin. It is not an unforgiveable sin. It's sin, just like the sins we all face daily.

If we are truly new creations then we would/should not sin at all anymore?

Instead, God's word tells us that salvation is work

Ephesians 4:21 Surely you heard of him and were taught in him in accordance with the truth that is in Jesus. 22You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; 23to be made new in the attitude of your minds;

Romans 12:2 Do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is

[tsth]

It's not instantanious, it is something that needs work. Like a fine piece of art or tapestry. Rome wasn't built in a day, neither are we.

So, wouldn't it be more profitable/edifying to teach from the passages I posted? Why walk in gray?

I never understand WHY there is always opposition to these teachings? Why would we want to go any other direction? These things are profitable and good.

In His Love,

Suzanne

[st. Worm]

It's not instantanious, it is something that needs work. Like a fine piece of art or tapestry. Rome wasn't built in a day, neither are we.

So, wouldn't it be more profitable/edifying to teach from the passages I posted? Why walk in gray?

I never understand WHY there is always opposition to these teachings? Why would we want to go any other direction? These things are profitable and good.

In His Love,

Suzanne

But none of the passages you posted indicate Christians are not still practical sinners. The Apostle called himself the chief of sinners and lamented he did not do what he should and did what he should not. Of course the Spirit helps us in our fight with sin but our sinful nature is still with us and as Luther wisely noted we are simultaneously saint and sinner even as we are counted righteous for Christ's sake. The justified homosexual is not justified because he no longer sins. He is counted just only by faith in Christ. He struggles with that sin and many other ones too. Like I said, if a believer does not believe he is a sinner he likely is not a believer. I believe it was church father Jerome who said we are never more righteous than when we confess our sins. The confessing repentant tax collector went away justified, not the Pharisee who saw himself as better than others.

sw

[Floatingaxe]

I guess you could use the same question for every sin.

Can a liar be a Christian?

Can an adulterer be a Christian?

Can a fornicator be a Christian?

Can I be a Christian?

I suppose we must speak now of the fact that many "Christians" will find themselves outside the gates. That is the reality we shall see. So sad.

[tsth]

But none of the passages you posted indicate Christians are not still practical sinners. The Apostle called himself the chief of sinners and lamented he did not do what he should and did what he should not.

Many people seemingly misquote those passages regarding Paul. He was speaking of life BEFORE walking in the Spirit and then if you note in your Bible the next portion describes the NEW CREATION in Christ Jesus.

If you notice, Romans 7 is about "Struggling with Sin" and then goes directly into Chapter 8 which is about NEW LIFE THROUGH THE SPIRIT. Again, in agreement with ALL the previous passages I posted, these are the passages from Paul in Chapter 8, regarding a NEW LIFE:

Romans 8:5 Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6 The mind of sinful man is death, but the mind controlled by the Spirit is life and peace; 7 the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so. 8 Those controlled by the sinful nature cannot please God. 9 You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.

12 Therefore, brothers, we have an obligation--but it is not to the sinful nature, to live according to it. 13 For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live, 14 because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. 15 For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship. And by him we cry, "Abba, Father." 16 The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God's children.

So, again, I ask, why would we want to encourage anything else?

In His Love,

Suzanne

[tsth]

I guess you could use the same question for every sin.

Can a liar be a Christian?

Can an adulterer be a Christian?

Can a fornicator be a Christian?

Can I be a Christian?

I suppose we must speak now of the fact that many "Christians" will find themselves outside the gates. That is the reality we shall see. So sad.

Lord, Lord!??? (Matthew 7:21)

In His Love,

Suzanne

[st. Worm]

But none of the passages you posted indicate Christians are not still practical sinners. The Apostle called himself the chief of sinners and lamented he did not do what he should and did what he should not.

Many people seemingly misquote those passages regarding Paul. He was speaking of life BEFORE walking in the Spirit and then if you note in your Bible the next portion describes the NEW CREATION in Christ Jesus.

If you notice, Romans 7 is about "Struggling with Sin" and then goes directly into Chapter 8 which is about NEW LIFE THROUGH THE SPIRIT. Again, in agreement with ALL the previous passages I posted, these are the passages from Paul in Chapter 8, regarding a NEW LIFE:

Romans 8:5 Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6 The mind of sinful man is death, but the mind controlled by the Spirit is life and peace; 7 the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so. 8 Those controlled by the sinful nature cannot please God. 9 You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.

12 Therefore, brothers, we have an obligation--but it is not to the sinful nature, to live according to it. 13 For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live, 14 because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. 15 For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the Spirit of sonship. And by him we cry, "Abba, Father." 16 The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God's children.

So, again, I ask, why would we want to encourage anything else?

In His Love,

Suzanne

Paul was clearing speaking of his life in the present following his conversion. I have seen some spinning before but this may take the cake. You would have to completely change the tense he is speaking in throughout the passage in both examples I gave to arrive at your conclusion. Read Romans 7 more carefully. Read it according to the words as they are and not as you want them to be. He is not talking about his past but his ongoing struggles with the flesh yet while the new inner man delights in the law. Our new life is hidden in Christ. Paul knew the battle with sin continues in this life. The Perfectionist movement is a very serious distortion of God's word and fails to understand either the gospel or the law.

sw

[tsth]

I find it interesting that much of your contention is with the Scriptures, as that was probably 95% of my postings with regard to this topic. And yet, you are willing to tag me as delusional?

Again, I will stand on the Words of The Most High God:

2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless, God's solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: "The Lord knows those who are his," and, "Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness." 20 In a large house there are articles not only of gold and silver, but also of wood and clay; some are for noble purposes and some for ignoble. 21 If a man cleanses himself from the latter, he will be an instrument for noble purposes, made holy, useful to the Master and prepared to do any good work.

22 Flee the evil desires of youth, and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, along with those who call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

In His Love,

Suzanne

But, what about being "Born Again"? And a "new creation" in Christ Jesus?

Mark 2:22 And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins, and both the wine and the wineskins will be ruined. No, he pours new wine into new wineskins."

Romans 6:4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

Ro 7:6 -

But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

1Co 5:7 -

Get rid of the old yeast that you may be a new batch without yeast--as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed.

2 Cor. 5:17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!

Ga 6:15 -

Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is a new creation.

In His Love,

Suzanne

I am merely pointing out Scripture.

Which seems obvious in It's meaning.

Ga 6:15 -

Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is a new creation.

It is a circumcision of the heart.

Eph. 2:11 In him you were also circumcised, in the putting off of the sinful nature, not with a circumcision done by the hands of men but with the circumcision done by Christ,

In His Love,

Suzanne

In His Love,

Suzanne

Romans 1:27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. 28 Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31 they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.

Matthew 15:19 For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander.

Galatians 5:19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery;

Eph 5:3 But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God's holy people.

Jude 1:7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.

Hebrews 4:14 Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has gone through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. 15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are--yet was without sin. 16 Let us then approach the throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.

1 Cor. 10:13 No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it.

In His Love,

Suzanne

John 3:19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God."

In His Love,

Suzanne

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. 12 It teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, 13 while we wait for the blessed hope--the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.

15 These, then, are the things you should teach. Encourage and rebuke with all authority. Do not let anyone despise you.

In His Love,

Suzanne

So, is the general consensus that you do not believe the Scriptures? I always find it interesting when the majority would rather walk in gray than the obvious. Why do you not encourage/promote/teach what is written?

In His Love,

Suzanne

[st. Worm]

I find it interesting that much of your contention is with the Scriptures, as that was probably 95% of my postings with regard to this topic. And yet, you are willing to tag me as delusional?

Again, I will stand on the Words of The Most High God:

2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless, God's solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: "The Lord knows those who are his," and, "Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness." 20 In a large house there are articles not only of gold and silver, but also of wood and clay; some are for noble purposes and some for ignoble. 21 If a man cleanses himself from the latter, he will be an instrument for noble purposes, made holy, useful to the Master and prepared to do any good work.

22 Flee the evil desires of youth, and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, along with those who call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

In His Love,

Suzanne

But, what about being "Born Again"? And a "new creation" in Christ Jesus?

Mark 2:22 And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins, and both the wine and the wineskins will be ruined. No, he pours new wine into new wineskins."

Romans 6:4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

Ro 7:6 -

But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

1Co 5:7 -

Get rid of the old yeast that you may be a new batch without yeast--as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed.

2 Cor. 5:17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!

Ga 6:15 -

Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is a new creation.

In His Love,

Suzanne

I am merely pointing out Scripture.

Which seems obvious in It's meaning.

Ga 6:15 -

Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is a new creation.

It is a circumcision of the heart.

Eph. 2:11 In him you were also circumcised, in the putting off of the sinful nature, not with a circumcision done by the hands of men but with the circumcision done by Christ,

In His Love,

Suzanne

In His Love,

Suzanne

Romans 1:27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. 28 Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31 they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.

Matthew 15:19 For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander.

Galatians 5:19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery;

Eph 5:3 But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God's holy people.

Jude 1:7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.

Hebrews 4:14 Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has gone through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. 15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are--yet was without sin. 16 Let us then approach the throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.

1 Cor. 10:13 No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it.

In His Love,

Suzanne

John 3:19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God."

In His Love,

Suzanne

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. 12 It teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, 13 while we wait for the blessed hope--the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.

15 These, then, are the things you should teach. Encourage and rebuke with all authority. Do not let anyone despise you.

In His Love,

Suzanne

So, is the general consensus that you do not believe the Scriptures? I always find it interesting when the majority would rather walk in gray than the obvious. Why do you not encourage/promote/teach what is written?

In His Love,

Suzanne

You can post the entire Bible if you want but when you twist the meaning of the verses it doesn't matter. Why not post Romans 7 so we can see how you misinterpreted that by arbitrarily changing the tense that Paul was writing in.

sw